ChatterBank0 min ago
Atheist Theologian
56 Answers
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It amazes me how some theologians study to doctoral level, and learn nothing on the journey.
I feel sorry for this lady who has obviously wasted her time, and now speaks with apparent authority on a subject, God, that she knows so little about.
She is not alone. There are many such scholars who have cherry picked their way through the subject, without ever coming to realise the basic spirituality of the subject.
Even more disturbing is the fact that inevitably, her words will carry weight and influence by virtue of the letters after her name, when in fact she has nothing of any substance to say.
There are many Christian speakers who could tie her up in knots in minutes.
I would love to watch a debate between her and the likes of Ravi Zacharias, or others of comparable talent and spiritual awareness.
This lady is peddling snake oil, nothing more.
A rocket scientist who does not believe in rockets.
If only she humbled herself in prayer and allowed God to reveal His reality.
I hope one day she does.
Oh yes! I'm supposed to ask a question.
What do you think?
It amazes me how some theologians study to doctoral level, and learn nothing on the journey.
I feel sorry for this lady who has obviously wasted her time, and now speaks with apparent authority on a subject, God, that she knows so little about.
She is not alone. There are many such scholars who have cherry picked their way through the subject, without ever coming to realise the basic spirituality of the subject.
Even more disturbing is the fact that inevitably, her words will carry weight and influence by virtue of the letters after her name, when in fact she has nothing of any substance to say.
There are many Christian speakers who could tie her up in knots in minutes.
I would love to watch a debate between her and the likes of Ravi Zacharias, or others of comparable talent and spiritual awareness.
This lady is peddling snake oil, nothing more.
A rocket scientist who does not believe in rockets.
If only she humbled herself in prayer and allowed God to reveal His reality.
I hope one day she does.
Oh yes! I'm supposed to ask a question.
What do you think?
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//but updated translations from the original texts are made for all kinds of reasons//
//Can you tell me where the 'original' texts are please Theland?//
//Nailit - you joking? You really need me to answer that?//
Yes please. You're the one saying that we have updated translations from *ORIGINAL* texts. I'd like to know where these original texts are that updated translations are taken from.
//Can you tell me where the 'original' texts are please Theland?//
//Nailit - you joking? You really need me to answer that?//
Yes please. You're the one saying that we have updated translations from *ORIGINAL* texts. I'd like to know where these original texts are that updated translations are taken from.
Original New Testament texts are in universities and libraries all over the world, and academics collaborate internationally to study them. Google Bart Erhman and Daniel B Wallace to find out more.
Old Testament - again google it. Israel is the custodian of the earliest Hebrew texts.
Never heard of the Dead Sea scrolls or Qumran for example?
Your nit picking really is tedious.
Old Testament - again google it. Israel is the custodian of the earliest Hebrew texts.
Never heard of the Dead Sea scrolls or Qumran for example?
Your nit picking really is tedious.
You are one of a few people on here who simply try to bait me and wind me up with your, "not answering questions," allegations.
You need to come up with a few explanations of your own.
Defend evolution, put forward a feasible explanation for the origin of the universe, the numerous prophecies concerning the Jews, Israel, and the general history of Israel especially since 1948.
But you won't.
You simply assert that you have read the bible cover to cover. But you never claim to have understood a word of it. Because, Nailit, you don't.
Believers and atheists alike spend years studying it, and always find something new.
Take for example midrash. An interesting Jewish literary tool. I can just about get my head around the basic concept, but would never claim to understand it.
But of course, you have read it all cover to cover and therefore consider yourself an authority.
A bit delusional I think.
You need to come up with a few explanations of your own.
Defend evolution, put forward a feasible explanation for the origin of the universe, the numerous prophecies concerning the Jews, Israel, and the general history of Israel especially since 1948.
But you won't.
You simply assert that you have read the bible cover to cover. But you never claim to have understood a word of it. Because, Nailit, you don't.
Believers and atheists alike spend years studying it, and always find something new.
Take for example midrash. An interesting Jewish literary tool. I can just about get my head around the basic concept, but would never claim to understand it.
But of course, you have read it all cover to cover and therefore consider yourself an authority.
A bit delusional I think.
Calm down Theland, you'll give yourself a coronary carrying on like that.
//You are one of a few people on here who simply try to bait me and wind me up with your, "not answering questions," allegations//
Well answer questions then instead of keep posting You Tube links. Its hard to have a debate when ALL that is been posted is video links.
//You need to come up with a few explanations of your own.
Defend evolution, put forward a feasible explanation for the origin of the universe//
I cant, Im neither interested in nor educated in biology or astrophysics.
//the numerous prophecies concerning the Jews, Israel, and the general history of Israel especially since 1948.
But you won't//
Ive answered you before re: prophecies but you chose to ignore.
//You simply assert that you have read the bible cover to cover. But you never claim to have understood a word of it//
Eh?
//Believers and atheists alike spend years studying it, and always find something new//
Quiet right Theland. Try actually reading it all and you too might find something new. I certainly did when I read it all...
//Take for example midrash. An interesting Jewish literary tool. I can just about get my head around the basic concept, but would never claim to understand it//
Now THIS is interesting. Ive just finished reading this
Amazon.co.uk User Recommendation
The author makes the case that the gospels are jewish midrash and not history. Doubt you'll open your mind to new ways of thinking though.
//But of course, you have read it all cover to cover and therefore consider yourself an authority//
Unlike yourself who HASNT read it all and considers himself an authority.
//A bit delusional I think//
Ah, the mocking as expected, never mind, enjoy yourself.
//You are one of a few people on here who simply try to bait me and wind me up with your, "not answering questions," allegations//
Well answer questions then instead of keep posting You Tube links. Its hard to have a debate when ALL that is been posted is video links.
//You need to come up with a few explanations of your own.
Defend evolution, put forward a feasible explanation for the origin of the universe//
I cant, Im neither interested in nor educated in biology or astrophysics.
//the numerous prophecies concerning the Jews, Israel, and the general history of Israel especially since 1948.
But you won't//
Ive answered you before re: prophecies but you chose to ignore.
//You simply assert that you have read the bible cover to cover. But you never claim to have understood a word of it//
Eh?
//Believers and atheists alike spend years studying it, and always find something new//
Quiet right Theland. Try actually reading it all and you too might find something new. I certainly did when I read it all...
//Take for example midrash. An interesting Jewish literary tool. I can just about get my head around the basic concept, but would never claim to understand it//
Now THIS is interesting. Ive just finished reading this
Amazon.co.uk User Recommendation
The author makes the case that the gospels are jewish midrash and not history. Doubt you'll open your mind to new ways of thinking though.
//But of course, you have read it all cover to cover and therefore consider yourself an authority//
Unlike yourself who HASNT read it all and considers himself an authority.
//A bit delusional I think//
Ah, the mocking as expected, never mind, enjoy yourself.
My RE teacher was amazing- so inspiring. I took the subject at O and then A level because she made it so fascinating. That whole time I never had any idea of her own personal thoughts on religion/whether she was a theist or not. She was such a good teacher that she kept her personal thoughts to herself. One person's personal thoughts are irrelevant in an area where nothing can be proven. All one can do is discuss arguments for and against and draw ones own conclusion. Eventually I discovered that she had been a nun, lost her faith and now was a teacher. But I would never have assumed any of that. Your belief/faith is no more right or wrong, relevant or irrelevant than anyone elses. If someone has a PhD I would hope that they would be informed enough to know all sides of every argument, and that their personal belief is a result of a great deal of study on both sides. You can only ever believe what you believe!
Scarlett, //Also I think she has been chosen to go on this programme as she represents a really extreme view, which makes "good" TV. So she probably made sweeping statements because she was told to, in order to appear at one end of the spectrum.//
You’re mistaken.
//Francesca Stavrakopoulou is a British theologian and broadcaster. She is currently Professor of Hebrew Bible and Ancient Religion at the University of Exeter and Head of its Department of Theology and Religion.//
She is eminently qualified.
Theland, calm down. You instigate discussion by asking questions, you stymie any resulting debate by refusing to answer questions arising from it and by flouncing off claiming to be wounded, then you throw a fit because no one can tell you precisely how the universe was created …. and when I say no one I mean no one – not your priests, not your rabbis, not your scientists, not your theologians, not your YouTube superstars …. no one. Your favoured solution is at best a guess – and since the only evidence we have indicates that your champion was wholly incapable of achieving such a monumental task – it’s a very poor guess.
You’re mistaken.
//Francesca Stavrakopoulou is a British theologian and broadcaster. She is currently Professor of Hebrew Bible and Ancient Religion at the University of Exeter and Head of its Department of Theology and Religion.//
She is eminently qualified.
Theland, calm down. You instigate discussion by asking questions, you stymie any resulting debate by refusing to answer questions arising from it and by flouncing off claiming to be wounded, then you throw a fit because no one can tell you precisely how the universe was created …. and when I say no one I mean no one – not your priests, not your rabbis, not your scientists, not your theologians, not your YouTube superstars …. no one. Your favoured solution is at best a guess – and since the only evidence we have indicates that your champion was wholly incapable of achieving such a monumental task – it’s a very poor guess.
//John Shelby Spong, Nailit?
I could have told you that amongst serious Christians the man is regarded as totally ........//
Yes, amongst 'serious Christians' he would be regarded as totally....
because he is a Bible scholar who looks at the evidence and then makes his mind up rather than a 'serious christian' who makes his mind up and then finds the evidence to fit.
//You could have saved your money//
I did, the book was given to me.
BTW can you tell me where to find an ORIGINAL text yet?
Not an early text, not an ancient text. An ORIGINAL text?
Thanks.
I could have told you that amongst serious Christians the man is regarded as totally ........//
Yes, amongst 'serious Christians' he would be regarded as totally....
because he is a Bible scholar who looks at the evidence and then makes his mind up rather than a 'serious christian' who makes his mind up and then finds the evidence to fit.
//You could have saved your money//
I did, the book was given to me.
BTW can you tell me where to find an ORIGINAL text yet?
Not an early text, not an ancient text. An ORIGINAL text?
Thanks.
I realise her credentials, and I also know from personal experience that the producers get you on a talk show to make a very clear and sometimes sensational viewpoint so that the viewers at home have something more resembling Big Brother to watch rather than a detailed and subtle religious discussion. That's how it came over to me- as if she was asked to state her extreme view point in less than 15 words, so the viewers keep watching.
Scarlett, This programme covers a range of topics and therefore time doesn’t allow it to elicit detailed religious discussion. Her viewpoint arises solely from in-depth study, which is more than can be said for many other opinions, and it does contradict the status quo, which is why, I presume, you consider it ‘extreme’.
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