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ChatterBank1 min ago
Should Lesley Pilkington be struck off?
http://www.telegraph....-men-go-straight.html
She claims to be able to turn gay men straight via counselling, and agrees that homosexuality as "a mental illness, an addiction and antireligious phenomenon”.
However...if a gay man or woman is genuinely unhappy being gay and wants to seek counselling for a 'cure', shouldn't they have the option?
Or is this reinforcing the idea that homosexuality is a mental illness and that all people are really heterosexual underneath?
She claims to be able to turn gay men straight via counselling, and agrees that homosexuality as "a mental illness, an addiction and antireligious phenomenon”.
However...if a gay man or woman is genuinely unhappy being gay and wants to seek counselling for a 'cure', shouldn't they have the option?
Or is this reinforcing the idea that homosexuality is a mental illness and that all people are really heterosexual underneath?
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EYT:
For one thing, you haven't demonstrated why something being unnatural is the same as it being immoral. Medicine isn't 'natural' - neither's education, or living in a house. Or, on a more related note, neither is contraception. Our civilization isn't natural by any stretch of the imagination, and is all the better for it.
For another, there's numerous scientific theories which between have them indicate a possible natural origin (though admittedly the field is a bit inconclusive). For instance, a tendency has been identified in twin studies between the likelihood of homosexuality in proportion to the number of pregnancies the mother has (the more sons, the more likely the next one is to be gay). (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fraternal_birth
_order_and_sexual_orientation)
In the 90s, a brain scientist called Simon LeVay also identified a recurring difference in a part of the brain in gay men that wasn't in straight men (though he emphasises this does not prove conclusively, it just indicates the possiblity).
An overview of different theories can be found in the following links:
http://en.wikipedia.o...nd_sexual_orientation
http://www.theatlanti...ity-and-biology/4683/
http://www.webmd.com/...128/is-there-gay-gene
http://psych
For one thing, you haven't demonstrated why something being unnatural is the same as it being immoral. Medicine isn't 'natural' - neither's education, or living in a house. Or, on a more related note, neither is contraception. Our civilization isn't natural by any stretch of the imagination, and is all the better for it.
For another, there's numerous scientific theories which between have them indicate a possible natural origin (though admittedly the field is a bit inconclusive). For instance, a tendency has been identified in twin studies between the likelihood of homosexuality in proportion to the number of pregnancies the mother has (the more sons, the more likely the next one is to be gay). (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fraternal_birth
_order_and_sexual_orientation)
In the 90s, a brain scientist called Simon LeVay also identified a recurring difference in a part of the brain in gay men that wasn't in straight men (though he emphasises this does not prove conclusively, it just indicates the possiblity).
An overview of different theories can be found in the following links:
http://en.wikipedia.o...nd_sexual_orientation
http://www.theatlanti...ity-and-biology/4683/
http://www.webmd.com/...128/is-there-gay-gene
http://psych
kromovaracun
Good luck - but I tried posting links to Wikipedia yesterday, but ETY didn't seem to see them.
Docspock - you know you say you can 'spot a gay' by their effeminate behaviour? Did you know that Gareth Thomas, Neil Patrick Harris, Peter Mandelson, Simon Amstell, Brendan Courtney and Alistair Appleton?
To lump all gay men together because of mannerisms is the equivalent of assuming all straight men are photocopies of Gordon Ramsey.
Good luck - but I tried posting links to Wikipedia yesterday, but ETY didn't seem to see them.
Docspock - you know you say you can 'spot a gay' by their effeminate behaviour? Did you know that Gareth Thomas, Neil Patrick Harris, Peter Mandelson, Simon Amstell, Brendan Courtney and Alistair Appleton?
To lump all gay men together because of mannerisms is the equivalent of assuming all straight men are photocopies of Gordon Ramsey.
sp: To answer your original question,
In my opinion, yes. There's absolutely no concrete evidence to suggest that such therapies are consistently successful and as far as I'm aware there's absolutely no support for it from any accredited organization in the field. If gay people seek comfort and find happiness in such therapies, than I earnestly wish them the best. But it's irrefutable that such therapies have also proved immensely damaging, as the following links testify to:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDiYeJ_bsQo
http://www.beyondexgay.com/
'Conversion therapy' takes advantage of people in vulnerable situations in more or less exactly the same way as psychic mediums who claim to speak with the dead, but are immeasurably more damaging. If people do find happiness through it, then good on them. But people found attempting to propagate conversion therapy ought to be reprimanded in accordance with the strongest standards of their field.
In my opinion, yes. There's absolutely no concrete evidence to suggest that such therapies are consistently successful and as far as I'm aware there's absolutely no support for it from any accredited organization in the field. If gay people seek comfort and find happiness in such therapies, than I earnestly wish them the best. But it's irrefutable that such therapies have also proved immensely damaging, as the following links testify to:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDiYeJ_bsQo
http://www.beyondexgay.com/
'Conversion therapy' takes advantage of people in vulnerable situations in more or less exactly the same way as psychic mediums who claim to speak with the dead, but are immeasurably more damaging. If people do find happiness through it, then good on them. But people found attempting to propagate conversion therapy ought to be reprimanded in accordance with the strongest standards of their field.
Doc - i am intrigued by the langauge and phrases you use in your postings - 'bent as a nine-bob note'. 'nancy boys' etc. which point to the premise that you are a died-in-the-wool homophobe. You exhibit all the standard cliche phrases used by men who are seriously frightened of homosexuality, and feel a need to bolster their own heterosexuality by offensive references and labels. The harsher the language, the more defensive the stance - the bigger the fear and ignorance.
Feel free to contradict me - but the evidence is all written here for anyone who cares to read this thread from end to end (sorry if that phrase makes you feel ill!) can see.
Feel free to contradict me - but the evidence is all written here for anyone who cares to read this thread from end to end (sorry if that phrase makes you feel ill!) can see.
Not sure about your turn of phrase there DrFilth!
There is a difrference between not liking something and being frighened of something -
I don't like honey, but I'm not frightened of it - fact.
I don't like spiders and I am frightened of them - concept.
Why should anyone be frightened of homosexuality? No reason, but homophobia -as the name indicates - is an irratioanal fear, so it is not based on reason, but on a nameless fear and dislike, covered up, as I indicated, by bigoted hostility.
I don't have a problem with anyone being frightened or even just disliking the liefstyles of others - but when they use language that indicates that others of a different orientation are perverse, unpleasant, laughable, disgusting etc. ad nauseum, then it does become a probelm.
There is a difrference between not liking something and being frighened of something -
I don't like honey, but I'm not frightened of it - fact.
I don't like spiders and I am frightened of them - concept.
Why should anyone be frightened of homosexuality? No reason, but homophobia -as the name indicates - is an irratioanal fear, so it is not based on reason, but on a nameless fear and dislike, covered up, as I indicated, by bigoted hostility.
I don't have a problem with anyone being frightened or even just disliking the liefstyles of others - but when they use language that indicates that others of a different orientation are perverse, unpleasant, laughable, disgusting etc. ad nauseum, then it does become a probelm.
Dr Filth - At the risk of taking this thread back on track..............what has much of the preceding got to do with the OP ?
It's obvious that many of the more voluable members of AB have a problem with gay peeps..........and a shame that *any* post on gay matters has to get reduced down to the sex-acts whih amy (or may not) take place between consenting adults.........and tedious to read time after time after time.
It's obvious that many of the more voluable members of AB have a problem with gay peeps..........and a shame that *any* post on gay matters has to get reduced down to the sex-acts whih amy (or may not) take place between consenting adults.........and tedious to read time after time after time.
Kromo.....as you will have seen the Neurobiology of sexual development and preference is not my forte, but you have a good knowledge of the subject upon which I congratulate you.
The work by the Neuro-Anatomists quoted in your link, may be misleading as you yourself pointed out.
The suprachiasmic nucleus being twice as large in heterosexuals than in homosexuals needs to be interpreted with the knowledge that this particular nucleus varies in size within heterosexuals and homosexuals and hence is non specific.......in my opinion.
Also his work has never been replicated.
However....an interesting post of yours and well worth reading........with an open mind ;-)
The work by the Neuro-Anatomists quoted in your link, may be misleading as you yourself pointed out.
The suprachiasmic nucleus being twice as large in heterosexuals than in homosexuals needs to be interpreted with the knowledge that this particular nucleus varies in size within heterosexuals and homosexuals and hence is non specific.......in my opinion.
Also his work has never been replicated.
However....an interesting post of yours and well worth reading........with an open mind ;-)
Those who stereotype certain behaviours as typically "gay" were a real problem for me when I was growing up. This assumption that a man must be macho or else gay is ridiculous.
Those who are obsessed by it are actually showing their own sexual insecurities.
Gay men who "camp it up" are also part of the problem and I wish they would find better ways of dealing with their insecurities.
Those who are obsessed by it are actually showing their own sexual insecurities.
Gay men who "camp it up" are also part of the problem and I wish they would find better ways of dealing with their insecurities.
andy read my post above regarding gromit on the irish
now we have irish and gay mentioned , so when i say them i mean't anyone of a very large group of people from any flipping corner of the world or of any sexual preference
hope you understand that
if people from another planet came to this planet and you using your terminolgy had a fear of them , once he had met such people he may find he did not have that fear of them anymore
he may actualy like them , pooh used that word them again
now we have irish and gay mentioned , so when i say them i mean't anyone of a very large group of people from any flipping corner of the world or of any sexual preference
hope you understand that
if people from another planet came to this planet and you using your terminolgy had a fear of them , once he had met such people he may find he did not have that fear of them anymore
he may actualy like them , pooh used that word them again
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