Has there ever been any concrete evidence ( apart from teachings of various prophets/Christ etc.) that an afterlife/rebirth exists ?
And if not - why do billions believe in one?
joe1 Sat 17/05/08 14:16
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if there was any concrete evidence then people wouldn't have the choice to believe it or not! in which case i think people would like to believe there is something rather than nothing after we die as it is somewhat a more pleasent tought surely.
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Question Author
Thanks for your answer - but if there has never been any evidence that an afterlife exists.
Are you saying that we believe in one simply because its better than not to ?
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The folks who do believe in 'Glory' can spend their time on earth feeling superior, forming clubs and societies, and reaching positions of authority not available to those who choose not to believe.
We sinners receive pitying looks and patronising sentiment and will be forever denied 'Glory' and in certain circumstances, in a variety of time and countries, we can be punished, mistreated and even killed.............
.................and all based upon the 'theory' (because it can be nothing more until 'proof' is demonstrated) that somewhere in the cosmos sits the ultimate tally-man; taking stock and making note of our every action...........
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Question Author
Thanks jack..,I think you may be making a bit of a sweeping statement there when you say that all folks that believe in an afterlife fell superior to those that don't.
I am simply interested as to how a theory that has never been proven can have such sway over us and affect the world as it does.
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Hi Joe,
I remember someone asking Roy Castle (shortly before he died) what he thought of his imminent death. He replied "Well nobody's ever come back and complained!" Which is true as nobody does ever come back in body to tell us! What we have, when you watch clairvoyants such as John Edward or Colin Fry, is the deceased (if you can believe your ears!) coming back and communicating via a third person. As there is no face-to-face communication, the details of their readings can be either spot on or sketch y to say the least! Many people think such things are a load of rubbish and many people think they are true, which unfortunately does not answer your question!
If you saw a clairvoyant who told you things that nobody else but yourself knew to be true, then that would be your evidence but that does not mean that everyone else is going to believe you when you tell them, unless they experience it for themselves.
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Question Author
Thanks Le Chat,
Get your drift - but going by personal experience approx 1% of folks I know have seen a clarvoyant and been convinced of an afterlife.
Given that there are billions on earth who hold that belief who have never seen a clarvoyant - just means that there must be some other reason.
Is it simply our need to believe in it - true or not?
Guess so.
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No, not all the folks who believe in the afterlife and the 'heavenly creator' feel superior and show it.................but many of those who are willing to share their beliefs with you emanate a smugness which invites a hostile response.
Try telling them you are married again..........when your first spouse is still living and then listen to what they truly believe.........even on AB !!!
I don't think that as a 21st Century society we need to believe, unfortunately, however, we are unable to shake off 2,000 years of indoctrination and free ourselves of the shackles religion imposes upon us.
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Ah, but Jack, you can still believe in the afterlife but not be at all religious, like myself. Agnostic and not affiliated with any other religious or 'spiritual' belief, I believe that we re-incarnate in order to learn lessons and evolve as souls. We each are at a different level of development 1 being a new or newish incarnate up to 7 being totally developed and ready to quit reincarnating. I am around level 4 myself. I suspect my best friend of being a level 5 (although I have never discussed this with her) and my ex husband of being level 1-2.
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Question Author
Interesting theory Le Chat.
Agree with you that jack is mixing religion into this which complicates matters somewhat. Eg. jack - afterlife has been around a lot longer than eg. Christianity quote (2000 years).
So you are saying that the 'nice' folks around are nearing their end of cycle ? And Adolf was on his first ?
So what happens then do you reckon ??
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I'd say someone like Adolf Hitler or any other 'non insane' murderer stays 'on the other side' until they begin to realise and accept the horror of what they'd done. It doesn't necessarily mean that they were level 1, they could be higher but have got 'carried away' with power and corruption.
Someone like Mother Theresa for example, was probably on their final visit. She had become completely altruistic and had given totally of herself to others.
Also, bad things that happen can be for the 'benefit' of others. For example, Suzy Lamplugh was murdered in the 80's by a prospective viewer of a house. (She was an estate agent) Her body was never found. Since then her mother has dedicated her life to setting up a trust to give support and guidance, as well as practical self-defence, to people concerned with or experiencing crime. So maybe the purpose of Suzy's death was to set her mother on a path to help other people, as a direct result of her daughter's death.
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what a pile of $hit. All theory and no eveidence.
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Question Author
Hi wizard,
Thanks for that - no worries. But thats exactly it isnt it - Le Chat and millions have strong beliefs in something you describe as *hit .
Why does she when there is no positive proof.
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Hi Wiz - Your answer and past posts would suggest that you are level 2 and rising, even though you are quick to jump to conclusions and dismiss anything that you don't think is right in your eyes!
I love the way you just come out and say it, so cutting and final in your approach!
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Joe - Why do I believe it? Quite simply because it's better then the alternative! However, there is more to it than simply hope but it would take too long to explain and I am too tired!
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if proof was absolute then it would not be a true test of faith, just because there is no proof does not mean it does not exist i have more difficulty believing that all this is purely random
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I have very similar beliefs to you Le Chat. However, I do wonder why there are not more 'nice' people around, which would in turn make the world a nicer place. The other thing that I can't quite get my head around is since we have such a population explosion, where are all these new spirits coming from and where have they been?
Also, I recently read a book about past AND future lives and in this book, one example of someone who was hypnotised, had them reincarnating in the future as a murderer. I find this thought quite upsetting because it sort of upsets the belief that we improve ourselves spiritually each time we reincarnate.
Any thoughts?
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yeah...its a pile of horse manure.
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Invisible - My answer for the population explosion v new spirits is two fold. 1) Not all souls are reincarnating at the same time. eg, one soul may reicarnate 20 yrs after dying, another may reincarnate 20 minutes after dying and another may reincarnate 200 yrs after dying. 2) New souls are being 'produced' as we once were. There's nothing to say that supply can't keep up with demand!
As to your other point about the murderer- The future hasn't happened yet and it is not set in stone.
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The only evidence we have comes from personal testimony, and therefore we have no proof at all, but I believe the spirit survives death. It's nature - and, like many things in nature, it's something that science doesn't yet understand - but hopefully will in the future. Although I have my doubts about Le Chat's specific grading system, I feel that reincarnation is a possibility. The survival of the soul has no connection with religion or with a belief in any god. All of that is man-made.
Invisible, I wouldn't pay too much attention to that book.
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I believe I'm a level 0.
"Suzy Lamplugh was just God's plaything, devoid of freewill whose existence was merely a stick to encourage her mother to do good?"
What kind of corrupt, f___ed up, unethical, immoral, woo woo horsecack is that..? That is completely indefensible - even most religions have worked out that those sort of arguments offend common decency.
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