Body & Soul0 min ago
I am living in an old barn illegally as i do not have planning permission, but i have been paying council tax for over 3 years
If i carry on paying council tax, is there a certain term that after so many years then I will automatically gain residential rights to live here legally
Answers
1 to 17 of 17
Best Answer
No best answer has yet been selected by chrisplum. Once a best answer has been selected, it will be shown here.
For more on marking an answer as the "Best Answer", please visit our FAQ.
Not really my area but I'd have said planning laws/policies differed from land ownership issues - adverse possession which is nowhere near as simple as just occupying a piece of land for the sufficient amount of years. Bushbaby might be able to advise better as I think they might be a planning officer or similar.
Do you own the land/barn? Have you looked into the planning position? Is there something stating it cannot be used for residential use?
Do you own the land/barn? Have you looked into the planning position? Is there something stating it cannot be used for residential use?
-- answer removed --
It's 10 years, not 12, that is critical.
This is about the length of time that one has to operate under a different 'planning use' to that currently permitted (the barn will be agricultural use only) for 'residential use' to be established. (If you had built a new but unlawful property, the length of time would have been only 4 years, but for a change of use, you need to establish 10 years' continous use).
After 10 years, you can apply for a 'certificate of lawfulness' to regularise the position, and this application cannot be denied provided your facts are shown true.
Whether you are paying CT doesn't change the price of fish - it merely demonstrates that the local authority are inept.
This is about the length of time that one has to operate under a different 'planning use' to that currently permitted (the barn will be agricultural use only) for 'residential use' to be established. (If you had built a new but unlawful property, the length of time would have been only 4 years, but for a change of use, you need to establish 10 years' continous use).
After 10 years, you can apply for a 'certificate of lawfulness' to regularise the position, and this application cannot be denied provided your facts are shown true.
Whether you are paying CT doesn't change the price of fish - it merely demonstrates that the local authority are inept.
Oh no it isn't. It is 10 years. Please see the bottom of page 2 of this document (section 8).
http://www.planningpo...elp014_england_en.pdf
Why do some people interfere in things when they patently know little about?
http://www.planningpo...elp014_england_en.pdf
Why do some people interfere in things when they patently know little about?
Hi Chris, Jenna is correct I am a planning officer (and I am a 'she' lol)
Council Tax and Planning Permission are two separate things. It is possible for you to be charged Council Tax even without planning permission to be living there and it in no way affects the Council's right to take planning enforcement action against you. In good Councils the tax people tell the planning people when they register a new property for Council Tax but sadly this doesn't always happen.
For the change of use of a building to a single family dwelling house you would need to prove you had occupied the building as such for four years. Normally change of use from agricultural to another use invokes the ten year rule but there is sufficient case law to establish that it is the four year rule that applies to an unauthorised dwellinghouse. There is nothing automatic - you would have to apply for a Lawful Development Certificate and prove on the balance of probabilities that the barn has been occupied as a single family dwelling house for at least four years. The onus is on you to provide the evidence and prove your case. The application currently costs £335.
There is no 12 year rule under the Planning Acts so other posters' references to that are a red herring. The other posts relating to land ownership and adverse possession are also confusing matters as you do not seem to be suggesting you are there without the owner's permission, just without planning permission. However it would be useful if you would clarify this.
The Localism Bill is seeking to change enforcement powers and it is uncertain at present when and how the law may change.
Council Tax and Planning Permission are two separate things. It is possible for you to be charged Council Tax even without planning permission to be living there and it in no way affects the Council's right to take planning enforcement action against you. In good Councils the tax people tell the planning people when they register a new property for Council Tax but sadly this doesn't always happen.
For the change of use of a building to a single family dwelling house you would need to prove you had occupied the building as such for four years. Normally change of use from agricultural to another use invokes the ten year rule but there is sufficient case law to establish that it is the four year rule that applies to an unauthorised dwellinghouse. There is nothing automatic - you would have to apply for a Lawful Development Certificate and prove on the balance of probabilities that the barn has been occupied as a single family dwelling house for at least four years. The onus is on you to provide the evidence and prove your case. The application currently costs £335.
There is no 12 year rule under the Planning Acts so other posters' references to that are a red herring. The other posts relating to land ownership and adverse possession are also confusing matters as you do not seem to be suggesting you are there without the owner's permission, just without planning permission. However it would be useful if you would clarify this.
The Localism Bill is seeking to change enforcement powers and it is uncertain at present when and how the law may change.
Here you go, summary from Development Control Practice...
The 4 year rule at sec.171B(1) of the Act provides immunity from enforcement for operational development, and at sec.171B(2) changes of use to a single dwellinghouse are also included. As noted already, in accordance with the judgment in SoS v Arun DC and Karen Brown 10/08/2006 the latter extends to situations where a change of use to a single dwellinghouse has occurred in breach of a specific condition. But for the 4-year rule to apply to changes of use to a single dwellinghouse the building in question must have the attributes of a single dwellinghouse and satisfy the relevant tests.
The 4 year rule at sec.171B(1) of the Act provides immunity from enforcement for operational development, and at sec.171B(2) changes of use to a single dwellinghouse are also included. As noted already, in accordance with the judgment in SoS v Arun DC and Karen Brown 10/08/2006 the latter extends to situations where a change of use to a single dwellinghouse has occurred in breach of a specific condition. But for the 4-year rule to apply to changes of use to a single dwellinghouse the building in question must have the attributes of a single dwellinghouse and satisfy the relevant tests.
-- answer removed --
We are having the same problem please bushbaby give us some advice ? we own the land and have lived in a chalet for 10 years initially it was only for an office and kitchen toliet, this has planning permission but it was being burgled so we moved in and made it a lovely chalet home from home. we have been paying council tax for the last 4 years and have been given our own postcode by the council but we have now been told by planning they will oppose our application for to change legally to a dwelling HELP
Hi Mrs_M,
If you can prove you have been living there continuously for the last 4 years you can apply for a Certificate of Lawful Use (also known as a Lawful Development Certificate). If you can prove this then it doesn't matter what the Council thinks about whether or not it would receive retrospective planning permission because the Certificate makes it immune from enforcement action.
The fee is currently £335 and you would need to supply scaled drawings to show the land and building, as well as supplying documents to prove continuous occupancy, such as council tax, utility bills, mortgage statements etc. You might want to start your own thread rather than jumping on chris's if you want us to be able to comment back and forth on the issue.
If you can prove you have been living there continuously for the last 4 years you can apply for a Certificate of Lawful Use (also known as a Lawful Development Certificate). If you can prove this then it doesn't matter what the Council thinks about whether or not it would receive retrospective planning permission because the Certificate makes it immune from enforcement action.
The fee is currently £335 and you would need to supply scaled drawings to show the land and building, as well as supplying documents to prove continuous occupancy, such as council tax, utility bills, mortgage statements etc. You might want to start your own thread rather than jumping on chris's if you want us to be able to comment back and forth on the issue.
1 to 17 of 17
Latest Posts
Problem With Sending Attachment
Computers1 min ago
Crosswords8 mins ago
News8 mins ago
Quizzes & Puzzles12 mins ago
Related Questions
Sorry, we can't find any related questions. Try using the search bar at the top of the page to search for some keywords, or choose a topic and submit your own question.