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ChatterBank1 min ago
Why the need for the Tories’ to hold its first gay pride event?
38 Answers
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1218685/Stephen-Fry-Eddie-Izzard-round-Tories-homophobia-row-partys-new-right-wing-allies-Europe.html
Especially when they and others then start objecting to who else the Tories invited to this event,
In addition, Ben Summerskill, the head of pressure group Stonewall pulled out of the Tory gay event, held in Manchester' Gay Village, in protest at the presence of the two MEPs.
If gays want to get so much involved in politics, then why don't they start their own party?
Especially when they and others then start objecting to who else the Tories invited to this event,
In addition, Ben Summerskill, the head of pressure group Stonewall pulled out of the Tory gay event, held in Manchester' Gay Village, in protest at the presence of the two MEPs.
If gays want to get so much involved in politics, then why don't they start their own party?
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I would have thought that obvious.
There are a lot of gay people in the country perhaps as much as 5% and they have a vote. If they all decided to vote Labour because they perceived the Tories to be Homophobic that would be bad for Cameron.
Historically the Tories don't have a very gay-friendly image (You're not helping it by the way ) and the controversy whith some of Cameron's new European chums doesn't help.
If you want to help the Tories I suggest you dress up in your Sunday best with a big blue rosette and toddle of down to your nearest gay and lesbian centre and hug as many people as you can find.
There are a lot of gay people in the country perhaps as much as 5% and they have a vote. If they all decided to vote Labour because they perceived the Tories to be Homophobic that would be bad for Cameron.
Historically the Tories don't have a very gay-friendly image (You're not helping it by the way ) and the controversy whith some of Cameron's new European chums doesn't help.
If you want to help the Tories I suggest you dress up in your Sunday best with a big blue rosette and toddle of down to your nearest gay and lesbian centre and hug as many people as you can find.
"If gays want to get so much involved in politics, then why don't they start their own party?"
The LGBT community isn't a homogenous political entity - there are a variety of political beliefs within it. Like most people with differing political beliefs who want to get involved, they join the party whose ideas they believe are most in line with theirs. Considering, however, that Britain effectively has a two-party system, this is complicated by the factions that exist within the parties. There are pro-gay factions within the Conservative party, believe it or not.
The community does, however, have numerous supportive pressure groups (like most sections of society do) that are meant to keep an eye out for their rights. The best-known (and probably most successful) is Stonewall.
If there was an LGBT party, however, I think it's likely you'd probably start on your usual 'what next?' rant.
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To answer the title question, there is no need/compulsion for the Tories to hold a Pride event. It's the first one they've ever held. But somebody has organised it and that's their right. The main issue was the seeming inconsistency of it - Cameron allying himself with openly homophobic MEP while overseeing a Pride event. What exactly are you so riled about?
The LGBT community isn't a homogenous political entity - there are a variety of political beliefs within it. Like most people with differing political beliefs who want to get involved, they join the party whose ideas they believe are most in line with theirs. Considering, however, that Britain effectively has a two-party system, this is complicated by the factions that exist within the parties. There are pro-gay factions within the Conservative party, believe it or not.
The community does, however, have numerous supportive pressure groups (like most sections of society do) that are meant to keep an eye out for their rights. The best-known (and probably most successful) is Stonewall.
If there was an LGBT party, however, I think it's likely you'd probably start on your usual 'what next?' rant.
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To answer the title question, there is no need/compulsion for the Tories to hold a Pride event. It's the first one they've ever held. But somebody has organised it and that's their right. The main issue was the seeming inconsistency of it - Cameron allying himself with openly homophobic MEP while overseeing a Pride event. What exactly are you so riled about?
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ahmskunnirt
Could you clarify your point? I've read your post three times now, and it appears that you're answering completely different thread.
Are you saying that you object to homosexuals criticising heterosexuals in general? Have you got anyexamples of heterophobia you could present. Can't think of any myself.
Could you clarify your point? I've read your post three times now, and it appears that you're answering completely different thread.
Are you saying that you object to homosexuals criticising heterosexuals in general? Have you got anyexamples of heterophobia you could present. Can't think of any myself.
In answer to the question, good for Cameron in chasing the gay vote, but I hope he realises that he's fooling no-one.
If you're gay and you support Conservative policies, you'll vote Tory. If you're gay and you oppose Tory policy, no amount of 'out-reaching' is going to garner your vote.
Kromovaracun makes a valid point - whilst the gay community comes together for events like Pride, it's formed from many disperate elements, political views, economic backgrounds, racial backgrounds etc.
If you're gay and you support Conservative policies, you'll vote Tory. If you're gay and you oppose Tory policy, no amount of 'out-reaching' is going to garner your vote.
Kromovaracun makes a valid point - whilst the gay community comes together for events like Pride, it's formed from many disperate elements, political views, economic backgrounds, racial backgrounds etc.
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ahmskunnirt
Do you really think that you'd be called homophobic if you said "Gay sex is a real turn off for me. Not my cup of tea at all!"
No you wouldn't.
There's a world of difference between expressing a dislike for somethingand someone.
Also, if you're going to refer to specifics in a link, you really should refer to the link in you post, otherwise others won't understand the basis of your argument.
Do you really think that you'd be called homophobic if you said "Gay sex is a real turn off for me. Not my cup of tea at all!"
No you wouldn't.
There's a world of difference between expressing a dislike for somethingand someone.
Also, if you're going to refer to specifics in a link, you really should refer to the link in you post, otherwise others won't understand the basis of your argument.
ahmskunnirt
One other point, you're not comparing like with like - if a gay person criticises a heterosexual it won't be predecated on the fact that they're straight. That would be the (previously unheard of) 'heterophobia'.
However, in cases where a gay person complains of homophobia, it will be abuse based solely on their sexuality. Examples of this are workplace name-calling, physical assault (known colloquially as 'gay-bashing') and occasionally murder.
Not sure if I can ever recall of any heterophobic crimes of this nature.
One other point, you're not comparing like with like - if a gay person criticises a heterosexual it won't be predecated on the fact that they're straight. That would be the (previously unheard of) 'heterophobia'.
However, in cases where a gay person complains of homophobia, it will be abuse based solely on their sexuality. Examples of this are workplace name-calling, physical assault (known colloquially as 'gay-bashing') and occasionally murder.
Not sure if I can ever recall of any heterophobic crimes of this nature.
ahmskunnirt,
You've made the same mistake that a lot of other stupid people do. You don't understand what 'free' means.
Literally no one is topping you from expressing your view on the repugnancy of gay sex. You're free to do that.
Other people are free to suggest your views are homophobic.
You're then free to tell them why they're wrong. They're free to tell you why they're not.
And so on.
You're only complaining that you're not free to express your opinion, because you're too thin-skinned to stand up for your beliefs or the logic of those beliefs falls apart when scrutinised.
You're still free to express them though.
You've made the same mistake that a lot of other stupid people do. You don't understand what 'free' means.
Literally no one is topping you from expressing your view on the repugnancy of gay sex. You're free to do that.
Other people are free to suggest your views are homophobic.
You're then free to tell them why they're wrong. They're free to tell you why they're not.
And so on.
You're only complaining that you're not free to express your opinion, because you're too thin-skinned to stand up for your beliefs or the logic of those beliefs falls apart when scrutinised.
You're still free to express them though.
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I might wish to be in a gay pub with some friends that are gay.
And SP I think the issue is that there may be some gay voters who feel a natural leaning towards the Tories but are put off by their less than Gay friendly image.
For example they might vote Tory but not if they think the Tories might reverse the same-sex civil partnerships or raise the Gay age of consent.
I think this is about reassuring that group
And SP I think the issue is that there may be some gay voters who feel a natural leaning towards the Tories but are put off by their less than Gay friendly image.
For example they might vote Tory but not if they think the Tories might reverse the same-sex civil partnerships or raise the Gay age of consent.
I think this is about reassuring that group
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ahmskunnirt - The MEPs raising concerns are from the old Eastern Bloc, where tolerance towards gay people is less than it ought to be. Some have also espoused views that have offended Jews, hence The Board of Deputies of British Jews is also understood to have written to Mr Cameron to protest at the presence of the eastern Europeans in Manchester. This latter point is rather hidden in the Daily Mail's usual 'outrage'.
By all means use this platform to tell us what you think of gay people............just don't be surprised if they use it to tell you what they think of you.
By all means use this platform to tell us what you think of gay people............just don't be surprised if they use it to tell you what they think of you.
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Ok, for the pedants amongst you...........the MEPs are from Poland and Latvia, countries that formerly WERE in the Eastern Bloc. There are other 'former Eastern Bloc; countries whose records of human rights are disappointing when dealing with gay issues.
The event you mention was held in Hitler's favourite hotel..................!?!
The gay people involved are Stephen Fry (also Jewish) and Ben Summerskill. Eddie Izzard is not gay.
I don't think anyone could accuse Stephen or Ben as howling about anything.
I fail to see what other epithet you could use other than 'homophobic' when someone makes derogatory remarks or oversees prejudiced policies based solely on the sexuality of another group.
The event you mention was held in Hitler's favourite hotel..................!?!
The gay people involved are Stephen Fry (also Jewish) and Ben Summerskill. Eddie Izzard is not gay.
I don't think anyone could accuse Stephen or Ben as howling about anything.
I fail to see what other epithet you could use other than 'homophobic' when someone makes derogatory remarks or oversees prejudiced policies based solely on the sexuality of another group.
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