Do we need to be concerned?

[wildwood]

Traditionally Middle-Eastern religion appears to be creeping into Western parts of the world. I can not get those pictures of head covered immigrants/refugees protesting with "death to freedom" and other abusive banners out of my head. Do we need to be concerned, or is this the innocent integration of cultures we are meant to tolerate?

[naomi24]

No, I don't think we need to be concerned. Radical Islam will spell the death knell for Islam in the west.

[jno]

Traditionally Middle-Eastern religion appears to be creeping into Western parts of the world

As it has been doing for a couple of millennia now?

[naomi24]

jno, but perhaps not quite so vigorously, eh?

[jno]

you can't creep (to use the OP's word) vigorously. Islam's most vigorous days were its earliest - the first 50 years.

[naomi24]

So Islam has changed pace. It is no longer simply creeping into western parts of the world. Take note Wildwood. ;o)

[jno]

I'm saying the opposite. It burst into the west originally; since then it's waxed and waned. It's currently expanding at a very modest pace, by immigration rather than by conquest. I remain unconcerned.

[naomi24]

There you go Wildwood. It's not creeping - it's currently expanding at a very modest pace. Now we know, I'm going to bed, so for the time being I'll leave you to it.

[jomifl]

Are we talking about islam, judaism, gnosticism or christianity

[naomi24]

Jom, I assume we're talking about Islam. I've never seen people of any other faith carrying banners bearing the legend 'Death to Freedom'.

[emmie]

I am not sure that we should be unconcerned. Islam has spread to many parts of the world, where it was not a mainstream religion. So let us not be too complacent yet awhile

[jno]

well, that was the substance of my original reply, jomifl. I suspect the earliest Middle Eastern religion in the "western" world was Mithraism, carried by Roman soldiers, but as immigrants rather than invaders; Zoroastrianism may also have made its way west to some degree. Judaism spread by immigration; Islam is doing the same at the moment, after initially being carried by invasion. Christianity spread chiefly by proselytising and conversion.

I don't think invasion, even on a small scale, can be called "creeping"; conversion and immigration can. But they have both been going on for a very long time.

[naomi24]

Em, I don't think we should be compacent now - but with western influence and education, I think that people in the future will eventually choose freedom over repression.

[naomi24]

^^*complacent

[sandyRoe]

Isn't Islam actually on the retreat?
The call to prayer for the faithful could once have been heard at the gates of Vienna and echoing across the foothills of the Pyrenees.

[jomifl]

Good point Naomi, I must read questions more carefully.
Sandy, you may well be right, I think muslims carry their religion with them to other countries, however it remains to be seen if it will prosper and gain willing converts in Europe. It may gain the odd convert but Islamic philosophy seems not to fit very well in a European society that has struggled for centuries to throw off the domination of religion.
jno, I did see your point, many of us tend to forget that christianity is a middle eastern religion.

[ludwig]

Immigrants will take their own culture and religion to wherever they go, but subsequent generations born there will tend to reject it in favour of the prevailing culture. This would be especially true when the immigrant culture is oppressive and anachronistic, and the host culture is more liberal and tolerant.

[beso]

Death to Freedom?

Does that include taking away the freedom to express that opinion?

[jomifl]

Beso, what makes you think that they were expressing that opinion freely. The head coverings conveniently hide the bruises no doubt.

[keyplus90]

Its not creeping. Its spreading and prevailing. Truth always prevails sooner or later and falsehood always perishes sooner or later.

[naomi24]

^^That's why all-controlling communism has collapsed in Europe. Dream on, Keyplus.