Do You Ever Think There Will Be Peace?In...
Society & Culture0 min ago
Oh Dear, It Seems That A Big Red Fire Truck Is Actually Invisible!
39 Answers
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"Culver City's fire service said the Tesla had "ploughed into the rear" of one of its fire engines parked at the scene of an accident on Monday." - PMSL.
in a separate incident with GM offering: The rider says the car - which was using GM's Cruise Automation technology - caused him serious injury and is now suing GM, according to local newspaper The Mercury News.
With this sort of injury and carnage being caused is it time to stop these car makers using the public for their experiments?
"Culver City's fire service said the Tesla had "ploughed into the rear" of one of its fire engines parked at the scene of an accident on Monday." - PMSL.
in a separate incident with GM offering: The rider says the car - which was using GM's Cruise Automation technology - caused him serious injury and is now suing GM, according to local newspaper The Mercury News.
With this sort of injury and carnage being caused is it time to stop these car makers using the public for their experiments?
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accident stats, gromit? perlease, try doing it as a percentage of each group, nice spin.
Kidas: "I should have read my own report. The motorcyclist was deemed to be at fault for overtaking on the wrong side in an unsafe manoever " - ah bless, the old, "people do not obey the rules of the road shocker! that's what the software has to work with, people run red lights etc! As humans we hope the othetr will obey the rules but we react to save lives when they don't.
Kidas: "I should have read my own report. The motorcyclist was deemed to be at fault for overtaking on the wrong side in an unsafe manoever " - ah bless, the old, "people do not obey the rules of the road shocker! that's what the software has to work with, people run red lights etc! As humans we hope the othetr will obey the rules but we react to save lives when they don't.
“AD systems have road rules programmed into them and they obey those rules when human drivers would choose not to do so.”
Great. So here I am, ploughing round the M25, when I come to one of the “smart” sections. The NSL has been replaced by a 50mph limit for a stretch. How is this accommodated in the AD system? Or…here I am ploughing along the A29 (NSL, 60mph in the single carriageway sections) when I come upon a stretch of roadworks with a temporary 40mph limit. Same question as above. Just a thought.
And just on a point or order:
“indeed undertaking is illegal,…”
No it isn’t. It may constitute inconsiderate, careless (or even dangerous) driving, depending on the circumstances. But “undertaking” is no more a specific offence than driving on the wrong side of the road is.
Great. So here I am, ploughing round the M25, when I come to one of the “smart” sections. The NSL has been replaced by a 50mph limit for a stretch. How is this accommodated in the AD system? Or…here I am ploughing along the A29 (NSL, 60mph in the single carriageway sections) when I come upon a stretch of roadworks with a temporary 40mph limit. Same question as above. Just a thought.
And just on a point or order:
“indeed undertaking is illegal,…”
No it isn’t. It may constitute inconsiderate, careless (or even dangerous) driving, depending on the circumstances. But “undertaking” is no more a specific offence than driving on the wrong side of the road is.
The problem with Tesla, is their insistence in calling the self driving capability "Autopilot". Germany has banned Tesla from using this terminology. All Tesla literature and manuals tell drivers to keep their hands on the wheel and stay alert. In the fatal crash last year, witnesses say the driver was watching a feature film.
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Autonomous driving systems are developing.
In the business, we talk about level 1 up to level 5.
Level 1 is things like simple cruise control.
Level 2 might be a lane departure control, or automated parking
Level 3 is simple AD: when cruising down the motorway, the driver can be totally hands-off and the vehicle systems will handle steering, overtaking, acceleration and deceleration in busy traffic.
Level 4 is where the car can be left on its own for the vast majority of the time, but a driver is still needed and the steering wheel and brake/accelerator pedals are still there.
Level 5 is fully AD under all circumstances, with no need even for driver controls.
Modern cars are still somewhere between level 3 and level 4. When the instruction manuals say the driver has to be aware, that's largely to cover themselves in case the diver puts the vehicle into a dangerous situation and then expects the AD systems to deal with it.
Because these systems are new, the designers are adapting to how to integrate them with human-driven vehicles. I'd expect that car makers are talking to law-makers over those habits where drivers deliberately break the rules such as driving at 60 in a 50 limit, or stopping at All-stop junctions (in the US), or other situations. Or maybe they wil introduce systems that alert other drivers that 'This car obeys all road rules' for example.
There again, those rules are there for a reason. If people choose to drive at 90 down the motorway (as I sometimes do), it's a bit rich for me to get all aggressive over someone (human or AD) doing the maximum speed limit if 70
In the business, we talk about level 1 up to level 5.
Level 1 is things like simple cruise control.
Level 2 might be a lane departure control, or automated parking
Level 3 is simple AD: when cruising down the motorway, the driver can be totally hands-off and the vehicle systems will handle steering, overtaking, acceleration and deceleration in busy traffic.
Level 4 is where the car can be left on its own for the vast majority of the time, but a driver is still needed and the steering wheel and brake/accelerator pedals are still there.
Level 5 is fully AD under all circumstances, with no need even for driver controls.
Modern cars are still somewhere between level 3 and level 4. When the instruction manuals say the driver has to be aware, that's largely to cover themselves in case the diver puts the vehicle into a dangerous situation and then expects the AD systems to deal with it.
Because these systems are new, the designers are adapting to how to integrate them with human-driven vehicles. I'd expect that car makers are talking to law-makers over those habits where drivers deliberately break the rules such as driving at 60 in a 50 limit, or stopping at All-stop junctions (in the US), or other situations. Or maybe they wil introduce systems that alert other drivers that 'This car obeys all road rules' for example.
There again, those rules are there for a reason. If people choose to drive at 90 down the motorway (as I sometimes do), it's a bit rich for me to get all aggressive over someone (human or AD) doing the maximum speed limit if 70
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"All Tesla literature and manuals tell drivers to keep their hands on the wheel and stay alert."
That sounds like the most dangerous combination they could possibly think of. Expecting drivers to stay fully aware and alert while taking responsibility off them. Even if we get the technology right, human psychology won't change that much that quickly enough to make it safe.
That sounds like the most dangerous combination they could possibly think of. Expecting drivers to stay fully aware and alert while taking responsibility off them. Even if we get the technology right, human psychology won't change that much that quickly enough to make it safe.
The general expectation is that the AD market will develop first in Asia, then come to Europe and finally to the US.
Especially in Asia (Think Bangkok, Ho Chi Minh City, Shanghai, Beijing), the traffic can be diabolical. I've sat in a car for 2 hours to do the 5 miles from the airport to my hotel in Shanghai. Fortunately, I was a passenger, so could do whatever, but as a driver, that's just a total waste of time.
Many who live in the mega-cities of Asia, and especially the 20-30-year olds can't wait to get AD and shared ownership (except maybe the taxi drivers).
European are a bit more conservative and the Americans.. well they like their cars.
Also, there will always be people who want to take a performance vehicle onto a track for the sheer enjoyment of driving. That will continue.
However it turns out, this is the future, whether we like it or not. It's going to result in reduced carbon emissions, improved use of resource and fewer deaths, so it's a no-brainer as far as legislators are concerned.
Especially in Asia (Think Bangkok, Ho Chi Minh City, Shanghai, Beijing), the traffic can be diabolical. I've sat in a car for 2 hours to do the 5 miles from the airport to my hotel in Shanghai. Fortunately, I was a passenger, so could do whatever, but as a driver, that's just a total waste of time.
Many who live in the mega-cities of Asia, and especially the 20-30-year olds can't wait to get AD and shared ownership (except maybe the taxi drivers).
European are a bit more conservative and the Americans.. well they like their cars.
Also, there will always be people who want to take a performance vehicle onto a track for the sheer enjoyment of driving. That will continue.
However it turns out, this is the future, whether we like it or not. It's going to result in reduced carbon emissions, improved use of resource and fewer deaths, so it's a no-brainer as far as legislators are concerned.
judge: "Indeed. I am by no means a Luddite. But when I see a so-called "autonomous" vehicle successfully negotiate Hyde Park Corner or Place de l'Étoile (where the Arc de Triomphe sits, in Paris), I'll believe they have arrived. Until then I'll stick with pedals and a steering wheel, thanks. " - important criteria, my own are this: When I can get in the back seat of my car and have it drive me round various establishments until I'm rat arised and then drop me home and any death and destruction it causes is not my fault then they we would have autonomous cars. - ie never.
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