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I thought I would start a separate thread on the situation in Ukraine as several of the other related threads are getting a bit fractious and have long since deviated from the original question.
That isn't a criticism: it's human nature and shows we're free to argue.
This man was miraculously pulled from his car in Obolon (N Kyiv) after it was steamrollered by a Russian tank. The "denazification" process continues (!)
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War News Part 2
War News Part Three
War News Part 4
I thought I would start a separate thread on the situation in Ukraine as several of the other related threads are getting a bit fractious and have long since deviated from the original question.
That isn't a criticism: it's human nature and shows we're free to argue.
This man was miraculously pulled from his car in Obolon (N Kyiv) after it was steamrollered by a Russian tank. The "denazification" process continues (!)
https:/
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Ich. I've just read that the UK is turning away, in Paris, Ukrainians who want to join family in the UK.
This is because they don't have a visa. Do you know if this is true?
Ireland has done away with the need for a visa and Ukrainians are arriving here to be with family. Has the UK not done this do you know?
This is because they don't have a visa. Do you know if this is true?
Ireland has done away with the need for a visa and Ukrainians are arriving here to be with family. Has the UK not done this do you know?
the immigration minister has suggested there might be opportunities for them here as fruit pickers, gness
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They'd have to go home after the harvest is over, no doubt.
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They'd have to go home after the harvest is over, no doubt.
“Answer
Ich. I've just read that the UK is turning away, in Paris, Ukrainians who want to join family in the UK.
This is because they don't have a visa. Do you know if this is true?
”
Yes I saw something about this on the news. Something about the border checkpoints being in France, not the UK.
I didn’t totally follow.
They also interviewed a woman whose mother had come from Kharkiv but didn’t qualify for a visa as she wasn’t a dependent (her poor mother really didn’t want to come to the UK. She speaks no
English and wants to go home to Kharkiv. So sad), I trust this will get sorted. What with the fruit picking comments, some of this has been embarrassing
Ich. I've just read that the UK is turning away, in Paris, Ukrainians who want to join family in the UK.
This is because they don't have a visa. Do you know if this is true?
”
Yes I saw something about this on the news. Something about the border checkpoints being in France, not the UK.
I didn’t totally follow.
They also interviewed a woman whose mother had come from Kharkiv but didn’t qualify for a visa as she wasn’t a dependent (her poor mother really didn’t want to come to the UK. She speaks no
English and wants to go home to Kharkiv. So sad), I trust this will get sorted. What with the fruit picking comments, some of this has been embarrassing
"Johnson falls short again.....well no surprise there."
Seems he's not alone.
///The Irish authorities have done themselves some credit by waiving visa requirements for Ukrainians joining family here as they flee the horrors of war.///
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Seems he's not alone.
///The Irish authorities have done themselves some credit by waiving visa requirements for Ukrainians joining family here as they flee the horrors of war.///
https:/
Quite a lot has changed in even the last 24 hours, with countries regularly shifting their positions ever-closer towards effectively unconditional support for Ukrainians. In that sense, I don't think that the present UK position, restricting passage from Ukraine to only those who have immediate family connections, will last very long.
A lot also depends of course on how long the War drags on. Assuming peace talks fail, which I fear is likely, then the situation will get more desperate still for Ukrainian citizens. But, in general, I think the UK's been at the forefront of Ukrainian support, diplomatically and militarily. I think it will change on this too in the next few days.
A lot also depends of course on how long the War drags on. Assuming peace talks fail, which I fear is likely, then the situation will get more desperate still for Ukrainian citizens. But, in general, I think the UK's been at the forefront of Ukrainian support, diplomatically and militarily. I think it will change on this too in the next few days.
"Assuming peace talks fail, which I fear is likely"
That's a nailed-on certainty. Apparently the Russians are sending Medinsky, who's a bit of a dead loss all round. That probably is not a hiopeful sign they think there's a chance either.
Zelensky is now going to mobilise prisoners (Ukrainian ones!)
That's a nailed-on certainty. Apparently the Russians are sending Medinsky, who's a bit of a dead loss all round. That probably is not a hiopeful sign they think there's a chance either.
Zelensky is now going to mobilise prisoners (Ukrainian ones!)
Which bit don't you agree with? The second, presumably -- but, if not, why not?
I can agree that if the Russian military pulls back unconditionally within the next week, then one can argue that such universal entry conditions for refugees would become unnecessary, and it would be better instead to pump money into Ukraine to help it rebuild. On the other hand, I think the changes of Russia pulling out so quickly are unlikely at the moment, since it would be tantamount to admitting a defeat for Putin, and as I have expressed elsewhere, such a humiliation would be the end of him. Therefore what's more likely is that the war drags on -- and, since nothing short of victory would satisfy Putin, that would lead to increasing numbers of Ukrainians being displaced. In that scenario, why would the UK wish to continue to restrict Ukrainian refugees from entering without a pre-existing immediate family connection? It would be unsustainable to justify this. Especially when the EU has already agreed to unconditional entry for Ukrainians for the next three years.
I can agree that if the Russian military pulls back unconditionally within the next week, then one can argue that such universal entry conditions for refugees would become unnecessary, and it would be better instead to pump money into Ukraine to help it rebuild. On the other hand, I think the changes of Russia pulling out so quickly are unlikely at the moment, since it would be tantamount to admitting a defeat for Putin, and as I have expressed elsewhere, such a humiliation would be the end of him. Therefore what's more likely is that the war drags on -- and, since nothing short of victory would satisfy Putin, that would lead to increasing numbers of Ukrainians being displaced. In that scenario, why would the UK wish to continue to restrict Ukrainian refugees from entering without a pre-existing immediate family connection? It would be unsustainable to justify this. Especially when the EU has already agreed to unconditional entry for Ukrainians for the next three years.
Jim, I don’t agree that the UK's position at the forefront will change.
//Especially when the EU has already agreed to unconditional entry for Ukrainians for the next three years.//
That's either untrue or Ireland is rebelling because they're certainly not offering that option. See my link at 09:13 Mon.
//Especially when the EU has already agreed to unconditional entry for Ukrainians for the next three years.//
That's either untrue or Ireland is rebelling because they're certainly not offering that option. See my link at 09:13 Mon.
The situation is very concerning.
I think it is looking increasingly clear that Russia's invasion has stalled in many places. In some respects their failure would be seen as comical were it the time for making jokes. I saw a film of some unarmed civilians near Zaporizhzhya, in the SE, shouting at a Russian tank and effectively chasing it away.
Russia may have superior manpower but that manpower plainly is no match for Ukraine's. Their poor troops have been lied to about why they are there, and I think have been completely taken aback by the situation. They do of course have elite special forces but they are encountering the same problems.
Of course they will keep coming, but presumably the ones coming after are even less well trained or briefed.
But the big worry is Russia's superior weaponry and how much of it Putin is prepared to use.
I think it is looking increasingly clear that Russia's invasion has stalled in many places. In some respects their failure would be seen as comical were it the time for making jokes. I saw a film of some unarmed civilians near Zaporizhzhya, in the SE, shouting at a Russian tank and effectively chasing it away.
Russia may have superior manpower but that manpower plainly is no match for Ukraine's. Their poor troops have been lied to about why they are there, and I think have been completely taken aback by the situation. They do of course have elite special forces but they are encountering the same problems.
Of course they will keep coming, but presumably the ones coming after are even less well trained or briefed.
But the big worry is Russia's superior weaponry and how much of it Putin is prepared to use.
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