Pistorius Cleared Of Murder

[merylpeep]

What The Funicular?

[ladybirder]

But the prosecutor couldn't prove that Baz.

[DTCwordfan]

Robert Durst was the case......

[bazwillrun]

Errr, I didnt say it was pre-med though .....I just said what I thought happened that night and some of the reasons based on what was known.

I dont think it was planned (pre-med) as such, but they had a row that night and it all went horribly wrong in a matter of seconds, his rage, his gun habit , his jealousy and his anger issues etc etc

Hes got money and access to good legal people and they did what theyre paid to do.

[andy-hughes]

"I just wanna know why Oscar insists on calling gerrie "my lady""

He isn't.

Court procedure demands that although questions are asked by the opposing barristers, the answers are directed to the judge.

Therefore, Mr Pistorius is addressing his answers to the judge, as he is required, to do, and he refers to her as 'my lady' because that is her correct form of address.

[andy-hughes]

Leaving aside those posters who have decided the guilt of Mr Pistorius without the benefit of all evidence, and from the position of their armchair, via edited television and biased news reports -

We need to remember that the judge's job is to hear all the evidence, and then make a ruling in law based on that evidence and the proof it offers - or not.

The arguments that we would all check where our loved ones are before firing a weapon at a closed door are all well and good - as far as they go but ...

Mr Pistorius lives in a violent country, he likes to use guns, he has a volatile temper, he is disadvanged by the loss of limbs, something none of us can comprehend, all of which have affected his actions - that is not in dispute at all.

The trial revolves not around the killing, which is not disputed, but the actual crime committed.

As I understand it, Mr Pistorius has been cleared of planning to kill his girlfriend - based on the evidence presented.

It remains to be seen if other statues are deemed to have been violated - so we should not be bandying observations about 'getting off', or the judge being congenitally stupid, or corrupt, for which posters have not the slightest evidence.

We should wait for the full verdict, and the summing up behind it, before we start debating properly - by which time the Self-Righteous Brothers will hopefully have calmed down, their veins stopped throbbing, their shouting muted, and be ready to look at this situation with the degree of detachment that the judge has to use.

[tamborine]

Yes AH, and wins gold medals for his country

http://www.theguardian.com/sport/2012/sep/09/oscar-pistorius-400-gold-paralympics

[andy-hughes]

Not sure of the relevance there Tambo - ?

[Baby_Sham]

Haven't read through the comments on here, but I was so saddened to hear this.
Clearly the guy is guilty as sin, yet I guess money talks.

I'll be waiting for the outcome, but I'm so disappointed he wasn't found guilty of that poor girls murder.

:-(

[Cloverjo]

I don't think he meant to kill Reeva. It was a horrible mistake. He was frightened, panicking and vulnerable because of his disability and anxiety. The poor guy is clearly broken. Of course, it's terrible that a woman lost her life, but he'll be paying for that for the rest of his life regardless of whatever sentence he might have to serve.
I don't understand why he has to wait an extra day for the verdict on culpable homicide. Why couldn't the judge have delivered that on the same day as the other charges?

[andy-hughes]

Babt_Sham - "Clearly the guy is guilty as sin, yet I guess money talks."

and this dual supposition is based on what exactly?

[Retrochic]

The judge can only make a decision based on facts surrounding the case -she can not make a supposition on what he did, she can only make judgement on the evidence put before her. Despite what everyone 'thinks' and 'knows' there was no evidence available -witness or otherwise -to prove that the killing of Reeva was pre-meditated or deliberate. From the EVIDENCE available she has made judgement that he was at fault (culpable)and used unreasonable force. I feel this will be the verdict with a maximum prison sentence. The judge really does not look like the type that would take a back hander......

[EDDIE51]

He has only been cleared of Premeditated Murder. He has NOT been cleared of murder, there is a huge difference. He can still be guilty of Culpable Homicide which has a sentence of up to 15 years, and is SAs equivalent of manslaughter.

[andy-hughes]

Retrochic - "The judge really does not look like the type that would take a back hander......"

What does a judge who would take a back hander look like? Just so I know if ever I am in court - your process of working out who is corrupt and who is not could prove very useful!

[Retrochic]

for goodness sake andy scrape the barrel bit more if that's possible .

[andy-hughes]

Retrochic - "Retrochic

for goodness sake andy scrape the barrel bit more if that's possible ."

I don't understand your response - you are the one making the sweeping generalsations - how does that mean I am 'scraping the barrel'?

[ludwig]

// Leaving aside those posters who have decided the guilt of Mr Pistorius without the benefit of all evidence //

Well, he's undoubtedly guilty of shooting someone to death. Exactly how that translates into the various legal definitions of killing is for the judge to decide, but there's no doubt he killed her.

[Retrochic]

ludwig -he's just been found guilty of culpable homicide -I've been watching it live. Now he has to wait for sentencing.

[andy-hughes]

ludwig - "// Leaving aside those posters who have decided the guilt of Mr Pistorius without the benefit of all evidence //

Well, he's undoubtedly guilty of shooting someone to death. Exactly how that translates into the various legal definitions of killing is for the judge to decide, but there's no doubt he killed her."

Indeed ludwig.

There seems to be a knee-jerk reaction as though Mr Pstorius has walked free from the court with no stain on his character.

In fact, the case is still on-going, and we will hear the remainder of the judgements today, and a possible custodial sentence.

At least one poster has taken issue with my gentle teasing about assumptions that Mr Pistorius has got away with murder' based on a combination of his celebrity, the laissez-faire attitudes to justice in South Africa, and the stupdity of the judge matched only by her corrupt acceptance of payment to serve the verdict.

[ToraToraTora]

"is that you in there darling?" - why did he not ask that? Or perhaps, "Mr Burglar, come out and I'll shoot, police are on their way" - sorry the guy has form, a known gun nut, a known hot head, he lost his rag over something chased her into the kazi and shot her through the door. No other possible explanation holds any sort of water. He then had to find a way to con the gullible and bribe the authorities. He seems to have done well in both those endeavours. Not premeditated, but murder pure and simple.

[andy-hughes]

Tora - ""is that you in there darling?" - why did he not ask that? Or perhaps, "Mr Burglar, come out and I'll shoot, police are on their way" - sorry the guy has form, a known gun nut, a known hot head, he lost his rag over something chased her into the kazi and shot her through the door. No other possible explanation holds any sort of water. He then had to find a way to con the gullible and bribe the authorities. He seems to have done well in both those endeavours. Not premeditated, but murder pure and simple."

The circomstances have been dealt with in evidence for the court, and as advised previously on the thread - no-one is disputing that murder took place - the case revolves around its premeditation, or not.

It now seems that the judge has ruled that murder did take place, under the 'culpable homicde' rule - together with an earlier charge of discharding a gun in a restaurant.

So Mr Pistorius will be going to prison.