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There is no better example of the absurdity of biological men competing again proper women than the silliness of Lea Thomas. Will Thomas was an average swimmer ranked about 500 against his peers, but as Lea Thomas and competing against proper women 'she' was ranked number 1. Lea Thomas beat the Olympic Silver Medal winner by 1.75 seconds and at the time it was...
07:48 Thu 03rd Aug 2023
"I really wish all this would stop. Men are men and women are women."
the "all this" in the above sentence refers to the existence of trans people... which is a particularly interesting thing to say given that you claim to be related to one
this thread is about an inconsequential youtube clip... it is little more than a thinly veiled pretext for having a pop at trans people.... and many posters have taken the opportunity with relish. not your finest hour toratoratora.
the "all this" in the above sentence refers to the existence of trans people... which is a particularly interesting thing to say given that you claim to be related to one
this thread is about an inconsequential youtube clip... it is little more than a thinly veiled pretext for having a pop at trans people.... and many posters have taken the opportunity with relish. not your finest hour toratoratora.
Untitled - TTT has his faults, but I do not believe that transphobia is one of them.
His history on here in debates about the subject shows no obvious hostility towards any transgender person, only a perfectly reasonable annoyance at the need for some members of that community to continually make an utterly disproportionate fuss about the supposed lack of tolerance they receive, and an equally entirely disproportionate desire for the whole of society to bend to their unreasonable needs and wants.
Your post entirely backs up that view - actively looking for prejudice with no discernable evidence.
His history on here in debates about the subject shows no obvious hostility towards any transgender person, only a perfectly reasonable annoyance at the need for some members of that community to continually make an utterly disproportionate fuss about the supposed lack of tolerance they receive, and an equally entirely disproportionate desire for the whole of society to bend to their unreasonable needs and wants.
Your post entirely backs up that view - actively looking for prejudice with no discernable evidence.
// [TTT's] history on here in debates about the subject shows no obvious hostility towards any transgender person, only a perfectly reasonable annoyance at the need for some members of that community to continually make an utterly disproportionate fuss about the supposed lack of tolerance they receive, and an equally entirely disproportionate desire for the whole of society to bend to their unreasonable needs and wants. //
I'm not sure that anyone who refers to transgender people's "needs and wants" as "unreasonable", or that the lack of tolerance they receive is only "supposed", is in any position to judge whether TTT is transphobic or not. Likewise, the "selfish determination to ignore real women" is a complete mischaracterisation of -- at least the overwhelming majority of -- transgender people's position. And it's not like transphobia doesn't exist, or, at least, is only minimal. Like most things, it's rather easier to ignore, or to overlook, when you personally aren't affected.
Also, roy -- well, believe whatever you want to, but I can only go on what I see, and on what people tell me, or don't.
I'm not sure that anyone who refers to transgender people's "needs and wants" as "unreasonable", or that the lack of tolerance they receive is only "supposed", is in any position to judge whether TTT is transphobic or not. Likewise, the "selfish determination to ignore real women" is a complete mischaracterisation of -- at least the overwhelming majority of -- transgender people's position. And it's not like transphobia doesn't exist, or, at least, is only minimal. Like most things, it's rather easier to ignore, or to overlook, when you personally aren't affected.
Also, roy -- well, believe whatever you want to, but I can only go on what I see, and on what people tell me, or don't.
"No it doesn’t refer to the existence of trans people"
oh pull the other one naomi it's got bells on
let's imagine ourselves in a naomiocracy in which "all this has stopped" and "men are men and women are women"... it's obvious that you mean people's gender identity conforming with their biological sex, i.e. no trans people
oh pull the other one naomi it's got bells on
let's imagine ourselves in a naomiocracy in which "all this has stopped" and "men are men and women are women"... it's obvious that you mean people's gender identity conforming with their biological sex, i.e. no trans people
Clare - // I'm not sure that anyone who refers to transgender people's "needs and wants" as "unreasonable", or that the lack of tolerance they receive is only "supposed", is in any position to judge whether TTT is transphobic or not. //
You've been on the site six months, TTT has been here for ten years, and I've been here for twenty-three years, so I think I can safely say that I know more about what TTT thinks about many things than you do.
I'll give you unreasonable -
My wife is a director of an Education Trust overseeing seven primary schools.
Because one child of eight has decided to call himself 'trans', the school has had to lose its disabled toilet facilities to give him a toilet for his use alone, and a member of staff has to accompany him every time he uses it. Add to that the fact that the school is in the process of re-drafting every single policy it has, in order to accommodate they whims of a child with attention-seeking parents backing him up, and by any measure, I call that unreasonable.
The amount of fuss and noise made by the attention-seeking element of the trans community is directly inversely proportional to the amount of people actually affected by living in our society, and that is where the hostility is based.
It's not that a tiny minority are different, it's that they expect the entire majority to accommodate each and every unusual and inconvenient wish they have, and they make vast amounts of noise telling everyone.
Attention-seeking is an unattractive position for anyone to take, as is causing misery to a majority of people when there is really no need.
If the trans community want tolerance and understanding - and be in doubt, I absolutely believe that they are completely entitled to both, then they need to stop their infinitesimal minority from ensuring that they are all labelled as attention-seeking trouble-makers.
And a good place for you to start, would be accepting a view that is different from your own, even if it is from someone you had never heard of seven months ago, and accepting the backing of that view from someone who knows that individual a heck of a lot better than you do.
You've been on the site six months, TTT has been here for ten years, and I've been here for twenty-three years, so I think I can safely say that I know more about what TTT thinks about many things than you do.
I'll give you unreasonable -
My wife is a director of an Education Trust overseeing seven primary schools.
Because one child of eight has decided to call himself 'trans', the school has had to lose its disabled toilet facilities to give him a toilet for his use alone, and a member of staff has to accompany him every time he uses it. Add to that the fact that the school is in the process of re-drafting every single policy it has, in order to accommodate they whims of a child with attention-seeking parents backing him up, and by any measure, I call that unreasonable.
The amount of fuss and noise made by the attention-seeking element of the trans community is directly inversely proportional to the amount of people actually affected by living in our society, and that is where the hostility is based.
It's not that a tiny minority are different, it's that they expect the entire majority to accommodate each and every unusual and inconvenient wish they have, and they make vast amounts of noise telling everyone.
Attention-seeking is an unattractive position for anyone to take, as is causing misery to a majority of people when there is really no need.
If the trans community want tolerance and understanding - and be in doubt, I absolutely believe that they are completely entitled to both, then they need to stop their infinitesimal minority from ensuring that they are all labelled as attention-seeking trouble-makers.
And a good place for you to start, would be accepting a view that is different from your own, even if it is from someone you had never heard of seven months ago, and accepting the backing of that view from someone who knows that individual a heck of a lot better than you do.
// You've been on the site six months ... //
That's not true, as I'm sure TTT or Naomi will be happy to tell you. I've been on the site since 2012, in fact -- admittedly with a different account, but I've been around for a *lot* longer than six months anyway and discussed this at length with many people here and elsewhere. I'll allow that maybe you didn't know this yourself (it's an open secret), but perhaps you ought to bear this point in mind when reaching your assessment, and much of the rest of your post suffers because you rushed to make this judgement.
That's not true, as I'm sure TTT or Naomi will be happy to tell you. I've been on the site since 2012, in fact -- admittedly with a different account, but I've been around for a *lot* longer than six months anyway and discussed this at length with many people here and elsewhere. I'll allow that maybe you didn't know this yourself (it's an open secret), but perhaps you ought to bear this point in mind when reaching your assessment, and much of the rest of your post suffers because you rushed to make this judgement.
// If the trans community want tolerance and understanding - and be in doubt, I absolutely believe that they are completely entitled to both, then they need to stop their infinitesimal minority from ensuring that they are all labelled as attention-seeking trouble-makers. //
To respond to this specific point, it's the same failure that's made in comments about other minority groups. Put simply, no -- I'm not responsible for the "infinitesimal minority" of "attention-seeking trouble-makers". Among other reasons, we might not even agree which people fit into this group and which don't, making it hard to know who you intend for me to "stop"; but, even if we could agree entirely on this, I still can do no more than advise them to tone it down a little or whatever; and the community as a whole is plagued enough with infighting as it is.
To respond to this specific point, it's the same failure that's made in comments about other minority groups. Put simply, no -- I'm not responsible for the "infinitesimal minority" of "attention-seeking trouble-makers". Among other reasons, we might not even agree which people fit into this group and which don't, making it hard to know who you intend for me to "stop"; but, even if we could agree entirely on this, I still can do no more than advise them to tone it down a little or whatever; and the community as a whole is plagued enough with infighting as it is.
There is no better example of the absurdity of biological men competing again proper women than the silliness of Lea Thomas.
Will Thomas was an average swimmer ranked about 500 against his peers, but as Lea Thomas and competing against proper women 'she' was ranked number 1.
Lea Thomas beat the Olympic Silver Medal winner by 1.75 seconds and at the time it was reported that 'she' appeared to be slowing down, presumably so as not to make the farce of 'her' competing against proper women even more farcical. Take that one step further, had 'she' been competing in the Olympics 'she'd' have taken the place of a real woman on the team, quite possibly would have won gold and we'd now have the first biological man, still with a cock-and-balls, as the women's Olympic champion. Anybody who doesn't find this absurd needs their bumps felt.
There was a poster last year (may have been the year before) who remarked "Good for her" when the whole Lea Thomas absurdity arose. That message was clear - the rights of Thomas top-trumped the rights of the real women competing.
Thomas had the benefit of going through male puberty, is enormous, has hands like paddles and greater lung capacity, and no amount of hormone therapy or spin is going to change that advantage.
Quire simply it is unfair that an average male swimmer decides he's going to be a woman and then compete against proper women.
I have enormous respect for Riley Gaines.
Will Thomas was an average swimmer ranked about 500 against his peers, but as Lea Thomas and competing against proper women 'she' was ranked number 1.
Lea Thomas beat the Olympic Silver Medal winner by 1.75 seconds and at the time it was reported that 'she' appeared to be slowing down, presumably so as not to make the farce of 'her' competing against proper women even more farcical. Take that one step further, had 'she' been competing in the Olympics 'she'd' have taken the place of a real woman on the team, quite possibly would have won gold and we'd now have the first biological man, still with a cock-and-balls, as the women's Olympic champion. Anybody who doesn't find this absurd needs their bumps felt.
There was a poster last year (may have been the year before) who remarked "Good for her" when the whole Lea Thomas absurdity arose. That message was clear - the rights of Thomas top-trumped the rights of the real women competing.
Thomas had the benefit of going through male puberty, is enormous, has hands like paddles and greater lung capacity, and no amount of hormone therapy or spin is going to change that advantage.
Quire simply it is unfair that an average male swimmer decides he's going to be a woman and then compete against proper women.
I have enormous respect for Riley Gaines.
Untitled, I'll thank to refrain from inferring I'm lying and I'll thank you to resist your usual urge to launch unfounded personal attacks.
ClareTG0ld, when people rely upon charges of 'transphobia' to defend their argument, it's no argument. Like charges of racism, it is designed solely to silence the opposition. I personally couldn't care less how you or anyone else lives life, but when other people's choices demand that, in order to indulge them, my own personal principles be compromised, or those choices impact negatively, unfairly, and uninvited upon other members of society, then I care.
I'll ask you again the question you've refused in the past to answer - a refusal that speaks volumes. Can a female have a penis?
Your answer to that would be welcome too, untitled.
DeskDiary. //There was a poster last year (may have been the year before) who remarked "Good for her"//
I remember that and I believe it was ClareTG0ld in a former AB life. Doubtless ClareTG0ld will correct me if I'm wrong.
ClareTG0ld, when people rely upon charges of 'transphobia' to defend their argument, it's no argument. Like charges of racism, it is designed solely to silence the opposition. I personally couldn't care less how you or anyone else lives life, but when other people's choices demand that, in order to indulge them, my own personal principles be compromised, or those choices impact negatively, unfairly, and uninvited upon other members of society, then I care.
I'll ask you again the question you've refused in the past to answer - a refusal that speaks volumes. Can a female have a penis?
Your answer to that would be welcome too, untitled.
DeskDiary. //There was a poster last year (may have been the year before) who remarked "Good for her"//
I remember that and I believe it was ClareTG0ld in a former AB life. Doubtless ClareTG0ld will correct me if I'm wrong.
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