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Prayers Banned
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An atheist group has won a test case banning prayers before local council meetings, is this an infringement of human rights or a victory for human rights?
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The House of Commons has prayers before each day's sitting .No doubt the Speaker would say that Prayers do not form part of the business of the day . The point in the instant case is that this council insisted on prayers as part of the agenda, part of the business of the meeting. If these Christians wish to hold prayers separate from, and held before, the formal meeting they may, presumably, do so within the law.
And to say that it must continue because 'it is traditional', as some argued, is surely the stupidest argument to justify anything. It's saying 'because our ancestors and predecessors did it, it must be right'. Bear-baiting, anyone? Executing witches? Trial by Ordeal? :-)
And to say that it must continue because 'it is traditional', as some argued, is surely the stupidest argument to justify anything. It's saying 'because our ancestors and predecessors did it, it must be right'. Bear-baiting, anyone? Executing witches? Trial by Ordeal? :-)
Seems there could be a fight in the offing. Got your popcorn ready?
http://www.guardian.c...pickles?newsfeed=true
http://www.guardian.c...pickles?newsfeed=true
We are extremely privileged in the UK, nearly all religions are recognised and every single one of us is free to pray to our individual God, or choose not to pray at all.
Nobody is banned from praying. What is banned is communal and compulsory prayer during council meetings to a particular god, regardless of the religion or atheism of the councillors. Everyone is free to prayer in their own time if they wish.
I can see nothing to object to in this news report.
Nobody is banned from praying. What is banned is communal and compulsory prayer during council meetings to a particular god, regardless of the religion or atheism of the councillors. Everyone is free to prayer in their own time if they wish.
I can see nothing to object to in this news report.
There is no place for religion in governement. Indeed the separation of church and state is an essential part of democracy. It should be removed from all levels of government. The time will come when atheists do challenge the practice in the House of Commons.
Prayer as part of the meeting provides an air of legitimacy to the practice of what is essentially a form of witchcraft.
Prayer as part of the meeting provides an air of legitimacy to the practice of what is essentially a form of witchcraft.
I agree that people should be allowed to do as they think fit, however I do feel that once again our national customs are being eroded. When I was at school there were always prayers at assembly & when I was in the R.A.F. we had church parades & anyone who was non Christian was excused parades, I cannot see that praying did anyone any harm. This is after all still ( I hope) a Christian country with our queen being the head of the Christian church & part of the Christian faith involves praying. To sum up I cannot see why councillors who do not wish to be involved in prayers cannot wait a few minutes & then join the council meeting.
Ron.
Ron.
I agree with ron, my experience at school was the same, pupils of other faiths didn't have to participate. If I go to a religious service eg wedding or funeral of a person who follows a different faith, I don't pray their prayers, I just think other thoughts while those prayers are being said - you attend but don't participate. I can understand why Parliament opens each day with prayers, the Queen is Head of State and Head of the Church (but I bet all those of other faiths in the House do similar to what I do), but council meetings are civil - CE prayers shouldn't be imposed on those of other or no faiths.
Prayers are not on the agenda in the HoC and the Speaker invites the non-believers/interested in after it and the record of attendance is then taken.
The UK is rapidly losing (i) its level-headedness aka common-sense (ii)and common sense and pragmatic reasoning based on the wishes of the silent majority
The UK is rapidly losing (i) its level-headedness aka common-sense (ii)and common sense and pragmatic reasoning based on the wishes of the silent majority
Sith, >>i think it is wrong, how is this affecting atheists?<<
This isn't really an Atheist issue in my view, I think the point is that meeting time is for a meeting not for prayers, nobody is preventing or objecting to prayers, they can do it 5 minutes before the scheduled meeting, we shouldn't be paying councillors to sit in prayer.
If councillors want to sit in Prayer then just arrive 5 minutes earlier, those that don't wish to pray can arrive at the scheduled meeting time, I really don't see a problem with that.
This isn't really an Atheist issue in my view, I think the point is that meeting time is for a meeting not for prayers, nobody is preventing or objecting to prayers, they can do it 5 minutes before the scheduled meeting, we shouldn't be paying councillors to sit in prayer.
If councillors want to sit in Prayer then just arrive 5 minutes earlier, those that don't wish to pray can arrive at the scheduled meeting time, I really don't see a problem with that.
Boxtops, my experience re. school assembly was similar to yours, members of religions other than christianity were excused attending the religious part of assembly. However, unless you were of a recognised 'other' religion you had to attend the religious part. This seems to me to be a form of indoctrination into christianity carried out by the education authority at the expense of the rate and tax payer without giving any choice ot the interested parties, surely un-democratic?
