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Should Straight Actors Play Gay People?
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So Gay people shouldn't play straight people the, I'm guessing there won't be many roles for them.
\\"You wouldn't cast someone able-bodied and put them in a wheelchair, you wouldn't black someone up," Russell T Davies has said.//
Lots of actors have played disabled people.
So Gay people shouldn't play straight people the, I'm guessing there won't be many roles for them.
\\"You wouldn't cast someone able-bodied and put them in a wheelchair, you wouldn't black someone up," Russell T Davies has said.//
Lots of actors have played disabled people.
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even robert downey junior had abuse for 'blacking up' in tropic thunder, even though the whole point of his character was that he was an ignorant arrogant white guy, dressing up as black man and going deep undercover as method research etc, and is ridiculed etc for it.
but some people couldnt get their head round that & attacked RDJ personally.
they were angry they didnt cast a black man for the role - they couldnt understand why it had to be a white person with make up for that role, since thats literally his storyline
but some people couldnt get their head round that & attacked RDJ personally.
they were angry they didnt cast a black man for the role - they couldnt understand why it had to be a white person with make up for that role, since thats literally his storyline
ladybirder - i agree gay people would most likely be able to tell - but thats the same with almost anything really - im sure a genuine aussie can tell a fake accent from a real one more than a brit, im sure a botanist can tell when an actor isnt acting liek a 'real botanist' more than the average person could, its understandable when you have a deeper than average experience & knowledge of something.
i can ALWAYS tell when an actor is faking the accent of my home town - but not so much other towns
i can ALWAYS tell when an actor is faking the accent of my home town - but not so much other towns
barsel - gayness itself is not a physical trait, but being effeminate is, so yes i agree actors who are very definitely effeminate would struggle to play straight roles - but equally id like to think plenty of them are good enough actors to being to alter that.
James dreyfus is a good example of this - hes gay in real life & plays very camp roles, but he has played straight pretty well a few times, & if you didnt know, you wouldnt know.
it really just depends on the actor ability to inhabit characters i guess
James dreyfus is a good example of this - hes gay in real life & plays very camp roles, but he has played straight pretty well a few times, & if you didnt know, you wouldnt know.
it really just depends on the actor ability to inhabit characters i guess
i know a guy whose somewhat effeminate/camp & i remember years ago, he was outraged when people said they could tell he was gay - he was utterly convinced he was straight acting and that it was totally undetectable. he had no idea, how obvious it was. he wasnt an actor though so probably hadnt spent much time watching himself onscreen
but i do think this is possibly sometimes the reason why some actors believe theyve been refused a role for being gay - theyre unaware how much it shows in their mannerisms etc, so they think its prejudice rather than that theyre just not right for the role.
im sure plenty are right too, of course - homophobes come in all shapes & sizes and in every industry, sadly.
but i do think this is possibly sometimes the reason why some actors believe theyve been refused a role for being gay - theyre unaware how much it shows in their mannerisms etc, so they think its prejudice rather than that theyre just not right for the role.
im sure plenty are right too, of course - homophobes come in all shapes & sizes and in every industry, sadly.
barsel - its what you are literally saying though - that the actors personal life affects you in ways it really shouldnt, in irrational & illogical ways.
as i said, if you are unable to accept an actors performance because you cannot separate fact from fiction, then thats a you problem, not them & not the production
im not sure how you can be offended by that - its literally what you've said a few times - that you just simply cant or wont believe it.
if you can separate fact from fiction on literally every single other aspect of an actors life - except for what they do in bed, then surely you can see that that is a problem?
surely you can see why people would question why this particular issue is such a mental block for you.
but you can storm off in outrage if you like, but i suspect its because ive hit a nerve & now you see your weird mental block it for what it is.
as i said, if you are unable to accept an actors performance because you cannot separate fact from fiction, then thats a you problem, not them & not the production
im not sure how you can be offended by that - its literally what you've said a few times - that you just simply cant or wont believe it.
if you can separate fact from fiction on literally every single other aspect of an actors life - except for what they do in bed, then surely you can see that that is a problem?
surely you can see why people would question why this particular issue is such a mental block for you.
but you can storm off in outrage if you like, but i suspect its because ive hit a nerve & now you see your weird mental block it for what it is.
ummmm, yes i know loads of gay people & many you'd never know.
Theres a weird perception, often from people who dont actually know many gay people, that all gay men are camp & lesbians are butch, but majority of them are just like everyone else, theyre just people.
i guess thats why 'gaydar' is a thing
Theres a weird perception, often from people who dont actually know many gay people, that all gay men are camp & lesbians are butch, but majority of them are just like everyone else, theyre just people.
i guess thats why 'gaydar' is a thing
joko I said I was leaving this thread as I did feel very insulted and upset by what you said to me but, I have to agree with you when you say effeminate actors would probably find it difficult to play a straight part and, the audience would find it unconvincing. I will try to put what I was trying to say in a different way. I have to go back to the heartthrobs of my generation including Rock Hudson, Montgomery Clift, poss James Dean, Cary Grant who played the romantic leads of the macho males who I fell in love with. To find out years later that they were gay, was a huge disappointment to me as I just couldn't understand why a gay actor would play such a romantic role with a woman. I now know why this was, it's because the studios knew that if they told us someone was gay, they would probably lose a huge amount of their fan base and we wouldn't be able to accept them in a romantic role with a woman anymore. These days they don't have to keep their sexuality a secret although I know there were some who did marry just to hide their sexuality, Phillip Schofield and Elton John to name just a few. Finally, if 2 gay actors are playing a gay couple, I have no qualms with that, I just can't accept 1 gay actor and 1 straight actor playing a romantic couple, it just doesn't work for me. That's it, hope you might understand where I'm coming from a bit more.
curious - this issue of believability or being unable to believe an actors performance because of their real life sexual preferences.
has anyone ever watched unknown actors in general scenes & sex scenes, and thought -
"nah, im not buying this, its just not believable, i think that actor is gay/not gay in real life"?
and have you then gone off and googled the actor & found you were right?
or is it only if you already know the actors sexuality beforehand?
has anyone ever watched unknown actors in general scenes & sex scenes, and thought -
"nah, im not buying this, its just not believable, i think that actor is gay/not gay in real life"?
and have you then gone off and googled the actor & found you were right?
or is it only if you already know the actors sexuality beforehand?
barsel - but thats literally the same as what you said at first - that you just cant accept it, that you have qualms about.
it makes no sense whatsoever to even think about the reall ife sexual preferences of actors playing the roles.
you even say "I just couldn't understand why a gay actor would play such a romantic role with a woman."
because its acting! its pretend!
why on earth wouldnt they play such a role? - its their JOB.
they pretend to be someone else, a different character - often someone not remotely like themselves - and they manage to that perfectly well - so its baffling why you can't accept them doing this too.
married actors do full sex scenes with other actors - doesnt mean theyre having an affair, or have feelings etc, because its not real, its what acting is, putting yourself into the body of another person.
i get youre saying this mental block is coming not from underlying homophobia but from your own disappointment of finding out your heartthrobs were gay when you were young, but still many years later, youre still unable to grasp that actors do lots of things that go against their own personality.
theyre not killers or rapists either, but they take on the role of one, and act it as best they can - some are utterly terrifying & totally believable - but in real life are horrified by it.
often actors need a break after such scenes because the emotion of having to inhabit the mind of a sadistic killer for instance is so totally alien to them, that they become overwhelmed. the sheer horror at the physical acts they have to pretend to be doing to another person sickens them dearly.
but they still do it - because thats their job
i guess i just dont get how pretending to be gay is the one that sticks with you.
all i can say is try to stop linking the 2, actors & characters are 2 separate things.
you will enjoy films much better i can tell you that! haha!
it makes no sense whatsoever to even think about the reall ife sexual preferences of actors playing the roles.
you even say "I just couldn't understand why a gay actor would play such a romantic role with a woman."
because its acting! its pretend!
why on earth wouldnt they play such a role? - its their JOB.
they pretend to be someone else, a different character - often someone not remotely like themselves - and they manage to that perfectly well - so its baffling why you can't accept them doing this too.
married actors do full sex scenes with other actors - doesnt mean theyre having an affair, or have feelings etc, because its not real, its what acting is, putting yourself into the body of another person.
i get youre saying this mental block is coming not from underlying homophobia but from your own disappointment of finding out your heartthrobs were gay when you were young, but still many years later, youre still unable to grasp that actors do lots of things that go against their own personality.
theyre not killers or rapists either, but they take on the role of one, and act it as best they can - some are utterly terrifying & totally believable - but in real life are horrified by it.
often actors need a break after such scenes because the emotion of having to inhabit the mind of a sadistic killer for instance is so totally alien to them, that they become overwhelmed. the sheer horror at the physical acts they have to pretend to be doing to another person sickens them dearly.
but they still do it - because thats their job
i guess i just dont get how pretending to be gay is the one that sticks with you.
all i can say is try to stop linking the 2, actors & characters are 2 separate things.
you will enjoy films much better i can tell you that! haha!
I'm sorry joko, I've tried my best to explain where I'm coming from, but you are still reading it wrong.
///has anyone ever watched unknown actors in general scenes & sex scenes, and thought -
"nah, im not buying this, its just not believable, i think that actor is gay/not gay in real life"?///
Answer, No. An unknown actor who is not effeminate, how would I possibly know and I certainly wouldn't Google it to check.
///or is it only if you already know the actors sexuality beforehand?///
Yes. If I know an actor is gay and I see them in bed with a straight actor then to me, that isn't believable. 2 gay actors in bed, yes, that's believable.
I don't know if you watch soaps like Corrie, but an actor who is gay in real life and has spoken about it often, is playing the role of a straight man who was madly in love with his wife, who had an affair with another woman and even used the services of a female escort and he doesn't look or sound gay, but because I know he is, then I can't accept him in that role. There are a few gay men in Corrie so why not cast him in that role? Possibly because there will be people who say Oh, not another gay character, but I would find that more acceptable than trying to get my head round why he is snogging a woman.
///has anyone ever watched unknown actors in general scenes & sex scenes, and thought -
"nah, im not buying this, its just not believable, i think that actor is gay/not gay in real life"?///
Answer, No. An unknown actor who is not effeminate, how would I possibly know and I certainly wouldn't Google it to check.
///or is it only if you already know the actors sexuality beforehand?///
Yes. If I know an actor is gay and I see them in bed with a straight actor then to me, that isn't believable. 2 gay actors in bed, yes, that's believable.
I don't know if you watch soaps like Corrie, but an actor who is gay in real life and has spoken about it often, is playing the role of a straight man who was madly in love with his wife, who had an affair with another woman and even used the services of a female escort and he doesn't look or sound gay, but because I know he is, then I can't accept him in that role. There are a few gay men in Corrie so why not cast him in that role? Possibly because there will be people who say Oh, not another gay character, but I would find that more acceptable than trying to get my head round why he is snogging a woman.
Oh dear, barsel. I may get into trouble here. I never ask or wonder what the sexuality of an actor is, so perhaps it might be better if you didn't check and just accepted the performance as a work of art? I haven't watched 'Corrie' since the days of Ena Sharples, so have no idea of the storylines. If I switched it on I would simply look at the current situations and react to them as stories. Just an idea.
Ok, I'm beginning to understand where you are coming from a bit more, but what I've realised about myself is I only seem to have a problem if it involves romantic scenes.2 gay men, 2 gay women, not a problem. I gay actor in a romantic lead with a straight actor, is the problem I have. So that is the problem I have to try and get past, and perhaps in time that might change . Who knows. :-)
This subject crops up regularly, and most people find their stance on the subject unchanged since last time.
Mine is unchanged - the notion of only gay actors playing gay roles speaks entirely against the notion of what acting is, and what being an actor involves.
There cannot be a circumstance where a gay actor is given preference over a gay actor - it has to be offered to the actor who best realises the role, nothing else.
Comparisons of white and black actors playing against ethnicity are a facile argument - if a role demands that a character is black - such as Jamie Fox in Django Unchained - then it would rather undermine the concept of the film if Leonardo De Caprio had played that role, and Fox had played the slaver role acted so wonderfully by De Caprio.
The only yardstick used in choosing an actor is their ability to play the role - and in the case of a film like Django Unchained, that ability is already defined by ethnicity - anything else is down to the sill and conviction displayed on audition day.
I don't watch films or TV wondering in the back of my mind if a gay character is actually played by a gay actor, I honestly couldn't be bothered to waste my time.
Mine is unchanged - the notion of only gay actors playing gay roles speaks entirely against the notion of what acting is, and what being an actor involves.
There cannot be a circumstance where a gay actor is given preference over a gay actor - it has to be offered to the actor who best realises the role, nothing else.
Comparisons of white and black actors playing against ethnicity are a facile argument - if a role demands that a character is black - such as Jamie Fox in Django Unchained - then it would rather undermine the concept of the film if Leonardo De Caprio had played that role, and Fox had played the slaver role acted so wonderfully by De Caprio.
The only yardstick used in choosing an actor is their ability to play the role - and in the case of a film like Django Unchained, that ability is already defined by ethnicity - anything else is down to the sill and conviction displayed on audition day.
I don't watch films or TV wondering in the back of my mind if a gay character is actually played by a gay actor, I honestly couldn't be bothered to waste my time.
barsel - youre just reiterating my thoughts though, not clarifying anything - what youre saying is the same as im saying - only difference is im saying its wrong to think like that.
you seem to just be unable to grasp that your stance on this makes no sense & is an unreasonable expectation to have.
"I would find that more acceptable than trying to get my head round why he is snogging a woman"
that is just a bizarre attitude to have over an actor in a role, truly bizarre.
actors real life sexuality is not a deciding factor for casting directors, its doesnt matter as long as the actor can play the role properly.
hes snogging a woman because its his job & thats what his character does - you shouldny have to 'get your head around it' - the fact youre having so much difficulty in doing so indicates some underlying issues there
can you accept an actor who you know has not murdered 20 people, has done exactly that in a film?
if yes, dont you see why its weird?
its weird that you have no trouble whatsoever accepting a normal guy is a serial killer but sttruggle to accept someone kissing a woman?
aside from anything im pretty sure acting out the role of murder is horrible & traumatic but even for a gay guy the action of kissing a woman is not horrific etc - its probably quite 'nice' for most of them - theyre just lips - the actor is not supposed to actually genuinely feel sexually attracted to their co-star in these scenes!
its all supposed to be completely neutral & not at all sexy in real life.
you seem to confirming what im saying but seem to think that explains it, and its therefore 'ok'.
it isnt, its judgemental and indicates a lack of understanding of the acting profession
again, peoples real life sexual preferences should never ever be a consideration for whether they get a job or not.
what people like to do in bed is not relevant to their jobs.
you seem to just be unable to grasp that your stance on this makes no sense & is an unreasonable expectation to have.
"I would find that more acceptable than trying to get my head round why he is snogging a woman"
that is just a bizarre attitude to have over an actor in a role, truly bizarre.
actors real life sexuality is not a deciding factor for casting directors, its doesnt matter as long as the actor can play the role properly.
hes snogging a woman because its his job & thats what his character does - you shouldny have to 'get your head around it' - the fact youre having so much difficulty in doing so indicates some underlying issues there
can you accept an actor who you know has not murdered 20 people, has done exactly that in a film?
if yes, dont you see why its weird?
its weird that you have no trouble whatsoever accepting a normal guy is a serial killer but sttruggle to accept someone kissing a woman?
aside from anything im pretty sure acting out the role of murder is horrible & traumatic but even for a gay guy the action of kissing a woman is not horrific etc - its probably quite 'nice' for most of them - theyre just lips - the actor is not supposed to actually genuinely feel sexually attracted to their co-star in these scenes!
its all supposed to be completely neutral & not at all sexy in real life.
you seem to confirming what im saying but seem to think that explains it, and its therefore 'ok'.
it isnt, its judgemental and indicates a lack of understanding of the acting profession
again, peoples real life sexual preferences should never ever be a consideration for whether they get a job or not.
what people like to do in bed is not relevant to their jobs.
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