Do Christians And Muslims Worship The Same God.

[gordiescotland1]

Hi There I saw a post on facebook that said Muslims and Christians do not worship the same God. And I copied it on to my wall. Anyway one of my really pc friends said that is not true and it is hate crime to say that and if it is not removed she will phone the police. But surely that is true. Muslims worship Allah where as Christians worship God?

[Khandro]

Quote "The Church had stated its opposition to the atheism and revolutionary nature of the Communists.."
What is it you don't understand? the mass slaughter was because of their opposition to atheism and it was carried out by those wishing to force atheism upon them.

// If your reasoning that atheism was the cause of the deaths of millions in Russia..// Your figure, but yes I do, - and so does everyone else except the deniers on here. But why should I then, // have to explain why more deaths have been caused by theocratic rulers.//

What has the one got to do with the other? The 'argument' is because of your saying that atheism was not responsible for the deaths of believers. We are as yet only talking about the USSR, we could if you like, also take a look at Pol Pot and Mao and some others. I think you will find it difficult to match those figures in comparison to what you call, deaths by theocratic rulers.

[naomi24]

Khandro, believing what you want to believe doesn’t make it so. No one denies that people were killed but your reasoning that the promotion of atheism alone was responsible for the slaughter is inaccurate. You are allowing your irrational hatred of atheists and atheism to muddy the reality of political history.

[naomi24]

Khandro, //"The Church had stated its opposition to the atheism and revolutionary nature of the Communists.."
What is it you don't understand? the mass slaughter was because of their opposition to atheism and it was carried out by those wishing to force atheism upon them. //

See what you did there? You left the bit about the 'revolutionary nature of the communists' out.

[Khandro]

naomi; Can't you read? no I didn't leave it out.

In Cambodia (Democratic Kampuchea) 'Cambodian Buddhism, with very deep roots in the culture and history of the country, became a primary target for elimination.
In the 1960s, prior to the Khmer Rouge seizing power, the number of Buddhist monks and novices was around 65,000. When the Khmer Rouge was finally forced out of power by the Vietnamese army, fewer than 100 monks remained.'

[naomi24]

Khandro, yes I can read. That’s how I know you restricted your final summation to the bit about atheism.

[jomifl]

Clanad.
/Seem to support Khando's position clearly... /
and I quote from your link...

/The roots of this hatred and intolerance of religion lie in the essence of communist ideology./
so there you have it..

[jomifl]

Khandro,/// If your reasoning that atheism was the cause of the deaths of millions in Russia..// Your figure, but yes I do, - and so does everyone else except the deniers on here
You can of course subsantiate that ridiculous statement..please try.

[Khandro]

//You can of course subsantiate that ridiculous statement..please try.//
No thanks, I've done so over and over again and you seem incapable of grasping the statistics, and seeing the facts which are everywhere recorded, in books and on the many internet links.
There are irrefutable statistcs for the enormous deaths carried out against peoble of all religions under atheist ideology available for Cambodia, China, North Korea and more. If you are so prejudiced that you are blind to the facts, I can say no more.

[jomifl]

Khandro, you still have not grasped that atheism is not an ideology, it is just a lack of belief in a god. Some ideologies may incorporate atheism as part of their dogma but that is something else completely. You are making things too complicated for you to understand by attaching your own baggage to the term atheism. How can a lack of belief in a god incite people to murder? the idea is preposterous.

[naomi24]

Khandro, those were communist ideologies. It really shouldn't be that difficult for you to grasp.

[beso]

Soviet Communism was very much a religious belief.

[Khandro]

fender; They won't read it, and even if they did, and as simple as it is, they won't understand it. You see, the prejudiced have no problems in forming their opinions because they feel no need to understand the facts.

[naomi24]

Khandro, I've read it. What facts do you think I don't understand?

[jomifl]

Khandro,
/and with a Communist ideology–justified his horrific crimes against humanity./
and there it is again...where is the atheism?
Yes I did read it and I may even have read the bits that you glossed over as you can see.
How many more times are you going to shoot yourself in the foot.,

[birdie1971]

jomifl -

It would appear that Khandro has endless feet through which to shoot. His accuracy is unwavering and his avidity for doing so is unparalleled despite his apparent cecity.

[birdie1971]

Khandro - "fender; They [the atheists on AB] won't read it..."

Wow. Your arrogance is both boundless and shameless, "... and even if they did, and as simple as it is, they won't understand it..."


Well, I can assure you Khandro (and fender) that I have read it and I did understand it. However, it is clear that at this juncture in this thread there is little to no value in continuing since you appear to be immune to logic, reason and evidence. Despite that, I shall leave you with a couple of quotes from the linked article on Stalin:

"... during World War II, Stalin eased up considerably on religion. He allowed for tens of thousands of Russian Orthodox churches to reopen, adopted an official policy of tolerance toward Muslims, and re-established the hierarchy of leadership in the Russian Orthodox Church. There were even rumors that Stalin had reconsidered his own personal relationship to religion when he took a “mysterious retreat” in 1941..." - ** Factually accurate **

and then immediately following on from the above quote,

"... But for all accounts and purposes, Stalin was a hardcore atheist until the day he died." - ** Speculative **

Do you see the difference? One statement can be proven by documentary evidence and backed up by historically verifiable texts and the other is simply a statement of opinion regarding Stalin's beliefs. I've said it before and I'll say it again - you have a fundamental lack of understanding about what atheism is. It is also clear that you utterly fail to see the difference between evidence and opinion. You seemingly conflate the two in your mind and then become confused as to which one is which.

[Khandro]

Now incredibly, to prop up an irrational and false argument, birdie attempts to demonstrate a 'Mr Nice Guy' side to Joseph Stalin!!
What is your agenda here! The Marxist/ Leninist ideology of the removal of all religions in the pursuit of an atheist society approved that thousands of Christian churches were destroyed or re-appropriated along with synagogues and mosques. Huge untold numbers of bishops, priests and clerics were murdered for their refusal to accept this diktat, and you have the naivety and/or stupidity, to say this had nothing to do with atheism.
Denial of the Bolshevik holocaust now carries a 5-year prison sentence in Russia, courtesy of Vladimir Putin.
You are now the second one on this thread to have the temerity say I do not understand atheism, really, what do I not understand? - try me!

[naomi24]

Khandro, //try me!//

Go on then.

By the way, I'll say it again, no one has denied that people were slaughtered.

[jomifl]

/The Marxist/ Leninist ideology of the removal of all religions in the pursuit of an atheist society /
Wrong Khandro, the removal of religion(if true) would have been in pursuit of a communist society. Lack of a belief in god is politically neutral.