May Looks To The Public For Support For Deal

[naomi24]

In an attempt to go over the heads of MPs, a majority of whom have threatened to reject the agreement when it is voted on next month, Mrs May will take questions on BBC Radio 5 live and the BBC News Channel.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-46312909

Firstly, I’d be interested to know how the questions will be filtered and chosen, and secondly, if she gets the response she wants, what then? Will she go back to parliament and say, “There you are. A dozen or so selected members of the public say they agree with me”?

So what? What difference does she think that will make?

[Togo]

Well well the ex Home Secretary is now, just like the "service" that she helped to ruin, asking for the help of the public. Would this be the public that both she and they have consistently ignored in their respective quests to marginalise, in the name of pc claptrap and deceitful cant? Thanks, but No Thanks. She, and they, can rot in their relevant hells as far as I am concerned.

[naomi24]

Jim, Brexit is a mess because Remainers, and that includes Mrs May, didn’t want Brexit, and have done all they can think of to make sure it doesn't happen.

[jim360]

There's no sense in believing that. May signed Article 50 -- if she wanted to stop Brexit she should simply not have signed it. Theresa May negotiated with the EU; if she wanted to stop Brexit, she should simply never have turned up. Theresa May introduced, and passed, the necessary legislation. If she had wanted to stop Brexit, then all she -- and, while we are at it, all Parliament -- needed to do was never introduce that bill.

In point of fact, then, Theresa May has barely even scratched the surface of the things she could have done to thwart Brexit; instead, she has somewhat doggedly, and in spite of opposition from all sides, tried to put together a version of it. It's a rubbish version, and everybody hates it, but hey -- it's the only version anyone has been able to come up with. Let me again remind you that all Brexiteers seem to have been able to do is heckle from the sidelines -- not because they were forced to be on the sidelines, but because they have *chosen* to be there. Gove, and Johnson, and Davis, and Fox, and Leadsom, and Rees-Mogg, and more -- none of them have been brave enough, none of them has had the stomach even to try. Thwarted by nothing more than their own lack of courage and ability -- not by anyone else, but by themselves.

How the tables have turned. It wasn't so long ago when you were defending May from such accusations, and claiming loudly and confidently that she was getting on with the job and was going to deliver:

"Quite refreshing for a politician to put the will of the people before their own personal politics... she said some time ago that she voted to remain but that she will do the job expected of her." ( https://www.theanswerbank.co.uk/News/Question1574609.html )

"I admire Mrs May. I think she has the most difficult job of any Prime Minister since at least World War II and she's doing it with dignity." ( https://www.theanswerbank.co.uk/News/Question1571934-2.html )

It's not unreasonable for you to have changed your mind since, but still, it seems worth remembering how far we've come from those days.

[naomi24]

Jim, //if she wanted to stop Brexit she should simply not have signed it.//

Best laugh I’ve had all day! How to make friends and influence people!

//It's not unreasonable for you to have changed your mind since,//

Indeed it isn’t. I gave her the benefit of the doubt. I was mistaken.

// but still, it seems worth remembering how far we've come from those days.//

How could we forget?

Incidentally, I still think she has the most difficult job of any Prime Minister since at least World War II – but dignity is a thing of the past for her. She's blown it.

(That's some archive you keep, Jim).

[Davemano]

I thought May had to trigger Article 50 because it was the decision of all parties, who had to vote for it, and it was passed.

[jim360]

I don't make a point of keeping an archive, by the way, it's just a memory thing. I remembered what your position was -- to be fair, I should perhaps also add that you have consistently been convinced that at some point Brexiteers would get "stitched up", or some such phrase -- and then just needed to find examples for it.

Not sure why you're laughing, though. If Theresa May had never notified the EU of intention to leave under Article 50, would that not have, by definition, killed Brexit stone dead?

[jim360]

In answer to the last post before mine: no, not exactly. The text of the Act is that "The Prime Minister may notify, under Article 50(2) of the Treaty on European Union, the United Kingdom’s intention to withdraw from the EU." (My italics) -- it therefore follows that she didn't have to. And, of course, she might never have brought the relevant Act before Parliament in the first place.

I do agree that there's little comfort to be drawn from this for Brexiteers, but the simple fact is that Theresa May has had ample opportunity to stop Brexit from even happening by simply doing nothing from the start. The fact that she started the process -- and, even now, is insistent that we *are*, no matter what, leaving the EU on March 29th next year -- seems to me to rather go against any idea that she's been working from within to thwart the process.

If, however, that is indeed her plan, then she's done a rotten job of it quite frankly.

[naomi24]

Jim, you're right. I always thought we would be stitched up ... but if you're not sure why I'm laughing tell me how she could have refused to sign .... and retained a career in politics?

[Davemano]

Further to my 22.57 post.
20th January 2017.

Supreme court rules parliament must have vote to trigger article 50 ...

[jim360]

A fair question, Naomi, but then wouldn't it be refreshing to have a Prime Minister who put what they felt to be best for the country ahead of their own career? Obviously there's a great deal of bias in defining "best for the country", here... but, that aside, it would at least have allowed someone else to sign Article 50 who actually believed in it.

I'm generally of the opinion, though, that the problem is the policy, rather than the person who's tried to deliver it.

[Davemano]

^^^ This was from the Gina Miller challenge.

[naomi24]

Not a little ducking and diving going on there, Jim.

Quite right, davemano. After all the stupid fuss Gina Miller caused, it's good to know that someone remembers.

[Jackdaw33]

Je me rends.

[jim360]

I also remember the Supreme Court case.

No, not really ducking and diving. It's a simple statement of fact that there was always the option to not give notification, and that not signing would certainly have been quite a simple and effective way to avoid Brexit.

The ultimate conspiracy theory, I suppose, is that by deliberately rushing the process and making a pig's breakfast of the whole thing, then people would be turned off the idea and change their minds just in time. But, of course, no-one could take such a theory seriously.

[Jackdaw33]

The standard expression is a dog's breakfast, not a pig's.

[jim360]

I've heard both -- I had in mind Sir Humphrey when I was typing it -- but yes, apparently it is. Must remember that.

[Davemano]

This is the 'pig' one.
make a pig's ear of something" in English. to do something badly, wrongly, or awkwardly:

[Old_Geezer]

Looks as if Spain may have let us down. Unsure if Sanchez just crumbled or whether May's promised to give even more away. So, looks like we're relying on the HoC to save the nation now. The public don't get to vote so no point appealing to them.