ChatterBank3 mins ago
Arithmetic?
I am alarmed at the amount of mind numbingly simple arithmetic questions being asked on here, not because of the people asking them but because clearly the education system is not actually educating kids any more. I mean they all know how many benefits they can claim and how to get each other up the duff do they can get a council flat and more benefits but 2+2? forget it! Perhaps I'm wrong the system is actually equiping the kids to be able to stripe the system effectively! So what happenned to the 3 Rs?
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I was looking at a 15 year old's maths homework recently and was quite appalled at the very low standard. I had left school and been working for a year by the time I was 15, but my standard of maths education was much higher.
I am more concerned that the people who ask simple maths equations here are obviously using a computer so can have no idea how to use the calculator that is part of Windows accessories, or the google calculator for that matter.
I am more concerned that the people who ask simple maths equations here are obviously using a computer so can have no idea how to use the calculator that is part of Windows accessories, or the google calculator for that matter.
There are so many people who don't understand the basics - fractions and percentages especially.
I was was under the impression that when filing something under a person's name it was filed under the surname initially and then under the first name. This has apparently changed in the 25+ years since I left school.
Back in my day................ I must be getting old.
I was was under the impression that when filing something under a person's name it was filed under the surname initially and then under the first name. This has apparently changed in the 25+ years since I left school.
Back in my day................ I must be getting old.
I quite agree, geezer.
A recent example posted under �Science�:
�I have done 234.9 miles. used 33.85 litres. Can someone please tell me miles per gallon.�
The questioner obviously drives and is thus over 17. Occasionally, when I see such questions I ask �what were you taught at school?� or something similar. Not because I�m being offensive, but because I�m generally interested to learn what on earth children are taught during the eleven (soon to be thirteen) years they undergo compulsory education.
I believe that education levels have slipped down by at least two or three years in the last 30 years or so. When I was at primary school every pupil could read and write fluently by age eight or nine, and most of them at a lot earlier age than that. It was unheard of for any of my contemporaries to be illiterate. They did not all go on to be brain surgeons or barristers, but they could all read, write and add up.
I�ve seen recent (so-called) �A� Level papers. I could have passed most of them when I was 14. With the exception of courses such as medicine or veterinary science (which are still, thankfully, onerous) University education today (just about) brings students up to what I believe to be �A� Level, but only in �traditional� subjects. Other degree courses such as �Films� or �Media� are all but useless.
The reasons are manifold, but, particularly in primary schools, the number of pupils without English as a first language, and the lack of parental support (my parents taught me to read before I went near a school) must be much to blame.
I sometimes genuinely despair at the poor education that is being provided to large numbers of children in this country. As A taxpayer, I�m also extremely angry. State education is costing a fortune (�82bn this year) and, with one or two notable exceptions, it�s generally rubbish.
A recent example posted under �Science�:
�I have done 234.9 miles. used 33.85 litres. Can someone please tell me miles per gallon.�
The questioner obviously drives and is thus over 17. Occasionally, when I see such questions I ask �what were you taught at school?� or something similar. Not because I�m being offensive, but because I�m generally interested to learn what on earth children are taught during the eleven (soon to be thirteen) years they undergo compulsory education.
I believe that education levels have slipped down by at least two or three years in the last 30 years or so. When I was at primary school every pupil could read and write fluently by age eight or nine, and most of them at a lot earlier age than that. It was unheard of for any of my contemporaries to be illiterate. They did not all go on to be brain surgeons or barristers, but they could all read, write and add up.
I�ve seen recent (so-called) �A� Level papers. I could have passed most of them when I was 14. With the exception of courses such as medicine or veterinary science (which are still, thankfully, onerous) University education today (just about) brings students up to what I believe to be �A� Level, but only in �traditional� subjects. Other degree courses such as �Films� or �Media� are all but useless.
The reasons are manifold, but, particularly in primary schools, the number of pupils without English as a first language, and the lack of parental support (my parents taught me to read before I went near a school) must be much to blame.
I sometimes genuinely despair at the poor education that is being provided to large numbers of children in this country. As A taxpayer, I�m also extremely angry. State education is costing a fortune (�82bn this year) and, with one or two notable exceptions, it�s generally rubbish.
Why do we still use gallons? Imperial gallon= 4.54609 litres.We sell the fuel in litres.Why do we use miles? The Canadians manage without them.
Do children memorise the 'times table'? If not, that may explain a lot..
The miles per gallon calculation is quite daunting for a pre-metric bloke like me. How long did it take New Judge to do his example using long division? 'In your head' it's double the litres and divide by 9 so that's roughly 7.5 (or seven and a half) into 234.9 Double everything to make it easier: near enough 470 to divide by 15, so it's 31.3 mpg (near enough)Old timers are allowed to say " 31 and a third" to make them feel better (and superior,!).Who on Earth would bother when calculators are everywhere they'd ever need to do it? [Correct answer is 31.5]
Who uses fractions nowadays,apart from in speech ( I trust our innumerate children recognize them as 0.5, 0.25 etc ) ? Nobody expects anybody to work out three and three quarter metres at one and fourth fifths of a pound by multiplying the fractions (unlike in my school days, with the added fun that the metres were feet and inches and the pound 20 shillings of 12 pence)
There is no excuse if our children can't do standard , straightforward metric calculations in their heads. A plot 30 metres by 120 metres must be 0.36 hectare (try that using 30 yards by 120 yards in acres!)
Do children memorise the 'times table'? If not, that may explain a lot..
The miles per gallon calculation is quite daunting for a pre-metric bloke like me. How long did it take New Judge to do his example using long division? 'In your head' it's double the litres and divide by 9 so that's roughly 7.5 (or seven and a half) into 234.9 Double everything to make it easier: near enough 470 to divide by 15, so it's 31.3 mpg (near enough)Old timers are allowed to say " 31 and a third" to make them feel better (and superior,!).Who on Earth would bother when calculators are everywhere they'd ever need to do it? [Correct answer is 31.5]
Who uses fractions nowadays,apart from in speech ( I trust our innumerate children recognize them as 0.5, 0.25 etc ) ? Nobody expects anybody to work out three and three quarter metres at one and fourth fifths of a pound by multiplying the fractions (unlike in my school days, with the added fun that the metres were feet and inches and the pound 20 shillings of 12 pence)
There is no excuse if our children can't do standard , straightforward metric calculations in their heads. A plot 30 metres by 120 metres must be 0.36 hectare (try that using 30 yards by 120 yards in acres!)
-- answer removed --
I was being served in a supermarket recently, when the young lad cashier on the next till, stood up and asked the woman serving me how much change he should give his customer.
The bill was for �2. 27, and the customer had given him �5. 27. but because he had tilled in that she had given him the amount of �2.27 he couldnt figure out how much change he owed her. 'Im no good at sums' he said.
Because the till didnt tell him how much change to give. He wasnt able to deduct �2.27 from �5. 27.
Quite worrying really.
The bill was for �2. 27, and the customer had given him �5. 27. but because he had tilled in that she had given him the amount of �2.27 he couldnt figure out how much change he owed her. 'Im no good at sums' he said.
Because the till didnt tell him how much change to give. He wasnt able to deduct �2.27 from �5. 27.
Quite worrying really.
Well, fred, nobody said anything about this calculation being done in one�s head. In fact, if lizzyminto (who posed the question) needs to ask how to perform the calculation, I would not in my wildest dreams imagine (s)he is able to do the arithmetic mentally.
The details of the required calculation are unimportant. I cited it just as an example to support geezer�s alarm at the lack of skill that seems to be endemic. Interestingly, I found another even more alarming, this time bizarrely posted under �Business & Finance�:
http://www.theanswerbank.co.uk/Business-and-Fi nance/Question710437.html
The reason we use gallons is that it is a convenient measure for bulk liquids. Few people know how many miles to the litre their car does. Manufacturers provide consumption figures as �litres consumed per 100 kilometres� � absolutely useless. This is manifestly obvious from lizzyminto�s need to know the fuel consumption in miles per gallon. The reasons we use miles are:
- It is illegal in this country to provide roadsigns in anything else.
- Car speedometers are calibrated in miles per hour
- Speed limits are quoted in miles per hour
Some of the things you mention are symptoms of enforced metrication foisted upon an unwilling populace. Nobody wanted to buy retails goods in kilograms and grams. Nobody wanted their children to have to do so. People were perfectly content to buy fuel in gallons and continue to be happy measuring their journeys in miles and their football pitch dimensions in yards.
But I digress. Whatever calculations are necessary, people seem singularly ill-equipped to deal with them.
The details of the required calculation are unimportant. I cited it just as an example to support geezer�s alarm at the lack of skill that seems to be endemic. Interestingly, I found another even more alarming, this time bizarrely posted under �Business & Finance�:
http://www.theanswerbank.co.uk/Business-and-Fi nance/Question710437.html
The reason we use gallons is that it is a convenient measure for bulk liquids. Few people know how many miles to the litre their car does. Manufacturers provide consumption figures as �litres consumed per 100 kilometres� � absolutely useless. This is manifestly obvious from lizzyminto�s need to know the fuel consumption in miles per gallon. The reasons we use miles are:
- It is illegal in this country to provide roadsigns in anything else.
- Car speedometers are calibrated in miles per hour
- Speed limits are quoted in miles per hour
Some of the things you mention are symptoms of enforced metrication foisted upon an unwilling populace. Nobody wanted to buy retails goods in kilograms and grams. Nobody wanted their children to have to do so. People were perfectly content to buy fuel in gallons and continue to be happy measuring their journeys in miles and their football pitch dimensions in yards.
But I digress. Whatever calculations are necessary, people seem singularly ill-equipped to deal with them.
New Judge the "12% of �550 " example is definitely alarming.l.The mpg one didn't concern me as much, because the writer appeared to, or may have been, asking for the easy formula (it's 'multiply litres by 0.22', which I never thought of, then divide).She might be able to that (in her head, perhaps) to a close enough figure
Incidentally, do you mean you yourself can't translate litres per 100km into mpg? That's easy LOL.The litres/100km is,of course, the way this is given in metric countries.No doubt your car's makers originate in one (as we haven't got big true British makers)
Sadly, adults of all ages don't seem to understand what 'an increase of 200 per cent means' [.Is the result twice the original figure or three times it ( or neither?)]
My daughter , then aged about 16, once asked her mother what a 'lub' was.We suddenly felt very ancient ! She'd found a cookbook of her grandmother's , which referred to a lb (or 'lub! ').No recipe she'd ever seen in any cookbook was not in kilos and gms and she'd only have encountered the Latin abbreviation for pound, if ever, in history! She was born in 1987 ( privately educated throughout and was then at a top ' girls' public school' ) Anyway, this got a letter published in The Times, in reply to those antediluvian souls who wanted to preserve imperial measures in everything !
Imperial measurements are convenient because that's what you were used to.They're no use for any maths, even everyday arithmetic.The reason, I suspect, why we don't use miles on road signs (but do on information signs for pedestrians) is simply cost (And a 50 speed limit would show 80, which might confuse people, though 50/80 or 80/50 might not do so as much).
The same daughter was pleased to discover what 'a stone' really was (she'd heard people talking of stones, of course) because, as she put it 'The weight sounds so much less!'
Incidentally, do you mean you yourself can't translate litres per 100km into mpg? That's easy LOL.The litres/100km is,of course, the way this is given in metric countries.No doubt your car's makers originate in one (as we haven't got big true British makers)
Sadly, adults of all ages don't seem to understand what 'an increase of 200 per cent means' [.Is the result twice the original figure or three times it ( or neither?)]
My daughter , then aged about 16, once asked her mother what a 'lub' was.We suddenly felt very ancient ! She'd found a cookbook of her grandmother's , which referred to a lb (or 'lub! ').No recipe she'd ever seen in any cookbook was not in kilos and gms and she'd only have encountered the Latin abbreviation for pound, if ever, in history! She was born in 1987 ( privately educated throughout and was then at a top ' girls' public school' ) Anyway, this got a letter published in The Times, in reply to those antediluvian souls who wanted to preserve imperial measures in everything !
Imperial measurements are convenient because that's what you were used to.They're no use for any maths, even everyday arithmetic.The reason, I suspect, why we don't use miles on road signs (but do on information signs for pedestrians) is simply cost (And a 50 speed limit would show 80, which might confuse people, though 50/80 or 80/50 might not do so as much).
The same daughter was pleased to discover what 'a stone' really was (she'd heard people talking of stones, of course) because, as she put it 'The weight sounds so much less!'
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