Times 23510

[Aperio]

Female supporter's call for one hammered in kitchen (10)? Answer is: Vi(bra)(phone). But where does kitchen come in? Many thanks A.

[kayakamina]

A kitchen is the percussion section of an orchestra.

[Aquagility]

Are you quite sure of your solution (Vibraphone)?

[Aquagility]

Welcome back, kyakamina. You have the rights of it, as usual! I still don't see where the 'V' comes from.

New subject: In cryptics, is the part of the clue which gives the whole word always given first or last, or can it be in the middle?

[kayakamina]

Aq I'm not sure how long I will be on for as the computer is very temperamental.

VI is the female. A vibraphone is 'hammered'

It is conventional to always have two definitions for each cryptic clue.

[crofter]

Aqua - It's Vi(olet) = female.

In answer to your query, I always considered that the whole meaning is the RATIONAL part of the clue (which is logically linked to the solution). It can come either at the beginning or end of the clue (but I have never known it to come in the middle).

The "wordplay" is the IRRATIONAL part of the clue. Here at the beginning. Note that the Vibraphone has no logical link with Violet or her Bra!

Almost all cryptic clues contain rational and irrational elements.

[crofter]

I say "almost all" to cover clues like the following:
Drawing room furniture (8,5) DENTISTS CHAIR
A little lower than the knee (4) CALF
Neither of these has a rational and a irrational part as such.

[crofter]

As far as Aperio's original query is concerned, I must confess that I too was fooled by the use of the word "kitchen" in the clue. Thanks to kayakamina for the explanation - as usual a wealth of knowledge!

[Aperio]

Many thanks everyone for such a splendid response (*** for all answers). I spent more time trying to justify this clue than the rest of the crossword.

Perhaps, we should have the hardest clue of the day listed on the forum?

Glad to hear K. is back in circulation.

[Aquagility]

Thanks to you both, K & C. Your last type of clue, crofter, we refer to as 'punny', as in "Oh, very punny".