fing family history

[misslm979]

my grandfather was arthur thomas roberts born october 1st 1919 born nuneaton his mother was elizabeth hayward who married wiliam christmas roberts in west derby 1917 now my grandfather told my mother he had 7 or 8 brothers and sisters an they where brought up by the nuns but im having trouble finding these brothers and sisters i know tere was a charles hroberts born 1917 ut cant find any thing else .i now there was a frank j roberts but cant find him he was a witness at my grandfathers wedding ,william christmas roberts born 1867 in st maryle bone was my ggrandfather who was 52 when my granddad was born so he may of been maried before and had children with someone else so thats why i cant find them can anyone help me with this

[dot.haukes]

you need to look on the 1911 census for him and see where he was living and who he was married to and his children etc,
go to

1911census.co.uk and follow the instructions, you probably will only need to spend a few pounds if you do the eliminating first.

[misslm979]

thank you i checked website and nothing come up its so irratating when that happens i just feel like ill never know who my family are thank you for your help though,i do appriate all f the responces i get i just wish i could solve thisfamily mystory

[dot.haukes]

Just to make a complete shot in the dark, the surname Christmas is predominant in Surrey and surrounding counties, there was a Ann Roberts on the 1881 census a widow, with a son William C. Roberts he was 13 and she was born 1839 in Dorking, Surrey. That William C. Roberts was the right age, oh and they were in Marylebone , which was his birth place.
I think Christmas will have been a maternal surname.

[misslm979]

right i thought maybe christmas was his middle name and not a surname thank you for your help though ill try and do a search ike that its very in important i put his family tree together now as my grandfather is dead but there is so many children missing i dont seem to find,thats what makes me think william c roberts was married before and had children with her and maybe she died and he remarried elizabeth hayward remaried but she only had two children with william as far records tell unless the children where not born in nuneaton like my grandad arthur thomas robertsbut my mother said my grandad was a true londoner and thats what makes me think arthur was moved back up there or something because he was born in nuneaton can anyone help me

[dot.haukes]

well probably he is the Willliam C Roberts who on the 1891 census was aged 24, b Marylebone and he was the deputy in the Christchurch. marylebone lodging house, he was unmarried. (RG12 piece 101 folio 124 page 1)

In 1901 he was living at 2 Birkbeck Rd Hornsey Middlesex with his wife Sarah, he was 33 she was 36, his occupoation was a Printers Warehouseman. Sarah was born in Wasford Herts (it looked like Wasford) they had no children at that time. This fits with the william C I found on the 1881 census last night. I shall look at the 1871 tio confirm his father. OK?

[dot.haukes]

right I'#ve finally found Wiiliam C Roberts on the 1871 census and it does confirm that the ann in 1881 wqas his mother.
In 1871 they lived at 24, Upper Chorlton Place, Marylebone. the reason it took so long to find is that William C aged 3 is transcribed in the index as William E, when you look at it you will see why the transcriber made the mistake, annoying all the same.
The family are:
Edward Roberts aged 28 Journeyman Tailor born Kent, Canterbury.
Ann Roberts 24 born Dorking Surrey
James H.E. Roberts aged 6 born marylebone
William C. Roberts aged 3 born marylebone
Ann H. Roberts aged 1 born Pancras.

In 1881, Edward has dies, James is not at home, but William and Ann both are.

[dot.haukes]

sorry edward was 38 and ann was 34 in 1871, I've found edward on the 1851 census aged 18 as an apprentice tailor living in canterbury kent boarding with his master Taylor Philip Duly and his family.

In 1841 aged 8 edward is living with his mother ann a victualler not born in kent, his brother james aged 6 and sister emma aged 2, they lived in All Saints parish canterbury, all the children were born in Kent. His mother was 40, I guess she had been widowed and had older children but they are niot in this family group, I could search the parish for any other Roberts children.


Can't find Edward yet in 1861

[misslm979]

thank you that so helpfull to me can you find out who william c roberts wife was this sarah women as she is more than likely the mother of the other childen who my grandad spoke of and i know your really clever so you might be able to tell me if they had any children thanks again your a star

[misslm979]

also if edward lived in all saints parish in canturbury does hat mean they lived in a church and what is a avictualler is that her surname

[dot.haukes]

William C.'s brother James H.E. Roberts, was not with his mother and siblings in 1881, he would have been 16 or 17 then. In 1881 I have found a James Roberts , Private, at the Woolwich barracks, Sandling Rd, Woolwich, Kent. His birthplace is given as Kent. I have also found a James H.E. Roberts in the British Army medal rolls who was awarded the Victory Medal in 1915 for action in Egypt, his rank was Lance Corporal.
That would make him 51 in 1915, he was not killed in action. In 1913, a James H.E. Roberts married Helena Van Praagh in Stepney.
Just thought you might be interested in all of that.

[dot.haukes]

A victualler sells alcohol usually in an inn, they would be licensed. It is still a term used today.
No they lived in the Parish of All Saints, that's a district, of Canterbury I think.
I have looked for William marrying as William Christmas Roberts or William C Roberts from 1901 back to 1891 and there is no entry, therefore, if he married, he married as William Roberts, which is a really common name, it would need a close look at every William Roberts entry for any clue in the registration district to spot a likelt choice. Or , a search from 1901 forwards in the index to spot any Roberts children being registered at Hornsey maybe, or whichever registration district that was, I have checked ther 1911 free search for a william and sarah toberts and there asre a couple but it costs to look at the original entry. you would need to do that to eliminate the wrong ones.

[rogerr]

Excuse me, but I have to say this. I have seen several threads lately on genealogy and have to say Dot certainly knows her stuff!
Well done Dot.

[dot.haukes]

thanks rogerr, whilst I am off work i can spend more time with it, been doing this 22 years now, before home computers were around pretty much!!

[misslm979]

she really does know her stuff i always think im clever and get lost ten minutes later so where better off leaving f leaving it to the experts like dot thanks for the info again and yeah im intrested the past is far more interesting than the future,can i ask you how you find out which childen are born to which parents for instance william and sarahs children

[GaryWalesLiverpo]

I have WIlliam Christmas Roberts in my Family who married in 1917 to Elizabeth Hayward , is this thread still active ?

[fiction-factory]

It's still active but as it's so old it won't appear on Latest Posts. Hopefully some of those who were involved in the thread would have subscribed to it and may receive a notification that there has been a post from you today. If no-one responds you could always post a new thread entitled something like William Christmas Roberts -Family History and provide a link to this old thread- or you could do an FAO dot hawkes (aka dot haukes here) who does look in. Unfortunately, I doubt missim979 is still around though as she hasn't posted here since 2009

[GaryWalesLiverpo]

Thank you