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Named Driver is uninsured and crashed my car.
Hello,
I have fully comprehensive motor insurance with about 6 years protected no claims bonus.
Last July i added my mum onto my insurance as a named driver.She had a non fault accident in the car in September and it therefore didn't affect my NCB.In January i renewed my car insurance with the same company(with the same reference number)and added my girlfriend as a named driver.In January I ensured over the phone that both named drivers were there.Yesterday my mum had another accident.I have rang my insurance company to explain the claim and they are saying my mum isn't down as a named driver.I'm now waiting for them to come back to me as i requested they check their recorded phone conversations.My policy document only shows me and my girlfriend as drivers.
My question is if they come back to me and say they have no record of the phonecall and therefore will not allow the claim can i be prosecuted and can my(65 year old)mum be prosecuted aswell?!?
Thanks in advance.
I have fully comprehensive motor insurance with about 6 years protected no claims bonus.
Last July i added my mum onto my insurance as a named driver.She had a non fault accident in the car in September and it therefore didn't affect my NCB.In January i renewed my car insurance with the same company(with the same reference number)and added my girlfriend as a named driver.In January I ensured over the phone that both named drivers were there.Yesterday my mum had another accident.I have rang my insurance company to explain the claim and they are saying my mum isn't down as a named driver.I'm now waiting for them to come back to me as i requested they check their recorded phone conversations.My policy document only shows me and my girlfriend as drivers.
My question is if they come back to me and say they have no record of the phonecall and therefore will not allow the claim can i be prosecuted and can my(65 year old)mum be prosecuted aswell?!?
Thanks in advance.
Answers
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I suspect that because you have policy documents which show you and your gf and not your mum, this will be sufficient for you to be held responsible for allowing uninsured driver to drive your car. It is after all, up to you to read the documents they send and contact them if it is wrong.
If your documents had shown them all, and it was the insurers system that was wrong, then it would be deemed that you could have reasonably considered ourselves covered.
If your documents had shown them all, and it was the insurers system that was wrong, then it would be deemed that you could have reasonably considered ourselves covered.
Hi Kira,
Yes the documents show myself and mu girlfriend as the drivers but i did ask the insurance company to amend their records over the phone.I have also spoken to the financial ombudsman and they have suggested i request copies of the recorded phonecalls.I'm not sure how they keep track of all calls relating to each policy but i'm going to haveto go that route i think.
Do you know what kind of punishment i and my mum could face?
Yes the documents show myself and mu girlfriend as the drivers but i did ask the insurance company to amend their records over the phone.I have also spoken to the financial ombudsman and they have suggested i request copies of the recorded phonecalls.I'm not sure how they keep track of all calls relating to each policy but i'm going to haveto go that route i think.
Do you know what kind of punishment i and my mum could face?
I work for an insurance company and we keep rec calls for 2 years.
They can normally be traced via telephone number.
When did you call your ins company to amend your records prior to the accident. As you would have received new docs confirming the change, so if you have not received them, ow come you did not query it?
Sory but these are the types of questions that we ask in this sort of situation so they will probably morethan likely hold you responsible unless these calls can be found.
They can normally be traced via telephone number.
When did you call your ins company to amend your records prior to the accident. As you would have received new docs confirming the change, so if you have not received them, ow come you did not query it?
Sory but these are the types of questions that we ask in this sort of situation so they will probably morethan likely hold you responsible unless these calls can be found.
Any amendments you make to your policy should result in the issue of a new policy, delivered to you so you check the details are correct.
If the insurance company does say that your mother is not insured then you can both be prosecuted - your mother for driving uninsured; you for permitting her to drive uninsured.
Driving without insurance is an 'absolute offence' - their either is insurance in place or there isn't. It is 'black and white'.
However, there are Special Reasons:Special Reasons Arguments
It can sometimes be argued that, whilst you are technically guilty of the offence in question because you were uninsured at the time you were driving, you have Special Reasons in relation to the circumstances in which you were driving, namely that you were driving under the genuine misapprehension that you were insured at the time. If you successfully argue that there are Special Reasons then the Magistrates have a discretion not to impose penalty points. In order to argue Special Reasons you would need to support your argument by giving evidence on oath and it is preferable to provide documentary evidence to the Magistrates in order to support your argument.
You may be able to establish Special Reasons
"if you have been mislead by the insurance company or somebody else as to the nature of the cover in place and this lead you to believe that you were insured at the time you were driving. You might also be able to argue Special Reasons if the insurance company cancelled the policy without good reason and failed to notify you of that in advance of the offence."
If the insurance company does say that your mother is not insured then you can both be prosecuted - your mother for driving uninsured; you for permitting her to drive uninsured.
Driving without insurance is an 'absolute offence' - their either is insurance in place or there isn't. It is 'black and white'.
However, there are Special Reasons:Special Reasons Arguments
It can sometimes be argued that, whilst you are technically guilty of the offence in question because you were uninsured at the time you were driving, you have Special Reasons in relation to the circumstances in which you were driving, namely that you were driving under the genuine misapprehension that you were insured at the time. If you successfully argue that there are Special Reasons then the Magistrates have a discretion not to impose penalty points. In order to argue Special Reasons you would need to support your argument by giving evidence on oath and it is preferable to provide documentary evidence to the Magistrates in order to support your argument.
You may be able to establish Special Reasons
"if you have been mislead by the insurance company or somebody else as to the nature of the cover in place and this lead you to believe that you were insured at the time you were driving. You might also be able to argue Special Reasons if the insurance company cancelled the policy without good reason and failed to notify you of that in advance of the offence."
Thanks for the responses.
My policy was due for renewal on 12th February.
I called the insurance company on 12th January as i was going to visit my brother in Australia that day for two months and wanted to ensure the car was insured for another year as i wouldn't be able to do it while i was on holiday.My girlfriend wanted to use it sporadically while i was away.
I spoke to a lady earlier in their Indian call centre and she confirmed that my mum was down their as a named driver.Then i had another call a different employee about ten minutes later saying they hadto check through the phone records.
I've always had issues getting documents from them in the past and now it's cometo ahead as i've hadto make a claim.
I'm more worried for my mum then myself.What i may try and do is approach the other driver to try and settle out of insurance as i have his details.
My policy was due for renewal on 12th February.
I called the insurance company on 12th January as i was going to visit my brother in Australia that day for two months and wanted to ensure the car was insured for another year as i wouldn't be able to do it while i was on holiday.My girlfriend wanted to use it sporadically while i was away.
I spoke to a lady earlier in their Indian call centre and she confirmed that my mum was down their as a named driver.Then i had another call a different employee about ten minutes later saying they hadto check through the phone records.
I've always had issues getting documents from them in the past and now it's cometo ahead as i've hadto make a claim.
I'm more worried for my mum then myself.What i may try and do is approach the other driver to try and settle out of insurance as i have his details.
Question for Harryt(or anyone else who works for an insurance company).
I found my certificate of motor insurance which expired on 12th Feb(my renewal date) showing my mum as a named driver.When i renewed on 12th January (under the same policy number) would my named drivers have been removed.Is that standard practice when renewing or is the insurance cover kept with the same drivers?
Thanks in advance.
I found my certificate of motor insurance which expired on 12th Feb(my renewal date) showing my mum as a named driver.When i renewed on 12th January (under the same policy number) would my named drivers have been removed.Is that standard practice when renewing or is the insurance cover kept with the same drivers?
Thanks in advance.
Another insurance guy here. When the policy automatically renews, the details should remain the same.
I would guess that as you spoke to an Indian call centre (and ours are as useless as most of them, but not my decision to employ them), I suspect they changed the driver rather than adding a new one.
Our calls have been kept after being recorded for about 5 years - however, it does not mean they have necessarily recorded every call.
I think Kira has unfortunately hit the nail on the head - when you asked them to add your mum, they should have sent you a new certificate of insurance with your mum on there.
Obviously the commen sense approach here is that you asked her to be added, and you would assume she was - not sure where that stands in the eyes of the law, but in that respect I think Ethel will be correct.
Hopefully they will find the call - I honestly cannot advise you how they would proceed if they cannot locate it. I suspect in that case Harry will be correct in that the insurers will go with whatever the notes on the system say - hopefully the note states that your mum was added, and they just failed to print the certificate/make the amendments
If the police were not involved in the accident (i.e. attended the scene and asked for documents to be produced), then don;t worry about prosecution. Obviously be aware that your mother MAY end up liable for any costs if it is decided that she was not insured. Not much help I know!
I would guess that as you spoke to an Indian call centre (and ours are as useless as most of them, but not my decision to employ them), I suspect they changed the driver rather than adding a new one.
Our calls have been kept after being recorded for about 5 years - however, it does not mean they have necessarily recorded every call.
I think Kira has unfortunately hit the nail on the head - when you asked them to add your mum, they should have sent you a new certificate of insurance with your mum on there.
Obviously the commen sense approach here is that you asked her to be added, and you would assume she was - not sure where that stands in the eyes of the law, but in that respect I think Ethel will be correct.
Hopefully they will find the call - I honestly cannot advise you how they would proceed if they cannot locate it. I suspect in that case Harry will be correct in that the insurers will go with whatever the notes on the system say - hopefully the note states that your mum was added, and they just failed to print the certificate/make the amendments
If the police were not involved in the accident (i.e. attended the scene and asked for documents to be produced), then don;t worry about prosecution. Obviously be aware that your mother MAY end up liable for any costs if it is decided that she was not insured. Not much help I know!
Thanks Gouldc.Knowing my mum won't be spending time at her majestys pleasure is a small comfort at least!
Funnily enough the other party involved was also insured through the same insurance company(soon to be renaming itself).It's a possibility that my own insurance company will be prosecuting me for their own administration error.Ironic eh.
I'm supposed to be getting a callback from them today after they have reviewed the past call records.I'll update the thread with the outcome.
Funnily enough the other party involved was also insured through the same insurance company(soon to be renaming itself).It's a possibility that my own insurance company will be prosecuting me for their own administration error.Ironic eh.
I'm supposed to be getting a callback from them today after they have reviewed the past call records.I'll update the thread with the outcome.
Hi All,As promised i said i would update the thread with the outcome of my dispute i had with my insurance company.They reviewed all the calls i had with them and have admitted they had a "technical error" their end on updating my policy with the correct named driver details.Seems i'll be getting my car fixed afterall.
Thanks for the advice.
Thanks for the advice.
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