ChatterBank1 min ago
How Long Will It Take Before Our Lords & Masters Accept The Bleedin’ Obvious Of What An Absolute Disaster Brexit Is?
Not for Brexiteer viewing – I’m looking forward to the video that covers August of this year.
Can things get any worse?
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Can things get any worse?
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//I’m still waiting for the Brexit benefits to manifest and come to fruition.//
For me, the main benefit (and the only one of any real interest to me) is that the UK is no longer a member of the European Union. I'd been waiting for it for almost thirty years. The rest is just noise which will all come out in the wash. If you believed anything politicians (of any persuasion) told you, then you were foolish.
For me, the main benefit (and the only one of any real interest to me) is that the UK is no longer a member of the European Union. I'd been waiting for it for almost thirty years. The rest is just noise which will all come out in the wash. If you believed anything politicians (of any persuasion) told you, then you were foolish.
NJ; We know that your only reason for favouring Brexit is that it means we are out of the EU, and you have said many times that nothing else matters to you, be it economic problems or whatever. But, Brexit does (or can) mean things to other people less fortunate than you. If the UK economy suffers, than that might not bother you but it can be bad for others.
New Judge
//I’m still waiting for the Brexit benefits to manifest and come to fruition.//
/For me, the main benefit (and the only one of any real interest to me) is that the UK is no longer a member of the European Union./
Which means what, financially, economically, socially or otherwise?
That’s it? That’s your one benefit, that we’re not longer in a certain club??
Christ on a cross-trainer!
//I’m still waiting for the Brexit benefits to manifest and come to fruition.//
/For me, the main benefit (and the only one of any real interest to me) is that the UK is no longer a member of the European Union./
Which means what, financially, economically, socially or otherwise?
That’s it? That’s your one benefit, that we’re not longer in a certain club??
Christ on a cross-trainer!
//But, Brexit does (or can) mean things to other people less fortunate than you. If the UK economy suffers, than that might not bother you but it can be bad for others.//
I happen not to believe that in the long term the UK economy will suffer. But that is by the way - it wouldn't matter to me if it did. There are some things that you just do not do simply because it may be advantageous to do so. Belonging to the European Union is one of them because it is a pernicious, protectionist organisation. Its main, if not sole interests are stifling competition between its members and making it difficult and disadvantageous for those members to trade elsewhere.
But we've done all this and I've explained, with examples, my reasons for believing this many times. I know it's difficult to understand but it is what it is.
//Which means what, financially, economically, socially or otherwise?//
It means that we shall gradually become less entwined financially, economically and socially with an organisation that develops and promotes policies and regulations that may not suit the best interest of this country, its people, businesses and economy. In short, I like the UK government to decide what happens in the UK.
I happen not to believe that in the long term the UK economy will suffer. But that is by the way - it wouldn't matter to me if it did. There are some things that you just do not do simply because it may be advantageous to do so. Belonging to the European Union is one of them because it is a pernicious, protectionist organisation. Its main, if not sole interests are stifling competition between its members and making it difficult and disadvantageous for those members to trade elsewhere.
But we've done all this and I've explained, with examples, my reasons for believing this many times. I know it's difficult to understand but it is what it is.
//Which means what, financially, economically, socially or otherwise?//
It means that we shall gradually become less entwined financially, economically and socially with an organisation that develops and promotes policies and regulations that may not suit the best interest of this country, its people, businesses and economy. In short, I like the UK government to decide what happens in the UK.
//In short, I like the UK government to decide what happens in the UK.//
That’s going well with Rwanda and illegal immigration etc.
https:/
Whether we’re in the EU or not there are other organisations that are intrinsic to the modern world which will always rule above is in certain aspects(but you know that) so this idea of sovereignty and the ability to supposedly do as we please ended with the British Empire.
It’s a fallacy.
That’s going well with Rwanda and illegal immigration etc.
https:/
Whether we’re in the EU or not there are other organisations that are intrinsic to the modern world which will always rule above is in certain aspects(but you know that) so this idea of sovereignty and the ability to supposedly do as we please ended with the British Empire.
It’s a fallacy.
NJ; why the UK government? If the UK government changed from being Tory to being Labour or communist , would you still support them? If the EU were to try to restrain a UK commie govt and so work in your favour, would you still oppose that? If the EU were to stand firm against east European or Russian power, and if the UK had gone all leftie, would you welcome EU support or would you resist on principle.
//NJ; why the UK government? If the UK government changed from being Tory to being Labour or communist , would you still support them?//
I don't "support" any government. I expect them to support me. But I accept any government that is properly elected under the prevailing rules as the governing body of this country. My principles do not vanish if the government that is in power is not to my taste. As it happens I have not been too fond of some of the recent Tory governments and their policies but I accept them as the "least bad" option.
//If the EU were to try to restrain a UK commie govt and so work in your favour, would you still oppose that?//
Yes (see above).
If the EU were to stand firm against east European or Russian power, and if the UK had gone all leftie, would you welcome EU support or would you resist on principle.
I don't believe the EU has the mandate to do such a thing. It is an artificial construction with no democratic legitimacy. It should certainly not take decisions on foreign policy on behalf of its members but rather stick to tasks more appropriate to its standing, such as regulating the price of beetroot. The UK's foreign policy should be determined by the elected UK government and however unpalatable I might find it, I would accept it.
I came to the firm conclusion that I wanted the UK to leave the EU (regardless of the consequences) in 1992. Since then there have been periods where the UK government has not been at all to my liking and others where I believed we could have done much better. But I did not hanker after the EU (or any other "outside" body) to rescue the country from what was, in my view, an unsuitable government. Fortunately it doesn't work like that.
I don't "support" any government. I expect them to support me. But I accept any government that is properly elected under the prevailing rules as the governing body of this country. My principles do not vanish if the government that is in power is not to my taste. As it happens I have not been too fond of some of the recent Tory governments and their policies but I accept them as the "least bad" option.
//If the EU were to try to restrain a UK commie govt and so work in your favour, would you still oppose that?//
Yes (see above).
If the EU were to stand firm against east European or Russian power, and if the UK had gone all leftie, would you welcome EU support or would you resist on principle.
I don't believe the EU has the mandate to do such a thing. It is an artificial construction with no democratic legitimacy. It should certainly not take decisions on foreign policy on behalf of its members but rather stick to tasks more appropriate to its standing, such as regulating the price of beetroot. The UK's foreign policy should be determined by the elected UK government and however unpalatable I might find it, I would accept it.
I came to the firm conclusion that I wanted the UK to leave the EU (regardless of the consequences) in 1992. Since then there have been periods where the UK government has not been at all to my liking and others where I believed we could have done much better. But I did not hanker after the EU (or any other "outside" body) to rescue the country from what was, in my view, an unsuitable government. Fortunately it doesn't work like that.
the government want us to join CPTPP and will probably be successful… it will be interesting to see if brexists object to any of the compromises we will need to make on our sovereignty to join it (e.g. the limitations on state aid we will be allowed to give)… i predict that as if by magic those impingements on our sovereignty won’t matter any more.
""The Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership (CPTPP) is a free trade agreement, signed by 11 Asia-Pacific countries representing 13 percent of global GDP, that lowers barriers to trade in goods and services between member countries. Members pledged to eliminate almost all tariffs and import charges on each other's products and accepted common obligations on food regulations, environmental protections, the digital economy, investment, labor, and financial services, among others.""
They are likely to limit the amount of "State aid" that we can squander? Sounds like win, win, to me.
They are likely to limit the amount of "State aid" that we can squander? Sounds like win, win, to me.
I do not have an issue with joining CPTPP... seeing as we are now outside of the EU i think it seems like a good option for us... I just think it's interesting that Brexists don't really seem that bothered about the smidgeon of sovereignty that we'd have to give up to be in it...
... almost as though it wasn't ever about sovereignty in the first place... !
... almost as though it wasn't ever about sovereignty in the first place... !
//e.g. the limitations on state aid we will be allowed to give)//
The CPTPP is a totally different animal to the EU. It is principally a trade organisation with no political ambitions and does not seek to impose non-trade policies and regulations on its members. State aid is still permitted under its terms for what are traditionally "nationalised" (generally not for profit) concerns seen as "public services" such as transport. Where it does seek the compromises you mention is when dealing with "State Owned Enterprises". These are commercial enterprises aimed at profit and which compete in the same market as privately owned competitors.
CPTPP does not have a "Parliament", nor does it have a court which claims supremacy over those of its members, it does not offer freedom of movement, it does not operate a wealth distribution scheme, the passports issued by member nations do not have "Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership" emblazoned on the front cover. In short, it makes no claims to "statehood" but is simply a trading bloc with common standards for the goods traded. Comparing it to the EU is like comparing Securicor to the Metropolitan Police Force.
The CPTPP is a totally different animal to the EU. It is principally a trade organisation with no political ambitions and does not seek to impose non-trade policies and regulations on its members. State aid is still permitted under its terms for what are traditionally "nationalised" (generally not for profit) concerns seen as "public services" such as transport. Where it does seek the compromises you mention is when dealing with "State Owned Enterprises". These are commercial enterprises aimed at profit and which compete in the same market as privately owned competitors.
CPTPP does not have a "Parliament", nor does it have a court which claims supremacy over those of its members, it does not offer freedom of movement, it does not operate a wealth distribution scheme, the passports issued by member nations do not have "Comprehensive and Progressive Agreement for Trans-Pacific Partnership" emblazoned on the front cover. In short, it makes no claims to "statehood" but is simply a trading bloc with common standards for the goods traded. Comparing it to the EU is like comparing Securicor to the Metropolitan Police Force.
Ohh Dear. The rioting has started. Rampant inflation, fuel shortages, possible food shortages if it plays out for the full distance, and the EUSSR is doubling down on the climate scams. They are scare mongering Nitrogen now. Carbon Dioxide is so last year. Most legumes put Nitrogen into the soil and are considered by most common sense gardeners to be the friend of the farmer. But the eeyoo has a plan to raise their influence over its citizens by reducing the benefit to them. It is called starvation.
""Farmers in northern Belgium attempted to break into the town hall of Hoogstraten after staging a mass protest in response to the government’s EU-driven agenda to cut nitrogen emissions, as is being attempted in the Netherlands. The European Union’s Natura 2000 network, which mandates that the 27 member states must protect designated habitats in a “sustainable manner, both ecologically and economically,” and therefore must cut nitrogen emissions — spurring widespread unrest among the Dutch Farmers — has now spread to the heart of the EU in Belgium, with farmers driving their tractors to the centre of Hoogstraten on Monday evening. The protesters, who set fires on the street and attempted to stage a break-in of the city hall, were reportedly angered by the local government expressing support for the national government’s plan to impose limits on nitrogen, a move that would disproportionately impact the farming industry, the local Het Laatste Nieuws newspaper reported.""
""Farmers in northern Belgium attempted to break into the town hall of Hoogstraten after staging a mass protest in response to the government’s EU-driven agenda to cut nitrogen emissions, as is being attempted in the Netherlands. The European Union’s Natura 2000 network, which mandates that the 27 member states must protect designated habitats in a “sustainable manner, both ecologically and economically,” and therefore must cut nitrogen emissions — spurring widespread unrest among the Dutch Farmers — has now spread to the heart of the EU in Belgium, with farmers driving their tractors to the centre of Hoogstraten on Monday evening. The protesters, who set fires on the street and attempted to stage a break-in of the city hall, were reportedly angered by the local government expressing support for the national government’s plan to impose limits on nitrogen, a move that would disproportionately impact the farming industry, the local Het Laatste Nieuws newspaper reported.""
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