Crosswords2 mins ago
East London Mosque
opens it's doors to non believers, will they get many takers, and will women be segregated and have to wear a head covering as well i wonder.
http://
http://
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I really dont think we need to be building temples to accommodate other faiths, we rarely build churches for Christians now and we certainly don't need to be encouraging the growth of Islam
"We" aren't building, them, though, adherents build them for themselves, and I can't think of any reason why they shouldn't if they want them. Most of them look rather better than the shopping malls that "we" build.
Jake, there are lots of mosques in Istanbul, all worth visiting, though architecture critics say the one in Edirne is the finest - it's a long way away and I've never seen it. Those in Damascus and Kairouan (in Tunisia) are also wonderful if you ever get the chance.
"We" aren't building, them, though, adherents build them for themselves, and I can't think of any reason why they shouldn't if they want them. Most of them look rather better than the shopping malls that "we" build.
Jake, there are lots of mosques in Istanbul, all worth visiting, though architecture critics say the one in Edirne is the finest - it's a long way away and I've never seen it. Those in Damascus and Kairouan (in Tunisia) are also wonderful if you ever get the chance.
I have visited a few mosques in Turkey. They welcome non believers and are usually proud of their buildings, the same as churches in England.
I have also been in my local mosque (which is east of Manchester). I missed the opening, as it was built before I was born, but they did a refurb and added some domes and they had a opening for that.
Nothing to do with damaged limitation. I think attitudes may have hardened in recent times whipped up by the Mail/Express disinformation and extremist groups such as the BNP and UKiP. I doubt there was the same fuss for England's first (purpose built) mosque in 1889.
I have also been in my local mosque (which is east of Manchester). I missed the opening, as it was built before I was born, but they did a refurb and added some domes and they had a opening for that.
Nothing to do with damaged limitation. I think attitudes may have hardened in recent times whipped up by the Mail/Express disinformation and extremist groups such as the BNP and UKiP. I doubt there was the same fuss for England's first (purpose built) mosque in 1889.
Gromit, //I think attitudes may have hardened in recent times whipped up by the Mail/Express disinformation and extremist groups such as the BNP and UKiP.//
But much of it is not 'disinformation', which is precisely why the East London Mosque may be attempting - very wisely - to limit the damage done.
I've been to mosques all over the world and the only advice I would give to any visitor is don't believe all you're told.
But much of it is not 'disinformation', which is precisely why the East London Mosque may be attempting - very wisely - to limit the damage done.
I've been to mosques all over the world and the only advice I would give to any visitor is don't believe all you're told.
The mosque in my is town is quite a nice building
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http://
Well, I have been to the Neasden Hindu temple ratter15 mentioned many, many times and I must say it is one of my favorite places to visit. It is stunning and the people there are polite and welcoming. It also had a shop, where one can buy all manner of wonderful spices, indian cakes etc. I was invited to visit the site for the fist time when construction had only just started and they had brought over the most amazing artisans / craftsmen who were carving the white sandstone and marble as well as the wood being used for the buildings! I felt privileged to be able to see this. I so want to take my ratter15 there some day, as long as he can behave himself, lol!
// ...which is precisely why the East London Mosque may be attempting - very wisely - to limit the damage done. //
Mosques have been built in England for over 120 years with little fuss. There openings have never been secret, nor should they be. In recent years, there have been politically motivated campaigns against them from far right groups.
They tell you mosques are a breeding ground for terrorists (disinformation). They complain that their have been no grand churches built, why that has anything to do with muslims is not explained.
If there are thousands of muslims in our midst who want to pray, how is building somewhere for them to do that changing our communities? Surely our communities are already changed, or there would be the demand for such a grand building.
Mosques have been built in England for over 120 years with little fuss. There openings have never been secret, nor should they be. In recent years, there have been politically motivated campaigns against them from far right groups.
They tell you mosques are a breeding ground for terrorists (disinformation). They complain that their have been no grand churches built, why that has anything to do with muslims is not explained.
If there are thousands of muslims in our midst who want to pray, how is building somewhere for them to do that changing our communities? Surely our communities are already changed, or there would be the demand for such a grand building.
East London Mosque history.
// At the beginning of the 20th century, London was the capital of the extensive British Empire, which contained tens of millions of Muslims, but had no mosque for Muslim residents or visitors. On 9 November 1910, at a meeting of Muslims and non-Muslims at the Ritz Hotel, the London Mosque Fund was established with the aims of organising weekly Friday prayers and providing a permanent place of worship for Muslims in London.
People associated with the London Mosque Fund over the years include:
Nathan Rothschild served as a trustee.
Lord Lamington became Vice-Chairman.
Historian T. W. Arnold became its Secretary, and was later replaced by Sir Ernest Houston.
Sir John Woodhead became its Treasurer.
The Earl Winterton was also a trustee of the Fund. //
Seems like they have been reaching out into the community for a long time. Or em and naomi, they have been doing damage limitation for over a century!
// At the beginning of the 20th century, London was the capital of the extensive British Empire, which contained tens of millions of Muslims, but had no mosque for Muslim residents or visitors. On 9 November 1910, at a meeting of Muslims and non-Muslims at the Ritz Hotel, the London Mosque Fund was established with the aims of organising weekly Friday prayers and providing a permanent place of worship for Muslims in London.
People associated with the London Mosque Fund over the years include:
Nathan Rothschild served as a trustee.
Lord Lamington became Vice-Chairman.
Historian T. W. Arnold became its Secretary, and was later replaced by Sir Ernest Houston.
Sir John Woodhead became its Treasurer.
The Earl Winterton was also a trustee of the Fund. //
Seems like they have been reaching out into the community for a long time. Or em and naomi, they have been doing damage limitation for over a century!
JTP, the news reporter was quoting a source at the mosque over damage limitation, in reference to the vile rantings of the Muslim men who said, and it's on camera, youtube if you care to look, and i quote, this is a Muslim area get out, and to a young guy who i believe was wearing make up, you f ag, and to a young girl that she looked like a hooker, you are not welcome here, this is the East End in London you know nothing about, so indeed wind your neck in. This isn't an isolated incident, i can understand those moderates wanting to limit the damage done by these beyond foolish men, however even opening the doors to the Mosques won't mean you get the whole story. Churches have been losing their flocks for a long time, not to say entirely, but they are going.
Gromit, all of that is irrelevant to the question. The reason this mosque is opening its doors is to promote a better understanding of Islam and what goes on inside the building. From the link:
//Dilowar Khan, executive director of the mosque, said there was plenty of work to be done to improve its reputation locally.
"There is more pressure on us as an institution because our mosque has come under a lot of pressure. It's been criticised as being a hub for extremists," he said….
Earlier this year a video appeared online showing men shouting homophobic abuse at another man in east London, telling him to "get out of here" as "it is a Muslim area". //
Personally I think this initiative towards greater social cohesion is admirable. However, you seem determined to deny due credit, which is a great pity.
//Dilowar Khan, executive director of the mosque, said there was plenty of work to be done to improve its reputation locally.
"There is more pressure on us as an institution because our mosque has come under a lot of pressure. It's been criticised as being a hub for extremists," he said….
Earlier this year a video appeared online showing men shouting homophobic abuse at another man in east London, telling him to "get out of here" as "it is a Muslim area". //
Personally I think this initiative towards greater social cohesion is admirable. However, you seem determined to deny due credit, which is a great pity.
Gromit
/// I think attitudes may have hardened in recent times whipped up by the Mail/Express disinformation and extremist groups such as the BNP and
UKiP. ///
I wondered how long it would be before the blame was put down to the Mail.
You also accuse the UKIP of being an extremist group, I always thought that they were anti Europe rather than anti Muslim, you also forgot to include the EDL, or has your hatred of them mellowed somewhat?
/// I doubt there was the same fuss for England's first (purpose built) mosque in 1889. ///
They did not have a history of terrorism back then, although I would have thought that there might be some ill feeling, due to the savage murder and beheading of General Gordon in 1885.
/// They tell you mosques are a breeding ground for terrorists (disinformation). ///
This is not disinformation has you have incorrectly put, but the truth, there have been many examples of certain Imams preaching their hate both inside and outside these buildings.
/// I think attitudes may have hardened in recent times whipped up by the Mail/Express disinformation and extremist groups such as the BNP and
UKiP. ///
I wondered how long it would be before the blame was put down to the Mail.
You also accuse the UKIP of being an extremist group, I always thought that they were anti Europe rather than anti Muslim, you also forgot to include the EDL, or has your hatred of them mellowed somewhat?
/// I doubt there was the same fuss for England's first (purpose built) mosque in 1889. ///
They did not have a history of terrorism back then, although I would have thought that there might be some ill feeling, due to the savage murder and beheading of General Gordon in 1885.
/// They tell you mosques are a breeding ground for terrorists (disinformation). ///
This is not disinformation has you have incorrectly put, but the truth, there have been many examples of certain Imams preaching their hate both inside and outside these buildings.
/// Dilowar Khan, executive director of the mosque, said there was plenty of work to be done to improve its reputation locally. ///
If Dilowar Khan is sincere, I would have thought he would have improved their reputation much better by openly condemning the actions of extremists when the need arises, rather than simply conducting a public awareness exercise in the workings of their religious buildings?
If Dilowar Khan is sincere, I would have thought he would have improved their reputation much better by openly condemning the actions of extremists when the need arises, rather than simply conducting a public awareness exercise in the workings of their religious buildings?
You also accuse the UKIP of being an extremist group, I always thought that they were anti Europe rather than anti Muslim
"At the 2010 general election, the BNP and UKIP pitched to citizens anxious over the role of Islam in society, by pledging to ban the burqa, deport radical preachers and (in the case of the BNP), end immigration from Muslim countries"
Taken from this:
http://
"At the 2010 general election, the BNP and UKIP pitched to citizens anxious over the role of Islam in society, by pledging to ban the burqa, deport radical preachers and (in the case of the BNP), end immigration from Muslim countries"
Taken from this:
http://
jno
Your link is a typical far-left article, but taking a passage from it, not a selected piece altered by you, I would think that the majority of the British public would agree with most of this, if one first ignores the far-left introduction.
Note the obligatory name calling, nationalist, xenophobic,
Eurosceptic, similar to radical right parties on the continent,
/// UKIP:
/// Though formed to oppose European integration, since 2001
the UK Independence Party (UKIP) has developed a suite
of radical right-wing policies. By 2010, and like the BNP,
UKIP was offering a combination of nationalist, xenophobic,
Eurosceptic and populist policies. Similar to radical right parties
on the continent, ///
Now we will address what they call 'populist policies'
/// UKIP demanded that Britain end mass and
‘uncontrolled immigration’, though unlike the BNP it proposed
a five-year freeze. In addition, there were pledges to regain
border control, expel illegal immigrants, remove benefits for
remaining immigrants, repeal the Human Rights Act and ‘end
the active promotion of the doctrine of multiculturalism by local
and national government and all publicly funded bodies’.
UKIP
also played on other radical right themes, calling for an end to
political correctness, urging citizens to recognise ‘the numerous
threats to British identity and culture’, advocating a ban on the
burqa in public buildings, and inviting Geert Wilders to show his
anti-Islam documentary Fitna in the House of Lords. ///
Yes I think it is fair to describe these as 'populist policies'.
Your link is a typical far-left article, but taking a passage from it, not a selected piece altered by you, I would think that the majority of the British public would agree with most of this, if one first ignores the far-left introduction.
Note the obligatory name calling, nationalist, xenophobic,
Eurosceptic, similar to radical right parties on the continent,
/// UKIP:
/// Though formed to oppose European integration, since 2001
the UK Independence Party (UKIP) has developed a suite
of radical right-wing policies. By 2010, and like the BNP,
UKIP was offering a combination of nationalist, xenophobic,
Eurosceptic and populist policies. Similar to radical right parties
on the continent, ///
Now we will address what they call 'populist policies'
/// UKIP demanded that Britain end mass and
‘uncontrolled immigration’, though unlike the BNP it proposed
a five-year freeze. In addition, there were pledges to regain
border control, expel illegal immigrants, remove benefits for
remaining immigrants, repeal the Human Rights Act and ‘end
the active promotion of the doctrine of multiculturalism by local
and national government and all publicly funded bodies’.
UKIP
also played on other radical right themes, calling for an end to
political correctness, urging citizens to recognise ‘the numerous
threats to British identity and culture’, advocating a ban on the
burqa in public buildings, and inviting Geert Wilders to show his
anti-Islam documentary Fitna in the House of Lords. ///
Yes I think it is fair to describe these as 'populist policies'.
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