Listener 4283

[Contrarian]

I presume the www.crosswordclub.co.uk site is down.

There's no other url is there?

[flocker]

It's back up

[AHearer]

Ah well, at least the break gave me time to get a casserole in the oven....

[Ruthrobin]

Yes, we were rather worried when it didn't appear but how moving to have a Mango just a week after Radix's funeral. This has been a real pleasure to solve. The preamble had us in somewhat of a panic but all resolves itself very satisfactorily. Trust Radix to give us a verbal one with a numerical aspect but thank you Radix for all the pleasure you have given us over the years.

[Contrarian]

Grid full now, apart from the required gaps. Now I just have to decode the preamble.

[jim360]

Couple of threads for this, not sure which to post in. Anyway, less intimidating than the preamble made it look! Thanks to Mango, and in particular to the late, great, Roddy Forman. I believe the implication from earlier comments after the wonderful Listener 4260 Nuts and Bolts is that this will be the last Mango puzzle we'll see? If so, such a shame, the inventiveness was always a treat.

Two farewell crosswords in a row.

[TheBear69]

Wonderful PDM on this one. Beautiful puzzle!

[trux]

Reuniting posts...this was a little gem from the Mango team (as ever - and who knows, maybe an editor somewhere, still has one last puzzle from these creative geniuses). Clues were perhaps easier than many of theirs in the past but the joy of the grid fill was there to behold. To any who may be put off by the seemingly ridiculous complexity of all that mathematical guff in the preamble, don't be! There are many shortcuts (especially post PDM) that render the solution most accessible. Many thanks to Mango.

[perseverer]

I'll just agree with what has already been said!

[AHearer]

Agreed, a little gem.

[Staurologist]

Once I tuned in to what was going on here, from the four key hidden words and the then obvious sum's result, I tried a date, which gave me the remaining special letters in the right order, but with one exception. I then tried another date and Mango's invention worked out harmoniously. The encoding and the summations are stunning, and given some superb clues this is one for other composers to admire and for solvers to enjoy.

[starwalker]

An absolute classic. Thanks Mango and I suppose, goodbye.

[tilbee]

Yes, not nearly as intimidating as the preamble suggests. Took the traditional Listener solving path of initially ignoring the majority of the preamble and cracked on with solving the clues, and the theme plus the date to be entered below became clear with the grid only half filled. Indeed then made much easier by being able to use the theme to fill additional cells and research the date as a shortcut to working out the individual mappings of the special letters (which potentially is not even necessary for a correct solution ?). My appreciation for a high quality Listener offering.

[jim360]

It seemed to me that there were at least four possible thematic dates that would fit the bill on the face of it. I'd expect that people who don't solve the sum might make a wrong guess?

[sunny-dave]

I really am just lost in admiration for this puzzle - quite a masterpiece.

Devising all the clues/gridfill was good enough - but to do it with with viable alternatives for the missing letter combinations was brilliant.

Then there was the numerical endgame - initially looking virtually impossible, but with just enough hints to make it possible to have a logical stab at a possible solution (I hit it on my second attempt) without some huge number crunching procedure.

Easily my favourite this year & it will take some beating I think.

[tilbee]

I fear you are correct jim360, having since my post gone to the trouble of solving the sum, and making the appropriate corrections. The danger of posting prematurely !

[emcee]

Best of the puzzles by far this season, but we're only into the third month.

A brilliant construction - my only qualm is the theme which I have always considered to be vastly overrated. But that's no fault to lay at Mango's doorstep.

I hope there's another Mango puzzle or two left in the pipeline as they never disappoint.

Thanks to Roddy (RIP), John and Steve.

[jim360]

I tend to think that the first part of the fourth bit, and the last of the second, are the main things worth paying attention to. But anyway.

Well, sorry tilbee! Oh well, a trap for the unwary, and the fact that there's an unambiguous date is surely the best art of the puzzle -- that the sum actually works and needs to be performed, rather than just being a distraction.

[tilbee]

Wow jim360, hate to think of the response if I had not been agreeing with you. I can only interpret this as either I misunderstand the sentiment of your post, or you mine. To be clear the statement around premature posting was in reference to myself. (All exclamation marks deleted :-).

[trux]

Given the rather odd anniversary (almost) celebrated, I suspect that this puzzle may have been "promoted" in the queue out of all due respect to Roddy. And quite rightly so, if that is the case. So, alas, I fear also that this might be the last Mango.

[jim360]

I meant, sorry to hear that you might have slipped up. Nothing more than that.