Rowan Williams: Christians In The West Are Not Being Persecuted

[Kromovaracun]

http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2013/aug/15/rowan-williams-persecuted-christians-grow-up

More specifically, the former Archbishop said he felt Western Christians needed to 'grow up' and had no idea what real persecution was.

Agree or disagree?

Furthermore, could this also be said about the rest of the population? To me, it often seems in political arguments that any attempt to challenge someone's views immediately translates into trying to "silence" them.

Should we be more careful about pretending we are persecuted?

[Kromovaracun]

As an addendum, I think it's probably also advisableto be more careful about using words like "hardening their position" in relation to homosexuality...

[Zacs-Master]

He was good in Mork and Mindy though.

[jno]

I read that, but wondered who these self-proclaimed persecutees were. I suppose he hears a lot more from them than I do; but I've never come across any.

[askyourgran]

He's away with the fairies (in the nicest possible way of course).

[Gromit]

He'll be crucified for saying that.

[Kromovaracun]

jno:

I seem to remember similar talk of persecution when the B&B controversy came up. Plus maybe I'm prone to hearing it more often because I'm one of those people who tends to argue with street preachers (who are often nuts and therefore aren't terribly representative).

But it's more than just Christians who are fond of pretending they are being persecuted - it always seems to be the case on AB that if you challenge someone's opinion, you're trying to 'silence' them or 'stifle free speech', and I've noticed a similar attitude in my older friends family (though curiously I've yet to notice it in people my own age).

[janbee]

He should never have left Take That.

[DTCwordfan]

Typical pontification by the wild, woolly Welsh goat. So why didn't he come out with this when in office and confronted by the likes of the Marazion b and b case, the Chester one, the issue of wearing crosses on BA or in hospitals - and then issues such as priest abuse? The Church was left weak by him and maybe Welby will prove to be of sterner and more forthright opinions, as the leader of the Church should exemplify.

[anotheoldgit]

Perhaps he should first ask why a certain other religion is persecuted?

[Octavius]

I think in society today, the first form of defence is to 'play the victim' presumably to gain simpering support and to rally the troops to surge forward under a populist ideal.

You see it on AB a lot as well. So yes, I agree.

[ummmm]

And I agree with Octavius.

We're surrounded by wimps who can't handle anyone disagreeing with them. Voice your disagreement and you're labelled a bully.

[anotheoldgit]

/// it always seems to be the case on AB that if you challenge someone's opinion, you're trying to 'silence' them or 'stifle free speech', and I've noticed a similar attitude in my older friends family ///

There are different ways of challenging one's opinion, but the way some on AB go about it is to ridicule and insult anyone who dares to oppose their one sided views.

/// (though curiously I've yet to notice it in people my own age). ///

Could that perhaps be because the young mostly always consider themselves to be right?

Ask any parent or grandparent

[ummmm]

//Could that perhaps be because the young mostly always consider themselves to be right?

Ask any parent or grandparent//

I'm a parent and the answer is no, they don't consider themselves to be mostly right. What a warped view of the younger generation you have.

[anotheoldgit]

ummmm

/// I'm a parent and the answer is no, they don't consider themselves to be mostly right. What a warped view of the younger generation you have. ///

Why do you find the need to be so aggressive, I refer to you classing my tongue in the cheek remark about the young, as being a 'WARPED' view of the younger generation.

You, yourself must be unique if you have never found it necessary to oppose your children's views when they adamantly insist that they are right.

I wonder what your partners views are on 'Women always being right'?

[anotheoldgit]

ummmm

No answer to that one eh?

[ummmm]

I didn't see you answer...

1) I'm not aggressive.

2) You seem to view younger generations as a generation of delinquents running around in gangs stabbing each other because it 'didn't happen in your day'

3) My children (young adults) don't 'insist' they are right. They may think the are right but are completely open to reasonable debate and can take on board other peoples opposing opinions.

As far as I'm aware, and through experience, most youngsters are the same.

I blame it on the fact that I taught them how to knit yogurt from a very young age!

[ummmm]

//I wonder what your partners views are on 'Women always being right'?//

He doesn't have a view. He does as he's told!!

Joking :-)

If I said previously that women are always right then I would have been joking. My partner is a very reasonable man but he's no push over and he's not shy in pointing out that I might be wrong.

[ummmm]

AOG.

No answer to that one eh?

[Kromovaracun]

"Could that perhaps be because the young mostly always consider themselves to be right? "

Some do. But I'm willing to bet I know more younger people today than you do, AOG, and my experience is actually that as a general tendency, younger people are far more willing to discuss their opinions, freely admit when they have holes kicked in them, and change them if they think it's appropriate.

Of course, it should be noted that I tend to hang around with young people who are a bit more mild-mannered than average, but despite what the majority perception seems to be, there's plenty of those around.

Likewise, I've met some incredibly pig-headed, ignorant and actually rather stupid people who happened to be old. This does not suggest that all elderly people are like this, all I'm saying is that I'm not convinced that one's age has all that much effect on one's intelligence.