ChatterBank2 mins ago
Listener 4019
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Look's like the new Listener website has closed the back door to obtaining the crossword. Perhaps we'll have to buy the paper instead. I can think of one of our "friends" who will be happy!!
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Surely not, Joe! Even Churchill rubbished that old chestnut during the war. As best I recall, some speech adviser suggested the great man should not end a sentence with a preposition and he replied, "That's the sort of nonsense up with which I will not put!" Nor can I imagine anyone saying to a naughty schoolboy, "Up to what are you?"
Truly pathetic, if you're right, I'd say.
Truly pathetic, if you're right, I'd say.
I thought I might mention the crossword, though it's beginning to look off-topic. It took me a lot of time to get enough entries to be sure of the arrangement (and a nasty moment when I had the wrong variant of one of 1 down), and I've almost worn out my eraser and got RSI from several false starts. In the end, though, a very pretty resolution. Many thanks, Sabre.
... why waste time on one topic AHearer when three will suffice?
On the crossword - another great Sabre, well clued as usual, though maybe thematically less testing than usual. (ie I don't normally get through Sabres by Sunday, if at all).
On grammar - I have to agree with you QM .. as I said earlier the preposition rule is contentious to say the least. I suspect it was originally invented not to impose sentence structuring, rather to avert unnecessary use of preps (e.g. "do you know where I'm going to .. " the likes of which can comfortably rest in peace a whole word early).
On something completely different - I just watched another couple of programmes featuring the majestic Neil Young (yes there seem to be plenty around of late). If you're of my age, doesn't his hairstyle seem to have curiously mirrored yours over the past 40 years?
On the crossword - another great Sabre, well clued as usual, though maybe thematically less testing than usual. (ie I don't normally get through Sabres by Sunday, if at all).
On grammar - I have to agree with you QM .. as I said earlier the preposition rule is contentious to say the least. I suspect it was originally invented not to impose sentence structuring, rather to avert unnecessary use of preps (e.g. "do you know where I'm going to .. " the likes of which can comfortably rest in peace a whole word early).
On something completely different - I just watched another couple of programmes featuring the majestic Neil Young (yes there seem to be plenty around of late). If you're of my age, doesn't his hairstyle seem to have curiously mirrored yours over the past 40 years?
Well I for one have made little progress on 4019 since my regular trip to the newsagents on Saturday morning.
In my first year of Listener solving, and four successes, I have finally hit the metaphorical brick wall rather early on (though suspected it was coming after last weeks marathon four day solve!).
Anyhow, will keep plugging away, at the moment only have a handful of clues solved that are far to disparate to give me any chance of working out the arrangement!
Unfortunately the "cyclical" arrangement has me "collectively" troubled.
Well done to the usual solvers amongst us, and good luck to everyone else who's still battling away!
In my first year of Listener solving, and four successes, I have finally hit the metaphorical brick wall rather early on (though suspected it was coming after last weeks marathon four day solve!).
Anyhow, will keep plugging away, at the moment only have a handful of clues solved that are far to disparate to give me any chance of working out the arrangement!
Unfortunately the "cyclical" arrangement has me "collectively" troubled.
Well done to the usual solvers amongst us, and good luck to everyone else who's still battling away!
CluelessJoe - thematically not as testing as last week, but i had to search around the net with the person to get the first part of the phrase. Once I did that I then realised that the grid is in fact a creation of the said person
Apache4D - I did not think the use of the word cyclically should have been used in the preamble as I initially thought the answers had to be in rings (similar to a Listener where the answers were in a diamond format) but in fact each row and column are entered at a certain point and continue at the left/top to make a cycle. You may have noticed that each has 2 clues and they will add up to 13 or 12 respectively.
Keep plodding on as once you have worked out a couple of full rows and columns, the intersecting letters can be deduced
(note i am trying to steer away from the banter and concentrate on a well crafted listener)
Apache4D - I did not think the use of the word cyclically should have been used in the preamble as I initially thought the answers had to be in rings (similar to a Listener where the answers were in a diamond format) but in fact each row and column are entered at a certain point and continue at the left/top to make a cycle. You may have noticed that each has 2 clues and they will add up to 13 or 12 respectively.
Keep plodding on as once you have worked out a couple of full rows and columns, the intersecting letters can be deduced
(note i am trying to steer away from the banter and concentrate on a well crafted listener)
Midazolam,
Many thanks for your advice, luckily that is exactly what I had assumed but difficult to confirm when you only have a few answers solved, it's more like the letters wrap around to the beginning of the row column......I have been working on the premise that as soon as you have solved one you know the length of the second entry as you said.
Think it's going to be interesting though no where near at a point where I can start populating the grid........think this weeks EV is going to be started very late as 4019 looks difficult for a novice!
Many thanks for your advice, luckily that is exactly what I had assumed but difficult to confirm when you only have a few answers solved, it's more like the letters wrap around to the beginning of the row column......I have been working on the premise that as soon as you have solved one you know the length of the second entry as you said.
Think it's going to be interesting though no where near at a point where I can start populating the grid........think this weeks EV is going to be started very late as 4019 looks difficult for a novice!
Sound advice Midazolam, and stick with it Apache - plenty of cold solving to do. I reckon I had to get to three, maybe four complete sets of row answers and a couple of complete columns before I could make a reasonably confident attempt at filling the grid. However, once that start is made, you'll find you can continue to add some of the single answers you have, and that will then help you to find the second of each pair.
As for the rest, I worked the opposite way to Midazolam - never thought to look for the person, but quite early on deduced the first four words of the phrase and searched on that - which threw up the person's name ....
... but first, back to that cold solving!
As for the rest, I worked the opposite way to Midazolam - never thought to look for the person, but quite early on deduced the first four words of the phrase and searched on that - which threw up the person's name ....
... but first, back to that cold solving!
Gosh, what a brilliantly hard puzzle, and thanks to the snow for disrupting travel to work today and allowing me to finish it this afternoon. I don't like cold solving but when the clues are as fair as these I can only blame myself for not getting through them quicker. A tough one, indeed, but I liked it very much and I'm glad I finally worked out the order of the clashes after a flash of inspiration to get the final word.
The only thing I can't figure out is the wordplay to the larger of the two answers at one across. Anyone care to hint at this? I'd be most grateful. Then I can sit in a dark room with a damp flannel.
The only thing I can't figure out is the wordplay to the larger of the two answers at one across. Anyone care to hint at this? I'd be most grateful. Then I can sit in a dark room with a damp flannel.
Walterloo - there's a 3-letter word used to denote "suffers". The rest is an old word for trap.
Took me a long time to get started with this even though I had several rows and columns complete. Couldn't see the intersections and so convinced myself - following on the reverse coding of Sabre's last puzzle, and with a nod to the title - that the across entries must be entered right to left....
It would seem that that was a blind alley. Very much enjoyed the moment when the answers began to slot into place.
Took me a long time to get started with this even though I had several rows and columns complete. Couldn't see the intersections and so convinced myself - following on the reverse coding of Sabre's last puzzle, and with a nod to the title - that the across entries must be entered right to left....
It would seem that that was a blind alley. Very much enjoyed the moment when the answers began to slot into place.
Congratulations to all the solvers, I have enjoyed reading your posts, but alas am making slow progress myself. Only first three rows complete (external to grid), one column complete and and handful of single solves......oh dear (should make some of you feel better!)
At this stage I am thinking that I have either got a portion of my rows wrong, or i'm missing something (was convinced at one point that the down clues should be entered bottom to top).
Am hoping that I get another burst of solves soon, as am falling into that rut of re-reading the same clues and getting blinkered to only one aspect of word-play.........still smiling tho, just :)
At this stage I am thinking that I have either got a portion of my rows wrong, or i'm missing something (was convinced at one point that the down clues should be entered bottom to top).
Am hoping that I get another burst of solves soon, as am falling into that rut of re-reading the same clues and getting blinkered to only one aspect of word-play.........still smiling tho, just :)
Apache4D - hang in there. There are no hidden glitches. Like you I considered the possibility that some of the entries are reversed - but no, they're not. The obvious complication is working out where the clashes are - but if you have a few complete rows and column, it must narrow the options down a bit.
Midazolam - this is the address for the old Listener site which includes the archives.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/section/0,,12350, 00.html
It still works fine for me although obviously won't include any crosswords from this week on.
I decided to set up an account last Friday night using Safari as a browser on a Mac and it all works fine although there was the usual long-winded business of waiting for an email with a password confirmation to come through. The new site is very dull. None of the charm of the old one, the crosswords aren't even titled or given their setters and there's no archive.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/section/0,,12350, 00.html
It still works fine for me although obviously won't include any crosswords from this week on.
I decided to set up an account last Friday night using Safari as a browser on a Mac and it all works fine although there was the usual long-winded business of waiting for an email with a password confirmation to come through. The new site is very dull. None of the charm of the old one, the crosswords aren't even titled or given their setters and there's no archive.
strange - that is the link i used as well but from today it changes automatically to
http://entertainment.timesonline.co.uk/tol/art s_and_entertainment/games_and_puzzles/crosswor d/
http://entertainment.timesonline.co.uk/tol/art s_and_entertainment/games_and_puzzles/crosswor d/
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