France Again

[-Talbot-]

http://news.sky.com/story/attack-in-nice-30-dead-as-truck-hits-crowd-10502068

[Old_Geezer]

Many ancient religions were like that once but they gradually get enlightened. There are many who do not subscribe to the picture you paint and yet you paint them all with the same brush.

There is no serious action one can take against a whole religion when it is integrated into one's own society so trying to build higher barriers/segregation is counterproductive.

One needs to deal with those with warped minds, and try to ensure no further generation gets warped, not simply suggest a whole group is somehow 'dealt with' by whatever you have to suggest. Problems are not solved by pushing all into the same corner and trying to put them out of sight somehow.

[retrocop]

naomi
Were you approached first for Boris's job? :-)
Certainly no howls from me either.

[naomi24]

OG, did you read what I said? Islam means ‘submission’. That is never going to change.

retrocop, //Were you approached first for Boris's job? :-) //

Haha!

[retrocop]

OG
//One needs to deal with those with warped minds, and try to ensure no further generation gets warped, //

Trouble is Islam is like the costra nostra. The so called moderates will not break the code of silence and condemn or inform which one or hundred amongst them have the warped minds.
Crowded together in their enclaves and ghettoes it could be any one of them and a few might mutter about Ali and how much more radicalised he was getting but only after Ali has committed a terrorist outrage of humungous proportions and has been shot dead or escaped

[anotheoldgit]

vetuste_ennemi

/// Nazism was an evil ideology. Not all Germans were Nazis. ///

And that is perfectly true, but during WW2 we treated all Germans that were in this country at that time, much more differently than we treat the Muslims in this country now, and at that time it proved to be a sensible move.

[ChillDoubt]

What naomi said.

[Jackdaw33]

Correct. Enemy aliens were interned.

[vulcan42]

I wish people would try to understand what naomi is saying. This is not a religion due for future enlightenment, it is a way of life-or death if you prefer. They do not have warped minds, they are perfectly rational in their thinking, killing those who don't submit to their doctrine is normal, totally acceptable. They don't want to change, they don't want to discuss, it's accept our way of life or die, there is no other option.

[naomi24]

Vulcan, thank you. I wish people would try to understand what I'm saying too.

//They don't want to change//

Unless they decide to become apostates - an enormous step taken only by the bravest - they CAN'T change. Islam doesn't allow for compromise in faith.

[ChillDoubt]

That's right. If you're not a Muslim, you're an infidel. There is no in between.

[anotheoldgit]

Somewhat off topic I know, but I was wondering where Andy Hughes has got to these days?

He last posted on the 27th June, but it shows he last peeped in today 09:17 Fri 15th Jul 2016.

Miss your input Andy, even though I don't often agree with you.

[retrocop]

Been on holiday we are told.

[ummmm]

Naomi....yet again you are tarring all Muslims with the same brush.

[Old_Geezer]

Whatever the word "Islam" means, all things evolve, some slower than others, and the more violent domineering religions tend to become enlightened at some point. Contact with more existing enlightened religions must be a source of influence as well as conflict. One might expect Islam to become less extreme and less violent quicker than most, now the world is more easily travelled and contact with more moderate religions more common.

War occurs between nations, or in the case of civil war within one nation, not groups. It's use as a description is incorrect here, and simply serves to justify creating/reinforcing an 'us and them' attitude.

For sure there are extreme Muslims, but I can not see how anyone can justify that the majority of Muslims in western society is anything like as extreme as those few who commit atrocities. Where one can stop the indoctrination of violence, and hating western values, folk inevitable grow up to be much more reasonable.

One thing clearly needing to be tackled is the lack of genuine integration into society, and some's lack of acceptance of the values of the country they live in. For example, ghettos should be avoided; it is easier to think poorly of others in society if one does not mix and learn of them as individuals. Plus there needs to be more checking that poisonous beliefs and creeds are not passed on in special schools under the guise of religious teaching. But it is for society to ensure happens. Individuals will just carry on as they knew when growing up and the issue thus remains.

I do not expect everyone to believe exactly the same thing as everyone else, there will always be differences of opinion; but I reject one can simply group all of a religion into the same mindset. Every group has a range of opinions.

And to be honest I'm unsure what is being suggested is done to all Muslims anyway. There just seems to be the suggestion that they are all the same, evil people, and it's not right, we should do something about it.

[jambutty]

Ditto what naomi said.

[-Talbot-]

FGS if we could just agree to ignore the beheadings, the mass shootings, the rape of seductive looking women, the cries of death to the west, the murdering of wives who have been raped, the stoning of adulterers, the acts of throwing gays off high-rise apartments, the killing of Muslims for being the wrong kind of Muslim, the suicide bombers killing random innocents, the mutilation of children's genitals ... etc, etc et *** etera



Then we will see that basically Islam should be embraced and welcomed into western civilisation.

[jambutty]

Brilliant !

[EDDIE51]

The relationship between France and Algeria is about FAR more than religion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algeria%E2%80%93France_relations it goes back over 500 years.
At one time Algeria was a French colony at other times France was at war with Algeria.Algeria only gained independence from France in the 1960s, I can remember it being a main news item back in my school days.

[beso]

Old_Geezer //Many ancient religions were like that once but they gradually get enlightened. //

No religion is ever becomes enlightened. Religion is the antithesis of enlightenment.

[beso]

OG //For sure there are extreme Muslims, but I can not see how anyone can justify that the majority of Muslims in western society is anything like as extreme as those few who commit atrocities.//

Try reading the Quran. The difference between moderates and extremists is nothing more than patience.

Islam is fascism. Decent humans resist fascism.

Those who pretend otherwise are culpable.