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Why is faith considered a virtue?
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Religionists on this site and elsewhere in the world of belief always quote faith as a virtue, something to be proud of.
Why?
'Faith' is a euphemism for 'blind credulity' or 'belief without the need for evidence'. Why is that something to admire?
Suppose I were to claim that there are unicorns in the Amazon forests. Asked for the evidence for my claim, I reply that I have no evidence, purely faith. Would people step back from further questioning and say in hushed tones "Oh, my word, isn't his faith wonderful! We must respect that."?
Of course they wouldn't. They'd dismiss my claim with a shrug and a vague idea that I was some sort of a nutter. So why is 'faith' looked at in such a different light when it refers to gods and the like?
Why?
'Faith' is a euphemism for 'blind credulity' or 'belief without the need for evidence'. Why is that something to admire?
Suppose I were to claim that there are unicorns in the Amazon forests. Asked for the evidence for my claim, I reply that I have no evidence, purely faith. Would people step back from further questioning and say in hushed tones "Oh, my word, isn't his faith wonderful! We must respect that."?
Of course they wouldn't. They'd dismiss my claim with a shrug and a vague idea that I was some sort of a nutter. So why is 'faith' looked at in such a different light when it refers to gods and the like?
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If something is stated often enough people will believe it. A lot of people have lazy brains and find that 'believing' requires no mental effort yet gains them approval from their peer group. It is all too easy. The crunch comes when they have to stand by the principals of the belief that they espouse and find that they can't.
As for why this irrational thinking is accepted and even approved of, I imagine that it has gone on for so long that it seems normal.
I would be interested to know why so many people who have been brought up in a religious environment have rejected it and become atheists.
As for why this irrational thinking is accepted and even approved of, I imagine that it has gone on for so long that it seems normal.
I would be interested to know why so many people who have been brought up in a religious environment have rejected it and become atheists.
Why? Because so many of us find it hard to comprehend that after death there is nothing, no heaven or hell, no eternal damnation or utopia. Humans, being what we are, like to categorise everything and religion seems an acceptable alternative to evolution.
btw. I hate being labeled as an atheist just because I do no longer believe in any religious teachings. Nobody calls me a noskier because I don't ski, or a terrestrial ambulator because I can't fly.
btw. I hate being labeled as an atheist just because I do no longer believe in any religious teachings. Nobody calls me a noskier because I don't ski, or a terrestrial ambulator because I can't fly.
Okay, my definition of faith is belief in something that you cannot prove. As simple as that. Now provided that it doesn't harm others I think that peoples' beliefs and views should be respected...not in a hushed voice sort of way but in a plain good manners way. I am not sure why ANYONE wants to quarrel with that.
Any alleged 'virtue' of faith is a phantom of the same unquestioning ignorance and refusal to acknowledge doubt that defines any act of faith. Faith, in the most essential terms is belief unjustified by the knowledge that would render faith unnecessary. Such belief, based on faith, far from possessing any virtue is in fact a vice, equivocating the illuminating power of knowledge and certainty with the whim of wishful thinking and the fear of that which faith is asserted to protect us from.
Having faith in anyone or anything is disingenuous to those who through their virtue have earned and deserve our respect and trust. Those who beseech our faith and demand our trust have proven time and again to be the least worthy of either and most deserving of the most severe and rigorous scrutiny.
To cling stubbornly to faith is to abandon reason, the one and only last refuge of genuine hope.
Having faith in anyone or anything is disingenuous to those who through their virtue have earned and deserve our respect and trust. Those who beseech our faith and demand our trust have proven time and again to be the least worthy of either and most deserving of the most severe and rigorous scrutiny.
To cling stubbornly to faith is to abandon reason, the one and only last refuge of genuine hope.
Religious faith is considered a virtue because those who have it tell the rest of us it is and we believe them. Society has become so accustomed to being controlled by an establishment that tells us faith is a virtue and demands that we respect it, that it has become almost unthinkable to do otherwise.
The faithful see faith as something to be proud of because they genuinely believe it elevates them above the rest of humanity, never realising it is the result of indoctrination easily foisted upon perpetually immature minds.
If the condition wasn't so damaging to the world those who suffer from 'faith' would deserve our pity, but as it is religious faith warrants nothing, least of all respect. As I said elsewhere if the mental aberrations the faithful experience resulted from anything other than religion, society would be quite justifiably concerned for their welfare, they would be placed under medical supervision, and they would be given prescription drugs to alleviate what would in any other circumstances be deemed a worrying sickness.
I agree with Wildwood. Whilst 'theism' is the norm in this mad world, there is no sound reason for that whatsoever, and therefore the word 'atheism' should be non-existent.
The faithful see faith as something to be proud of because they genuinely believe it elevates them above the rest of humanity, never realising it is the result of indoctrination easily foisted upon perpetually immature minds.
If the condition wasn't so damaging to the world those who suffer from 'faith' would deserve our pity, but as it is religious faith warrants nothing, least of all respect. As I said elsewhere if the mental aberrations the faithful experience resulted from anything other than religion, society would be quite justifiably concerned for their welfare, they would be placed under medical supervision, and they would be given prescription drugs to alleviate what would in any other circumstances be deemed a worrying sickness.
I agree with Wildwood. Whilst 'theism' is the norm in this mad world, there is no sound reason for that whatsoever, and therefore the word 'atheism' should be non-existent.
I think that you will find that not all people with faith "refuse to acknowledge doubt" I am absolutely in agreement with you that people who "beseech our faith and demand our trust" are deffo to be viewed with extreme suspicion. I absolutely get that there are "self styled" religious leaders who are fools, charlatans, knaves and worse and people who are indoctrinated by those aforesaid fools knaves and charlatans.
I will state once here my take on faith and God. I don't expect agreement but a bit of respect would be nice. I don't go around saying that people who believe something that I don't, which does no harm to them and benefits me are
" children who believe in Father Christmas.
Their belief gives them a mental security blanket, and keeps them under some sort of control.
However, we must also question their intellectual credibility."
I find that behaving as though God exists benefits me emotionally, spiritually and psychologically and harms no one else. It makes me a better stronger more compassionate person (against my natural inclination lol)
What I do wonder is why the disbelievers on here get so angry about faith?
religious inspired terrorists? sure have a yell, corrupt Roman catholic church? go for it!
Just don't confuse God with organised religion.
And now, like Forrest Gump, that's all I want to say about that
let the yelling begin
I will state once here my take on faith and God. I don't expect agreement but a bit of respect would be nice. I don't go around saying that people who believe something that I don't, which does no harm to them and benefits me are
" children who believe in Father Christmas.
Their belief gives them a mental security blanket, and keeps them under some sort of control.
However, we must also question their intellectual credibility."
I find that behaving as though God exists benefits me emotionally, spiritually and psychologically and harms no one else. It makes me a better stronger more compassionate person (against my natural inclination lol)
What I do wonder is why the disbelievers on here get so angry about faith?
religious inspired terrorists? sure have a yell, corrupt Roman catholic church? go for it!
Just don't confuse God with organised religion.
And now, like Forrest Gump, that's all I want to say about that
let the yelling begin
Thanks woofgang that’s a bit clearer. Respect for another persons point of view doesn’t mean you have to agree with them, how could you agree with everyone?
That said, respect for another persons point of view is respect for the person not for their viewpoint. How could you have respect for a view that it is OK to stone somebody to death because they ‘allowed’ themselves to be raped.
Although atheists, or rationalists, or humanists, have generally kept a low profile since they know that it is pointless arguing with a ‘person of faith’ there are occasions when the irrational and or self serving ambitions of the faithful have to be challenged.
If proselytizing religionists think it is reasonable to knock on somebody’s door on a Sunday morning and tell them that they don’t understand a damn thing then it fair for a non-religionist to say the same to them. That is the quarrel.
I stand by my statement about lazy minds, I am not saying that the believers are lazy, I am saying that they are not using their minds sufficiently. Many is the time that I’ve taken a statement to be true because I had no means of verifying it and then taking it as true, only to find out later that it was complete hogwash. We have to question everything and everybody all the time otherwise we will be conned and ripped off by charlatans, politicians, priests, imams etc.
Generally we take people to be sincere and what they tell us to be reasonably true, that is respect for another person. Some people however are misguided and some are liars who seek some kind of gain whether financial or social standing, these we have to guard against.
Can you imagine how a society would be run if were based on the sayings of a half wit who lived in a cave 2000 years ago. How do you know it isn’t?
That said, respect for another persons point of view is respect for the person not for their viewpoint. How could you have respect for a view that it is OK to stone somebody to death because they ‘allowed’ themselves to be raped.
Although atheists, or rationalists, or humanists, have generally kept a low profile since they know that it is pointless arguing with a ‘person of faith’ there are occasions when the irrational and or self serving ambitions of the faithful have to be challenged.
If proselytizing religionists think it is reasonable to knock on somebody’s door on a Sunday morning and tell them that they don’t understand a damn thing then it fair for a non-religionist to say the same to them. That is the quarrel.
I stand by my statement about lazy minds, I am not saying that the believers are lazy, I am saying that they are not using their minds sufficiently. Many is the time that I’ve taken a statement to be true because I had no means of verifying it and then taking it as true, only to find out later that it was complete hogwash. We have to question everything and everybody all the time otherwise we will be conned and ripped off by charlatans, politicians, priests, imams etc.
Generally we take people to be sincere and what they tell us to be reasonably true, that is respect for another person. Some people however are misguided and some are liars who seek some kind of gain whether financial or social standing, these we have to guard against.
Can you imagine how a society would be run if were based on the sayings of a half wit who lived in a cave 2000 years ago. How do you know it isn’t?
I'm very impressed by the people here who know everything there is to know and therefore have no interest in "faith".
Isn't faith in this context the way in which we understand and interpret the universe around us, even the little bit that we inhabit? The "facts", whether we gather them for ourselves or (more likely) rely on other people to wrap them up and present them to us, point in many different directions: a world where everything is governed by pure chance (hydrogen atoms banging into each other until they produce Shakespeare) is only one interpretation, though currently very attractive.
It's the search for meaning or purpose that drives us to think up and respond to alternative structures, including the religious ones. Abstract ideas that seem to be commonplace - beauty, justice, truth and so on - keep on suggesting to us that there is more to life than a series of unrelated accidents. We want to have meaning, even if in the end it is to arrive at the faith that there is no meaning, or that the only meaning is what we create for ourselves.
I personally find meaning - sometimes against the evidence - in believing (trusting, having faith) that the universe is not a pointless, accidental place, that it (and its temporary residents) have character and purpose. What that purpose and character is is another discussion.
Just to dismiss "faith" as blind and stupid itself has no meaning, coming as it does from a belief, a faith, that we already know everything we need to know.
Isn't faith in this context the way in which we understand and interpret the universe around us, even the little bit that we inhabit? The "facts", whether we gather them for ourselves or (more likely) rely on other people to wrap them up and present them to us, point in many different directions: a world where everything is governed by pure chance (hydrogen atoms banging into each other until they produce Shakespeare) is only one interpretation, though currently very attractive.
It's the search for meaning or purpose that drives us to think up and respond to alternative structures, including the religious ones. Abstract ideas that seem to be commonplace - beauty, justice, truth and so on - keep on suggesting to us that there is more to life than a series of unrelated accidents. We want to have meaning, even if in the end it is to arrive at the faith that there is no meaning, or that the only meaning is what we create for ourselves.
I personally find meaning - sometimes against the evidence - in believing (trusting, having faith) that the universe is not a pointless, accidental place, that it (and its temporary residents) have character and purpose. What that purpose and character is is another discussion.
Just to dismiss "faith" as blind and stupid itself has no meaning, coming as it does from a belief, a faith, that we already know everything we need to know.
