News1 min ago
Should The Verses Of The Koran Calling For The 'murder And Punishment Of Jews, Christians And Disbelievers' Be Removed?
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no burn them all and call it Koran-nacht
which verses are those AOG ?
thre are other verses saying the people of the book ( ahl - al- kitab ) should be left alone ( the book here being the Bible ) - do they go as well ?
and yeah in 1936 was the bible that was gonna be used for Edward VIII coronation have the commandment "Thou shalt not commit adultery" - excised or politely coverd because Wallis had "three husbands all of the living" ?
and yeah the verse - what god has joined let no man put asunder ( the stricture against divorce ) added to that it now read, " what God had joined let no man put asunder except at Ipswich County Court" ?
yeah good questions - what are your answers ?
which verses are those AOG ?
thre are other verses saying the people of the book ( ahl - al- kitab ) should be left alone ( the book here being the Bible ) - do they go as well ?
and yeah in 1936 was the bible that was gonna be used for Edward VIII coronation have the commandment "Thou shalt not commit adultery" - excised or politely coverd because Wallis had "three husbands all of the living" ?
and yeah the verse - what god has joined let no man put asunder ( the stricture against divorce ) added to that it now read, " what God had joined let no man put asunder except at Ipswich County Court" ?
yeah good questions - what are your answers ?
No - but the notion can be relied on to stir up fear and loathing on both sides, and sell some newspapers, so a result all round.
I don't see any calls to censor the bible, when it asks that people pull out their eyes and cut of their hands, and similar gruesome instructions.
Freedom of speech is a very important concept, and part of the price that we pay for it is the right for various fools to say foolish things.
I don't see any calls to censor the bible, when it asks that people pull out their eyes and cut of their hands, and similar gruesome instructions.
Freedom of speech is a very important concept, and part of the price that we pay for it is the right for various fools to say foolish things.
andy-hughes, //I don't see any calls to censor the bible, when it asks that people pull out their eyes and cut of their hands, and similar gruesome instructions. //
Since the Koran is considered to be beyond criticism and the worst of it acted upon by some, it bears no comparison whatsoever to the bible.
Since the Koran is considered to be beyond criticism and the worst of it acted upon by some, it bears no comparison whatsoever to the bible.
Maggiebee "...It is a historical document and you can't change history."
Are you suggesting the content describes history or that the book itself is historic because it's old?
If it's the former, you're wrong. The content bears as much resemblance to historical fact as Goldilocks and the Three Bears does.
Are you suggesting the content describes history or that the book itself is historic because it's old?
If it's the former, you're wrong. The content bears as much resemblance to historical fact as Goldilocks and the Three Bears does.
"Should they be removed?".
No, for the reasons already given. Also, if you took out all the verses which talk about the unbelievers, how much Allah hates them and what Allah's got in store for them, then you'd have reduced the Koran to half its size.
Not that this could happen anyway because the act would be blasphemous: according to all branches of Islam the Koran is the literal word of God, is immutable and has existed in Heaven for all eternity. So there is no tradition in Islamic scholarship of textual analysis corresponding to the "higher criticism" of Biblical texts which started in Germany in the 19th century. Isn't that so, Monsieur Pédant?
Have all the other posters read the article and understand the reasons for the "manifesto", I wonder?
"The letter ... said that since 2006, '11 Jews have been assassinated - and some tortured - by radical Islamists because they were Jewish'.
The latest attack rocked France in March when two perpetrators stabbed 85-year-old Jewish woman Mireille Knoll 11 times before setting her body on fire...
The number of anti-Semitic crimes fell in France in 2017 for a third year running, according to the interior ministry, down seven percent. But Jews [account for] a third of France's recorded hate crimes despite making up only about 0.7 per cent of the population.
The half-a-million-plus Jewish community...has been hit by a wave of emigration to Israel in the past two decades, partly due to anti-Semitism in immigrant neighbourhoods.".
That's the background, and nothing to do with France in particular: wherever you have large numbers of Muslims you'll get hatred directed against Jews. Understanding this doesn't need any theological grasp, or a degree in comparative religion. All this stuff about interpretation and what this or that holy book says is smoke and mirrors used to pretend that a fascist ideology - Islam - is a cuddly bear religion just like the Vicar of Dibley's Christianity (even if - regrettably - with a few more outlying nutters than your typical teddy religion).
If you want an explanation of this hatred don't read the Koran (all that says is "God hates them, so should you"); instead read the life of Mohammed - the "perfect" man - and his dealings with the Jewish communities in Arabia (especially the tribes in Medina).
Oh, almost forgot:
"Jews, remember Khaybar!"
No, for the reasons already given. Also, if you took out all the verses which talk about the unbelievers, how much Allah hates them and what Allah's got in store for them, then you'd have reduced the Koran to half its size.
Not that this could happen anyway because the act would be blasphemous: according to all branches of Islam the Koran is the literal word of God, is immutable and has existed in Heaven for all eternity. So there is no tradition in Islamic scholarship of textual analysis corresponding to the "higher criticism" of Biblical texts which started in Germany in the 19th century. Isn't that so, Monsieur Pédant?
Have all the other posters read the article and understand the reasons for the "manifesto", I wonder?
"The letter ... said that since 2006, '11 Jews have been assassinated - and some tortured - by radical Islamists because they were Jewish'.
The latest attack rocked France in March when two perpetrators stabbed 85-year-old Jewish woman Mireille Knoll 11 times before setting her body on fire...
The number of anti-Semitic crimes fell in France in 2017 for a third year running, according to the interior ministry, down seven percent. But Jews [account for] a third of France's recorded hate crimes despite making up only about 0.7 per cent of the population.
The half-a-million-plus Jewish community...has been hit by a wave of emigration to Israel in the past two decades, partly due to anti-Semitism in immigrant neighbourhoods.".
That's the background, and nothing to do with France in particular: wherever you have large numbers of Muslims you'll get hatred directed against Jews. Understanding this doesn't need any theological grasp, or a degree in comparative religion. All this stuff about interpretation and what this or that holy book says is smoke and mirrors used to pretend that a fascist ideology - Islam - is a cuddly bear religion just like the Vicar of Dibley's Christianity (even if - regrettably - with a few more outlying nutters than your typical teddy religion).
If you want an explanation of this hatred don't read the Koran (all that says is "God hates them, so should you"); instead read the life of Mohammed - the "perfect" man - and his dealings with the Jewish communities in Arabia (especially the tribes in Medina).
Oh, almost forgot:
"Jews, remember Khaybar!"
The simple fact is, some people like to hurt and kill other people. At one end of the scale they are simply nasty horrible self-hating wonks, and at the other end, they are psychopaths who are unable to feel any sympathy for, and empathy with their victims.
Now some people simple go about their ghastly business on their own, ploughing a lone furrow, and getting on with what they do until they are caught, or they die, whichever comes first.
But some have the herd mentality, they want to be in a gang, so they hang their dreadful behaviour on a religion of one sort or another, and find relevant tracts in its writings that can be shoehorned into something that they believe supports their actions.
So removing said tracts won't stop this behaviour, it is inbuilt, and the religious aspect is simply a prop, a crutch, something to lean on to make themselves feel justified in their towering self-righteousness, they can quote buts to each other to underline their self-belief in what they are doing.
Not everyone needs an excuse to be horribly violent to complete strangers, but for those who do, a quick scan of the 'holy book' will help them get a night's sleep, or give them a sense of belonging when they all shout out bits in unison.
Removing religious doctrine, in an ideal world, would cancel out the support for a proportion of deeply disturbed individuals, but it would never ever stop all of them.
Now some people simple go about their ghastly business on their own, ploughing a lone furrow, and getting on with what they do until they are caught, or they die, whichever comes first.
But some have the herd mentality, they want to be in a gang, so they hang their dreadful behaviour on a religion of one sort or another, and find relevant tracts in its writings that can be shoehorned into something that they believe supports their actions.
So removing said tracts won't stop this behaviour, it is inbuilt, and the religious aspect is simply a prop, a crutch, something to lean on to make themselves feel justified in their towering self-righteousness, they can quote buts to each other to underline their self-belief in what they are doing.
Not everyone needs an excuse to be horribly violent to complete strangers, but for those who do, a quick scan of the 'holy book' will help them get a night's sleep, or give them a sense of belonging when they all shout out bits in unison.
Removing religious doctrine, in an ideal world, would cancel out the support for a proportion of deeply disturbed individuals, but it would never ever stop all of them.
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