Body & Soul7 mins ago
we need to tighten up!
We now have a new way of terrorist coming into our country, apparently they come in from Pakistan on student visas, having trained in Al-Queda camps there, the people who have been arrested for (allegedly) plotting to blow up public places ie, football grounds and shooping centres, have done just this, I'm not sure what the answer is to this as we have students here from all over the world who are peaceful and law-abiding, many from Pakistan, but we need to tighten up, I suppose the police "nugget" who walked around with secret papers for all to see, did us a favour in the long run, the security services had to act and fast!
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>I suppose the police "nugget" who walked around
>with secret papers for all to see, did us a favour in
>the long run,
Why on earth do you say that?
Surely the police and secret service want to monitor people over a period of time (maybe months or years), gather all the evidence, find out how many people are involved in any terrorist cell, find the leaders etc.
Only when they are ready (and they have enough evidence to convict) will they bring them in.
Even though these people may have been arrested, this guy may have TOTALLY ruined the operation as it may be the secret service do not have enough evidence to charge them and they all have to be let go.
It may also be that perhaps a "mister big" who was the real person they were looking for has NOT been arrested because the operation as not allowed to run its full course.
This guy could have caused untold damage to this operation and I am surprised ANYONE can say it was a good thing he did what he did.
>with secret papers for all to see, did us a favour in
>the long run,
Why on earth do you say that?
Surely the police and secret service want to monitor people over a period of time (maybe months or years), gather all the evidence, find out how many people are involved in any terrorist cell, find the leaders etc.
Only when they are ready (and they have enough evidence to convict) will they bring them in.
Even though these people may have been arrested, this guy may have TOTALLY ruined the operation as it may be the secret service do not have enough evidence to charge them and they all have to be let go.
It may also be that perhaps a "mister big" who was the real person they were looking for has NOT been arrested because the operation as not allowed to run its full course.
This guy could have caused untold damage to this operation and I am surprised ANYONE can say it was a good thing he did what he did.
I say this VGH, because if he hadn't been spotted with these papers, it may have been to late, if a terror attack had been imminent, the security services had to swing into action straight away to avoid this happening, he was a complete ar**hole in what he did, to be in a position as he was and to carry papers of this calibre, not only uncovered but facing outward, I think you took my comment about him as me thinking he was our Saviour or something, mine was a tongue in cheek remark about what his negligence could have cost us
Apparently these terrorists where planning to attack over the Easter period, (one of the most religious periods in the Christian calendar). These people will not wait for our intelligence people to get their act together.
The time has come to stop playing around in velvet gloves, in case we offend or upset any particular group. We know where this has got us in Afghanistan, our soldiers are getting killed, fighting with one hand tied behind their backs.
We have got to act now, before a major terrorist attack takes place along with the loss of many,many innocent lives.We must stop the easy flow back and forward to Pakistan, yes stop these young men coming into this country on student visas if need be. We could also stop our nationals of Pakistan origin travelling back and forward on presumed holidays.
Yes these are strong actions but this is a war on terrorism, and that calls for some strong action. Perhaps when the majority of our tolerant Muslims are inconvenienced, then they may stand up and be counted in getting the militant ones among them discredited and exposed.
The time has come to stop playing around in velvet gloves, in case we offend or upset any particular group. We know where this has got us in Afghanistan, our soldiers are getting killed, fighting with one hand tied behind their backs.
We have got to act now, before a major terrorist attack takes place along with the loss of many,many innocent lives.We must stop the easy flow back and forward to Pakistan, yes stop these young men coming into this country on student visas if need be. We could also stop our nationals of Pakistan origin travelling back and forward on presumed holidays.
Yes these are strong actions but this is a war on terrorism, and that calls for some strong action. Perhaps when the majority of our tolerant Muslims are inconvenienced, then they may stand up and be counted in getting the militant ones among them discredited and exposed.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-116887 9/Gordon-Brown-blasts-Pakistan-lax-security-11 -members-Al-Qaeda-cell-revealed-come-there.htm l
Immigration Minister Phil Woolas He told BBC Radio 4's PM programme today that there were 285 million people coming in and out of the country every year, including nearly 400,000 issued with student visas.
Immigration Minister Phil Woolas He told BBC Radio 4's PM programme today that there were 285 million people coming in and out of the country every year, including nearly 400,000 issued with student visas.
I completley agree, I don't understand when a post like mine (current) I get accused sometimes of hand-wringing, this is real for heavens sake and like you say, the flow of Pakistan nationals who use their frequent trips as holidays, should be scrutinised thoroughly, Manchester appears to have a large Muslim population who, no doubt would have been going about their buisness over the Easter weekend, why don't they start yellin."Enough is enough" had there been an attack, they wouldn't have been saved, so they would be slaughtering their own too
By all accounts the operation was scheduled for the following morning in any case, therefore, little or nothing from an intelligence point of view was lost.
It was only the fact that Mr Quick indadvertantly revealed a sheet of paper classified "Secret" as he got out of the car to go into 10 Downing Street which threw the whole operation into total panic stations.
We all make mistakes but his was drastic, careless, and could potentially have led to a security catastrophe.
And Mr Quick has now at least done the honourable thing by swiftly resigning. How many politicians would have done the same ?
It was only the fact that Mr Quick indadvertantly revealed a sheet of paper classified "Secret" as he got out of the car to go into 10 Downing Street which threw the whole operation into total panic stations.
We all make mistakes but his was drastic, careless, and could potentially have led to a security catastrophe.
And Mr Quick has now at least done the honourable thing by swiftly resigning. How many politicians would have done the same ?
On last night's news at 10 -it said the government are now going to tighten up on student visas from Pakistan - should that not have been done already, bearing in mind these training camps are in Pakistan !!
I suppose we are lucky those secret papers were not left on a train a few weeks ago, then the security services would have had to act even quicker and the scum they are questioning now would have got clean away.
VHG - I think if there is a 'Mister Big' - he will never be caught, only those prats they recruit to do their dirty work.
Whose to say this operation was not about to be acted upon this weekend.
I think Joy is right, perhaps it was a good thing he was exposed with those security papers - knowning how slow this government is in making decisions - there could now be many men, women and children blow up and killed this weekend.
I suppose we are lucky those secret papers were not left on a train a few weeks ago, then the security services would have had to act even quicker and the scum they are questioning now would have got clean away.
VHG - I think if there is a 'Mister Big' - he will never be caught, only those prats they recruit to do their dirty work.
Whose to say this operation was not about to be acted upon this weekend.
I think Joy is right, perhaps it was a good thing he was exposed with those security papers - knowning how slow this government is in making decisions - there could now be many men, women and children blow up and killed this weekend.
April dear, your'e either in or your'e out, I can't count the numbef times my post on other topics, has been rudely ignored....so I guess I'm out! but I can live with that, like DEN, I'm not malicious and I would feel uncomfortable being nasty to another poster, I'm not a racist nor a "hand-wringer", I have been asked why do I only star people who agree with me, I don't, I have manners, if that makes me "out" then I'm happy to be
Joy11
apparently they come in from Pakistan
arrested for (allegedly) plotting to blow up public places
AOG
Apparently these terrorists where planning to attack over the Easter period,
SgtRock
I won't hold my breath to see the likes of jake the peg, Quinlad and Gromit congratulating the work of our police and security services.
Just before we close our borders etc, does anyone not think we should wait until people are found guilty?
Or has that traditional British basis of law (Innocent until proved Guilty) no longer in force?
apparently they come in from Pakistan
arrested for (allegedly) plotting to blow up public places
AOG
Apparently these terrorists where planning to attack over the Easter period,
SgtRock
I won't hold my breath to see the likes of jake the peg, Quinlad and Gromit congratulating the work of our police and security services.
Just before we close our borders etc, does anyone not think we should wait until people are found guilty?
Or has that traditional British basis of law (Innocent until proved Guilty) no longer in force?
Can't quite see the point in your latest post jake.
Apparently these terrorists where planning to attack over the Easter period,
apparently they come in from Pakistan
arrested for (allegedly) plotting to blow up public places
Both myself and joy11 used the word apparently in it's correct context, that is what was reported.
And as joy11 has already said she did not directly accuse, she used the word allegedly.
The only one that maybe you were right to critize was the post from Sgt.Rock. Maybe he should have put if found guity after the likes of jake the peg, Quinlad and Gromit congratulating the work of our police and security services.
But eh! this is really nit-picking after all the authorities still need congratulating on their swift action.
Just before we close our borders etc, does anyone not think we should wait until people are found guilty?
So you do agree jake, that the border needs closing if and when these people are found guilty?
Apparently these terrorists where planning to attack over the Easter period,
apparently they come in from Pakistan
arrested for (allegedly) plotting to blow up public places
Both myself and joy11 used the word apparently in it's correct context, that is what was reported.
And as joy11 has already said she did not directly accuse, she used the word allegedly.
The only one that maybe you were right to critize was the post from Sgt.Rock. Maybe he should have put if found guity after the likes of jake the peg, Quinlad and Gromit congratulating the work of our police and security services.
But eh! this is really nit-picking after all the authorities still need congratulating on their swift action.
Just before we close our borders etc, does anyone not think we should wait until people are found guilty?
So you do agree jake, that the border needs closing if and when these people are found guilty?
Not sure why you are calling me Jake AOG but still.
The point is that arrests have been made and that we don't know the outcome yet, however:
Joy: but we need to tighten up
AOG: We have got to act now
Your whole post was about disallowing nationals of this county to stop travelling to another ally country.
You are happy to restrict travel despite the fact that you don't even know if this case has any merit.
How simple do you have to be to allow legislation to take place (or be proposed) on something that has not been proved.
Certainly last year, facts showed that of all the people arrested under terrorist charges, less than 5% of people were even charged let alone convicted.
If this proves to be a non existence case, will you be happy that our countries policies have been altered?
The point is that arrests have been made and that we don't know the outcome yet, however:
Joy: but we need to tighten up
AOG: We have got to act now
Your whole post was about disallowing nationals of this county to stop travelling to another ally country.
You are happy to restrict travel despite the fact that you don't even know if this case has any merit.
How simple do you have to be to allow legislation to take place (or be proposed) on something that has not been proved.
Certainly last year, facts showed that of all the people arrested under terrorist charges, less than 5% of people were even charged let alone convicted.
If this proves to be a non existence case, will you be happy that our countries policies have been altered?
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