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Ukip And The Next General Election
Serious question...and this is not another UKIP-bashing threads. This is something I'm geniunely interested in...
Do those who support UKIP actually want them to win the next General Election, or do you want them to give the Tories and Labour such a bloody nose as to make them re-think (and prioritise) a referendum on membership of the EU?
Alternatively, if it were a hung parliament, would you be in favour of a UKIP/Conservative or (bizzare as it may seem at this point) a UKIP/Labour coalition?
Do those who support UKIP actually want them to win the next General Election, or do you want them to give the Tories and Labour such a bloody nose as to make them re-think (and prioritise) a referendum on membership of the EU?
Alternatively, if it were a hung parliament, would you be in favour of a UKIP/Conservative or (bizzare as it may seem at this point) a UKIP/Labour coalition?
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I don't want to debate whether staying in the EU or leaving is best for Britain, as there are arguments on both sides. But there is one group of people for whom leaving would be catastrophic...UKIP. There complete raison d'etre would be lost overnight ! This is mainly based on Farage's oft-quoted
statement that if Britain were to leave, UKIP would have done its job and made itself redundant.
statement that if Britain were to leave, UKIP would have done its job and made itself redundant.
DrF...I fear that we might have to agree to disagree regarding fox-hunting, but how would voting UKIP in a Local Council or Euro election achieve that ?
Wouldn't UKIP have to win a General Election, in order to reverse the existing Fox Hunting laws ? Perhaps he could restore the morning milk to our schoolchildren at the same time ? ( I've forgotten who snatched the milk away from kids in the first place......no..don't help me....its on the tip of my tongue )
Wouldn't UKIP have to win a General Election, in order to reverse the existing Fox Hunting laws ? Perhaps he could restore the morning milk to our schoolchildren at the same time ? ( I've forgotten who snatched the milk away from kids in the first place......no..don't help me....its on the tip of my tongue )
Naomi sums it up well..
// Few would want Ukip to win a general election, but many would like the main parties to adopt a similar stance to Ukip's on immigration and the EU - that's what this current protest vote is all about. //
They're not a party that you'd want running the country. They're a pressure group for those issues which the other parties ignore public opinion on.
They've had some success as well - the only reason any of the other three are talking about EU referendums and border control is because they're scared of losing votes to UKIP.
If UKIP weren't there I suspect we wouldn't be hearing a single word from any of them on those things.
// Few would want Ukip to win a general election, but many would like the main parties to adopt a similar stance to Ukip's on immigration and the EU - that's what this current protest vote is all about. //
They're not a party that you'd want running the country. They're a pressure group for those issues which the other parties ignore public opinion on.
They've had some success as well - the only reason any of the other three are talking about EU referendums and border control is because they're scared of losing votes to UKIP.
If UKIP weren't there I suspect we wouldn't be hearing a single word from any of them on those things.
// As I remember the issue of whether to have a in/out referendum or not comes up at regular intervals, and has done for many
years. //
Not with any degree of seriousness mikey. Backbenchers would mention it every now and then, and everyone would just ignore them.
Now there's somewhere else you can direct your vote, suddenly there's talk of commitments to a referendum with x years, getting tough on immigration, British jobs for British workers (Gordon Brown that one), etc etc.
years. //
Not with any degree of seriousness mikey. Backbenchers would mention it every now and then, and everyone would just ignore them.
Now there's somewhere else you can direct your vote, suddenly there's talk of commitments to a referendum with x years, getting tough on immigration, British jobs for British workers (Gordon Brown that one), etc etc.
I agree also that few sane people want UKIP actually running the country.
I also disagree though that the other parties should kowtow to them on the EU and immigration. The first point really emphasises that. Europe and immigration are simply not big enough issues to force people to vote UKIP at a General Election (and I will just mention again that the latest YouGov poll shows a majority in favour of staying in the EU).
The election is liable to be decided by the economy. If it's doing well more people are likely to vote Tory (and Lib Dem) .
I also disagree though that the other parties should kowtow to them on the EU and immigration. The first point really emphasises that. Europe and immigration are simply not big enough issues to force people to vote UKIP at a General Election (and I will just mention again that the latest YouGov poll shows a majority in favour of staying in the EU).
The election is liable to be decided by the economy. If it's doing well more people are likely to vote Tory (and Lib Dem) .
ichkeria...you are right of course, apart from your last sentence maybe.
The coalition have been telling us that the economy has been doing well for a while now. They have also said that unemployment is coming down. But dave still lost badly yesterday, and that is the point of my posts here today.
Why did dave lose ? Could it be that not enough people believed the things that he has been saying in my 2nd paragraph perhaps ?
The coalition have been telling us that the economy has been doing well for a while now. They have also said that unemployment is coming down. But dave still lost badly yesterday, and that is the point of my posts here today.
Why did dave lose ? Could it be that not enough people believed the things that he has been saying in my 2nd paragraph perhaps ?
But then the thing is that the party in power at the time of Local and European Elections often fares badly -- it seems that most of the time it's a chance to stick two fingers up at the government. The Conservatives did rather well in the 2009 European Elections. More than likely this wasn't because of what they were saying (after all, since when has the Conservative Party ever been very clear on what it wants in Europe?), but because they weren't in office.
Perhaps after all the LibDems can weather this storm and come out not too badly in 2015, but we'll see. It's hard to see them gaining many seats, though they might not get slaughtered. It's a long year ahead, anyway, for politics.
Perhaps after all the LibDems can weather this storm and come out not too badly in 2015, but we'll see. It's hard to see them gaining many seats, though they might not get slaughtered. It's a long year ahead, anyway, for politics.
Naturally they are worth putting up with for 4 years to get done what the public clearly wants done. But that is academic since I don't believe any party would achieve a rise that meteoric.
In the unfortunate event of a hung parliament, the idea is that the party with the largest number of elected members is asked to try to form a government, and ideally, in this awful party system we have, they should do so alone; but with an eye on the need to be fractionally more democratic than usual and ensure their policies bring the majority of the house with them. Should the largest party opt for coalition with UKIP, or anyone else, then that is for those involved to decide.
In the unfortunate event of a hung parliament, the idea is that the party with the largest number of elected members is asked to try to form a government, and ideally, in this awful party system we have, they should do so alone; but with an eye on the need to be fractionally more democratic than usual and ensure their policies bring the majority of the house with them. Should the largest party opt for coalition with UKIP, or anyone else, then that is for those involved to decide.
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