Crosswords1 min ago
Time for these schools to be closed down?
16 Answers
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11799713
http://tinyurl.com/3a8995h
Should these schools be allowed to teach the savage side of Islam?
/// Panorama: British Schools, Islamic Rules, BBC One, Monday, 22 November at 2030GMT ///
http://tinyurl.com/3a8995h
Should these schools be allowed to teach the savage side of Islam?
/// Panorama: British Schools, Islamic Rules, BBC One, Monday, 22 November at 2030GMT ///
Answers
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Much as I'd love to close down all religious schools doing so is clearly a breach of people's rights to educate their children in their preferred superstition - er religion.
Having said that it is already an offence to promote racial or religious hatred and if an individual school is found to be doing that then it should be prosecuted.
Closing down all schools because of a TV investigation is clearly a dumb knee jerk reaction.
The right thing to do is to make sure that all religous education like this and other religions comes under ofstead's remit
Having said that it is already an offence to promote racial or religious hatred and if an individual school is found to be doing that then it should be prosecuted.
Closing down all schools because of a TV investigation is clearly a dumb knee jerk reaction.
The right thing to do is to make sure that all religous education like this and other religions comes under ofstead's remit
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At first sight this seems preposterous. However on listening to the Panorama's Editor today he says the children are getting the grounding for when they get older and go back to Saudi Arabia to study education at a higher level and what is in the syllabus there. Some would say that If these Saudi ex-pats decide to take up an appointment in Britain they should conform with our education and not listen to what many regard as backward rules and laws.
These schools aren't state-funded, though, are they? And they're not 'day' schools, either. I thought they were evening and weekend schools, a bit like the way we sent our kids to bible class and bar mitsvah coaching.
I don't like what they're teaching, but as long as the kids they teach don't actually carry out what they're taught and don't break the law, as far as I know there's nothing to stop people teaching them.
You can legally teach someone how to tie a noose. It doesn't become illegal until it's actually used as such.
I don't like what they're teaching, but as long as the kids they teach don't actually carry out what they're taught and don't break the law, as far as I know there's nothing to stop people teaching them.
You can legally teach someone how to tie a noose. It doesn't become illegal until it's actually used as such.
Well, I have just watched it. It does seem that there are some dubious teachings in the main Islamic school system (state and private) in this country as well in the 'Saturday' schools. That I'm paying my taxes to support the former is something I'm not at all happy about. But if we're to allow Christian fundamentalists to spout some of the claptrap they do, then I don't see how we're going to justify stopping Muslims from doing the same.
They mentioned in the programme that Ofsted should be checking these schools out. When I worked in education we were given a couple of months warning from them that they were coming. This gives you plenty of time to have everything perfectly in place....total madness. They should be able to spot check without any warning then anything untoward would be found out and hopefully stamped on.
saxy_jag - “But if we're to allow Christian fundamentalists to spout some of the claptrap they do, then I don't see how we're going to justify stopping Muslims from doing the same.”
Well, there's claptrap and there's claptrap. The Christian fundamentalists do spout an ordinate amount of nonsense but it has to be said that they don't claim that members of other races resemble (or are) pigs and monkeys. Nor do they claim that holy war against none believers is the only sure-fire way to enter heaven.
I'm no fan of the Catholic church (to put it mildly) but when the UK is importing Saudi Arabia's Wahhabism and teaching it to impressionable children, then multicultural tolerance has gone too far. This is a belief system that teaches that democracy is evil, that anyone who isn't a Muslim will burn forever in hell, that women are intellectually inferior to men and that homosexuality is a sin against god that should be punished by a torturous death.
http://atheism.about....icsects/a/wahhabi.htm
Well, there's claptrap and there's claptrap. The Christian fundamentalists do spout an ordinate amount of nonsense but it has to be said that they don't claim that members of other races resemble (or are) pigs and monkeys. Nor do they claim that holy war against none believers is the only sure-fire way to enter heaven.
I'm no fan of the Catholic church (to put it mildly) but when the UK is importing Saudi Arabia's Wahhabism and teaching it to impressionable children, then multicultural tolerance has gone too far. This is a belief system that teaches that democracy is evil, that anyone who isn't a Muslim will burn forever in hell, that women are intellectually inferior to men and that homosexuality is a sin against god that should be punished by a torturous death.
http://atheism.about....icsects/a/wahhabi.htm
I've just realised that I haven't answered AOG's original question - “Time for these schools to be closed down?”
Yes.
I disagree with an earlier post that said that doing so would be... “a breach of people's rights to educate their children in their preferred superstition...”.
It would be no such thing. Restricting religious education in school does not breach anyone's rights. If a parent wants to educate their offspring about religious matters, they should and can do so out of the school environment. They can do so privately in their own home and/or send them to church or to the synagogue or to the mosque, etc.
Schools should teach facts (ie. provable concepts), not whimsical fairy-tails that can neither be proven nor disproven. The place for theological contemplation should be in religious institutions – not schools.
Yes.
I disagree with an earlier post that said that doing so would be... “a breach of people's rights to educate their children in their preferred superstition...”.
It would be no such thing. Restricting religious education in school does not breach anyone's rights. If a parent wants to educate their offspring about religious matters, they should and can do so out of the school environment. They can do so privately in their own home and/or send them to church or to the synagogue or to the mosque, etc.
Schools should teach facts (ie. provable concepts), not whimsical fairy-tails that can neither be proven nor disproven. The place for theological contemplation should be in religious institutions – not schools.
// You can legally teach someone how to tie a noose. It doesn't become illegal until it's actually used as such. //
That's not really true. You can't preach racial hatred. It doesn't matter whether the person you're preaching to ignores what you say, you're still committing an offence by doing the preaching.
There's anti-semitic nonsense in the textbooks they use (to name just one problem with them). It should be dealt with in the same way as if it was a creche run by the BNP (or EDL or whatever they call themselves now) trying to indoctrinate toddlers with the same sort of hatred.
That's not really true. You can't preach racial hatred. It doesn't matter whether the person you're preaching to ignores what you say, you're still committing an offence by doing the preaching.
There's anti-semitic nonsense in the textbooks they use (to name just one problem with them). It should be dealt with in the same way as if it was a creche run by the BNP (or EDL or whatever they call themselves now) trying to indoctrinate toddlers with the same sort of hatred.
saxy_jag
/// I don't like what they're teaching, but as long as the kids they teach don't actually carry out what they're taught and don't break the law, as far as I know there's nothing to stop people teaching them. ///
On the contrary there is much we can do to stop this indoctrination of young minds, how can one be sure that these vile teachings don't surface in later years.
/// I don't like what they're teaching, but as long as the kids they teach don't actually carry out what they're taught and don't break the law, as far as I know there's nothing to stop people teaching them. ///
On the contrary there is much we can do to stop this indoctrination of young minds, how can one be sure that these vile teachings don't surface in later years.
ludwig
/// It should be dealt with in the same way as if it was a creche run by the BNP (or EDL or whatever they call themselves now) trying to indoctrinate toddlers with the same sort of hatred.///
Not only the BNP or EDL, there are others who would be equally guilty if they also tried to indoctrinate young minds.
On a non-political basis, the present day sex education of young children has a lot to answer for.
/// It should be dealt with in the same way as if it was a creche run by the BNP (or EDL or whatever they call themselves now) trying to indoctrinate toddlers with the same sort of hatred.///
Not only the BNP or EDL, there are others who would be equally guilty if they also tried to indoctrinate young minds.
On a non-political basis, the present day sex education of young children has a lot to answer for.
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