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many thanks for all the answers - I too have been through all those starting pen and came up with the same problem - have checked sheet carefully and it does say insects but as you say errors do occur. Apologies grasscarp, I did mean (3) - didn't spot 0!! Same long trawl through with mut and cur .... actuall I quite liked Dover for german egg (D ova) but I think grasscarp is right. thanks factor30 - where would we be without wiki to help tired brains