Should Islam be an illegal organisation in this country.

[RATTER15]

When you read things like this: http://news.sky.com/s...n_Exclusive_Interview

Why should we have to tolerate this in our country I hear you all saying "but they aren't all terrorists" maybe not, but they all belong to a faith that supports this and we cannot separate them so send them all back to where they come from or where their views will be appreciated!

or maybe they could just find a God that will strike them all down for their evil actions!!!

I remember Mike Tyson going into the boxing ring and saying "Allah" will protect me, do these people really think that any of these so called Gods will protect someone as evil and horrible as Tyson, this God was going to protect him while he potentially is punching the life out of another boxer.


I really don't understand any of these religious sorts, their gods are always surrounded by so much evil and death, in the past and its still happening!!!

I'm so glad to have no such connections or beliefs.

I do not need these gods or beliefs to be happy and I certainly do not need the godly crutch to lean on, I live my life according to my morals, I know what is right or wrong.

[naomi24]

No, I'm not joking.

[123everton]

Oh righto then.
Just gonna throw this out there, a wild shot so to speak, do you not think that's a little bit extremist, a little bit unlibertarian?

[naomi24]

No.

[123everton]

In your Naomist wonderland, will the perpetrators be reeducated in these prisons?

[naomi24]

No they wouldn't - and as usual I'll overlook your rudeness.

[123everton]

Ha ha, so you'd just leave em there to rot forever?
You're so humane...

[naomi24]

Yes, quite right. I'd leave them there, and because I care about the safety of law-abiding citizens I'd make sure they stayed there. Having said that I think you're rather over-dramatising the rotting scenario Everton. In all honesty I really can't believe that anyone actually rots in our jails. In some areas of the rest of the world, yes - but not here in the good old caring UK. That would just be silly. Anyway, as you so rightly assume I'm all heart where the enemies of this country are concerned, so (tut - soft hearted old me) I would definitely feed them, and clothe them. However, that aside, unlike you, I would fight to the death for the right of a little child to receive a life saving blood transfusion despite the opposition of its Jehovah's Witness parents and your unequivocal support of those disgusting parents. Seems you and I adhere to vastly opposing principles - and truly if I were in the least religious I would thank God for that. If you're talking humanitarian ethics then you have nothing whatsoever to crow about because you have demonstrated time and time again that when religion is involved, you care more for the religious perpetrator than the victim - and in any judicious person's language that is not only irrational - it is immoral - and it is shameful.

[123everton]

Yawn.
Locking away people and throwing the key, you sound like Mrs. AOG, you make a lovely couple, so much in common....

[society]

LOL Naomi? Mrs. AOG?? Well I never... :-)

Poor Naomi

[naomi24]

Oh dear Everton. Difficult eh? Must try harder. Night night. :o)

[naomi24]

Ooo goodness, Society. Not so much poor Naomi - rather poor AOG!! Haaaaa!

[123everton]

Poor AOG, for once we agree, lol.

[birdie1971]

123everton – What do you suggest should happen to people found guilty of treason?

[123everton]

What do you class as treason?
If you kill people in a premeditated attack it's murder and should be treated as such.
Were the I.R.A traitors?
Were the U.D.F patriots?

[naomi24]

^^ Watch it Birdie. You're liable to be led all around the houses at great length ending up in 1870s Timbuktu and still not have a straighforward answer to your question.

[123everton]

With history though Naomi one can talk definitively, with philosophy one can ponder, suppose or theorise.
Your passion is religion, or rather denouncing it (nothing wrong with that), mine is history.
The beauty of history is that it tells you why omething is happening, rather than what the current media is telling you so as to be repeated ad hom by others.
Britain, the west in general has a very short memory, for every act we decry, we've done worse to them, caused worse for them and often continue to do so.
To highlight these things makes many uncomfortable, they resort to two wrongs etc.
When you understand history you understand the world, and the people in it.
You know for all the space ships and motor cars, people still share the same hopes, dreams and fears.
Especially the fears, foreigners....
I'm just curious as to what is treason, what is a treasonous act?
What should the penalty be?
In America under Clinton a man was jailed for sedition, he wanted an independent Costa Rica, a product of the Spanish American War of 1899, that war is most notable as it helped delay WW1 by 15 years and thus keep us as one of the goodies.

[naomi24]

There you are Birdie. Hate to say I told you so. Granted there's no mention of 1870s Timbuktu, but we do have a war of 1899 which is as near as dammit - and you haven't got an answer have you!!

Everton, you are very much mistaken. My passion is not religion - it is the history of religion - and before I decided to concentrate specifically on that, my subject was history, so I really don't need you to differentiate between that and philosophy for me.

[birdie1971]

123everton - You seem to be labouring under the delusion that I asked you what constituted treason. I didn't.

“I'm just curious as to what is treason, what is a treasonous act?” - Good for you. Keep on looking. Be sure to let me know when you find out.

“What should the penalty be?” - I believe I asked you that very same question.


I asked what you think should be the punishment for those convicted of the offence of Treason. I'm not particularly interested in a history lesson at this juncture.

[123everton]

"If you kill people in a premeditated attack it's murder and should be treated as such."
Assuming you meant some sort of violent act.
See the thing is, if you're Costa Rican (for instance) you could quite rightly ask what right does America have to rule me?
You can ask the same if you're Welsh, Scottish or Irish here, is it treasonous?
I hate to get involved in arguments about definition, but I don't know what's classed as treason anymore, I don't even know if it's still on the statute.
The best answer I can give you, seeing as you didn't like the first one, is that it should be tried as a criminal act, it should not tried as a criminal thought.
As difficult as it is for me to say this, people are being arrested for the books they read (political) and the films they watch, I'm uneasy about this, regardless of the possibilities of their ultimate motives.

[birdie1971]

123Everton - “I don't even know if it's [the law of Treason] still on the statute.”. It is. Please see this list regarding references to Treason...

1351: Defines offence
1495: Allows defence
1695: Regulates trials
1702: Bans hindering succession
1708: English/Scottish law harmonised
1814: Ends disembowelling etc
1842: Deals with firearms, attempts to alarm monarch
1848: Deals with radical agitation
1998: Crime act ends death penalty

All of the above laws are still in force as they have never been repealed. The most recent and relevant Act is the Treason Felony Act 1848 (the 1998 Act mealy brings the previous Act into line with current European legislation banning capital punishment).