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Local History - Walsall
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Is anyone familiar with the Park Hall area of Walsall and it's history? It's an 1950s/60s estate but have lots of straight narrow pathways that run between many of the gardens rather than the gardens being back to back .... why would this be? Are they ancient footpaths or field boundaries?
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Thanks Dot, but they are not behind every row of houses and the gardens have no rear gates, so think the bin emptying is unlikley to be honest - plus no one there can remember anything other than the bins going out the front into the road.... the major path does connect to a public footpath across an adjoining field ... but others just seem to be short cuts to avoid closes and long blocks etc ... any other ideas?
Without more location detail it's difficult to research closer - but I guess this may have been something intended by the builders/planners that quickly became defunct. For example, coal deliveries. Or the local planning reg's of the time may have insisted on a rear access to the gardens.
From what I can see of the area, it consists of large arcing avenues very typical of 1950s onwards, and these were often built on a large purchase of many farms rather than the older pattern of builders buying up a field at a time, hence they tend not to reflect field patterns as closely.
Much also depends on where the paths lead to/from. If they are simply allowing access to the backs of the houses they aren't likely to be pre-existing rights of way. If they link up with other lanes, perhaps features such as railway footbridges or canal bridges, then this is a clue that they are part of an older route that had to be accommodated by the builders.
If you give me a reasonably local postcode, or a specific couple of street names, I'll look further.
From what I can see of the area, it consists of large arcing avenues very typical of 1950s onwards, and these were often built on a large purchase of many farms rather than the older pattern of builders buying up a field at a time, hence they tend not to reflect field patterns as closely.
Much also depends on where the paths lead to/from. If they are simply allowing access to the backs of the houses they aren't likely to be pre-existing rights of way. If they link up with other lanes, perhaps features such as railway footbridges or canal bridges, then this is a clue that they are part of an older route that had to be accommodated by the builders.
If you give me a reasonably local postcode, or a specific couple of street names, I'll look further.
Thanks Lil O'Lady - WS5 3EY is the postcode of the local off licence. ... so this should allow you to view a map The main footpath runs from near the "dead end" of Woodend Road (also WS5) and passes behind/near Truro Road and Bude Road - and finally crosses one field and joins with SKip Lane in the rural section between the S bend that you will see on the map and the junction with Barr Lakes Lane ... there are other paths but this is the main one.
Thanks in advance.
Thanks in advance.
If you look at this link to the 1890 OS map
http://www.old-maps.co.uk/Map1Enlarge.aspx
you can see that it seems, as you originally thought, that these are older rights of way that had to be respected by the builders. Daisy Bank crescent appears to have been built inside a land plot defined to the east by a lane that runs from Gillity Greaves to Sutton Road, and this lane is now part of the fottpath network you have noticed.
Judging from the lack of chimneys on google earth, the houses to the east of this back lane were built some time after the daisy bank ones - the back lane would have been part of the boundary defining the newer housing estate.
You can also see how the lane system further east was used as a parliamentary boundary - if you dig deep enough in the records, you may even find that this is a very ancient boundary going back to Saxon times. I'm not saying it is, but it is sometimes the case, that older manorial or burgh boundaries simply carried on in the landscape.
Have fun with the old-maps website - what is intriguing about these footpaths is that they seem to have existed before the canal, as many of them run over the canal on footbridges.
If the spirit moves you, there should also be a rights of way officer at your town hall who can help you with queries about footpaths.
What an interesting area you live in!
http://www.old-maps.co.uk/Map1Enlarge.aspx
you can see that it seems, as you originally thought, that these are older rights of way that had to be respected by the builders. Daisy Bank crescent appears to have been built inside a land plot defined to the east by a lane that runs from Gillity Greaves to Sutton Road, and this lane is now part of the fottpath network you have noticed.
Judging from the lack of chimneys on google earth, the houses to the east of this back lane were built some time after the daisy bank ones - the back lane would have been part of the boundary defining the newer housing estate.
You can also see how the lane system further east was used as a parliamentary boundary - if you dig deep enough in the records, you may even find that this is a very ancient boundary going back to Saxon times. I'm not saying it is, but it is sometimes the case, that older manorial or burgh boundaries simply carried on in the landscape.
Have fun with the old-maps website - what is intriguing about these footpaths is that they seem to have existed before the canal, as many of them run over the canal on footbridges.
If the spirit moves you, there should also be a rights of way officer at your town hall who can help you with queries about footpaths.
What an interesting area you live in!
The link seems to have gone bugrup, so if you want to see the 1890's map go to http://www.old-maps.co.uk and do a search for Walsall, or enter the postcode you gave in the search box.
Lil O'lady ............. OMG!!! This is absolutely amazing!! Thought I knew quite a bit about researching on line - but have never seen this website before .... thanks SO much for your help, it's really kind of you .... lots of the farms bring to life local road names and Gillity Greaves farm is on completely the other side of the canal to where we (dad & I) thought it was!!! The roads names after are on the other side of the canal ............. and the Red House marked near Wood End Farm is now the site of a 1960's church opposite which is a pub called The Lonhorn .... but this used to be called The Red House ........ it is all beginning to make sense!!! Thanks again
Purely by coincidence, I am printing out for someone else exactly what will help you to clarify your discussion.
I have been doing local history research for my own interest and on behalf of residents of Orchard Hills Estate regarding concern about land development.
I have copies of the Tyhe maps for this area which I would be happy to send you if you would like.
However, I picked up from roads names that you mention that you are falling into the trap of referring to Park Hall when you are actually describing Gilletty Estate. The tythe maps show all of this land as agricultural. and boundry lines were usually decided by natural features such as tree lines and hedges.
My e-mail address is [email protected]
but please use a pretty obvious subject title if replying so that I spot it if it goes into my SPAM box.
Best wishes
Phil
Orchard Hills.
I have been doing local history research for my own interest and on behalf of residents of Orchard Hills Estate regarding concern about land development.
I have copies of the Tyhe maps for this area which I would be happy to send you if you would like.
However, I picked up from roads names that you mention that you are falling into the trap of referring to Park Hall when you are actually describing Gilletty Estate. The tythe maps show all of this land as agricultural. and boundry lines were usually decided by natural features such as tree lines and hedges.
My e-mail address is [email protected]
but please use a pretty obvious subject title if replying so that I spot it if it goes into my SPAM box.
Best wishes
Phil
Orchard Hills.
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