ChatterBank1 min ago
A Bravado Racist Chant Maybe, But A Real Act Of Racism?
272 Answers
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Much has been said and reported about the Chelsea fans behaviour in France, mainly due to the Video obtained by the Guardian.
Well apart from the ridiculous chant from a football crowd, and many of us have become accustomed to these over the years, was it enough for calls for the perpetrators to answer to be banned and face the law?
As far as I could see from the video, the black man was walking along the platform, until he got to the open door of the carriage containing the football crowd.
Now what was said, perhaps we will never know, but instead of the black man trying to board the train was he actually trying to confront these football supporters in an aggressive way, and if he was isn't it obvious that they would try and push him away.
Yes we all know that the crowd were suppose to be shouting "We’re racist, we’re racist, and that’s the way we like it". (because the Guardian has told us that), but in the true football crowd tradition was this just to get back at their opponent.
I am in no way condoning an act of racism if that is what it was, but before you condemn me look at the video again.
Much has been said and reported about the Chelsea fans behaviour in France, mainly due to the Video obtained by the Guardian.
Well apart from the ridiculous chant from a football crowd, and many of us have become accustomed to these over the years, was it enough for calls for the perpetrators to answer to be banned and face the law?
As far as I could see from the video, the black man was walking along the platform, until he got to the open door of the carriage containing the football crowd.
Now what was said, perhaps we will never know, but instead of the black man trying to board the train was he actually trying to confront these football supporters in an aggressive way, and if he was isn't it obvious that they would try and push him away.
Yes we all know that the crowd were suppose to be shouting "We’re racist, we’re racist, and that’s the way we like it". (because the Guardian has told us that), but in the true football crowd tradition was this just to get back at their opponent.
I am in no way condoning an act of racism if that is what it was, but before you condemn me look at the video again.
Answers
If one of this gang had punched someone and put them in hospital would had there been as much uproar? No, I dont think their would. Name calling is now a more serious offence than any violent attack it seems.
16:07 Thu 19th Feb 2015
// I am in no way condoning an act of racism if that is what it was, but before you condemn me look at the video again. // But you are AOG that is exactly what you are doing. It is very clear that the black person was trying to board the train & was prevented from doing so by yobbish English so called supporters of football, a pastime which is a game where people kick a ball about but which has now it would seem has become yet another religion.
Those people who caused the incident in Paris must be caught & named & in my opinion suffer the full consequences of the law for letting us The British down. THIS IS NOT THE WAY WE BEHAVE.
Those people who caused the incident in Paris must be caught & named & in my opinion suffer the full consequences of the law for letting us The British down. THIS IS NOT THE WAY WE BEHAVE.
AOG "Baldric
/// The audio is clear, you don't need subtitles! ///
Then why did they go to the trouble to print them."
Because plenty of viewers are deaf or hard of hearing, or maybe watching in a pub with a lot of noise. I also clearly heard their chants.
" ... just for interest did anyone catch what the black man said?"
No, but it probably wasn't anything like what the white men were saying, I think we can safely assume that much.
/// The audio is clear, you don't need subtitles! ///
Then why did they go to the trouble to print them."
Because plenty of viewers are deaf or hard of hearing, or maybe watching in a pub with a lot of noise. I also clearly heard their chants.
" ... just for interest did anyone catch what the black man said?"
No, but it probably wasn't anything like what the white men were saying, I think we can safely assume that much.
// I have looked at it yet again and fail to see where he has turned his back //
Blind as well as deaf. On 27 seconds he boards and turns to face the platform anticipating the doors closing before he is pushed off again.
Maybe I am also blind. In all the edits of this film I cannot see an empty carriage, can anyone else?
Blind as well as deaf. On 27 seconds he boards and turns to face the platform anticipating the doors closing before he is pushed off again.
Maybe I am also blind. In all the edits of this film I cannot see an empty carriage, can anyone else?
AOG
I've read your original question a couple of times now, and I am...
...astonished.
Before I answer, can you confirm whether you are playing devil's advocate, or whether you honestly stand by the points you've raised.
I ask partly because this is one of those rare occasions where every single responder (so far) has concurred with each other.
I've read your original question a couple of times now, and I am...
...astonished.
Before I answer, can you confirm whether you are playing devil's advocate, or whether you honestly stand by the points you've raised.
I ask partly because this is one of those rare occasions where every single responder (so far) has concurred with each other.
andy-hughes
/// AOG - I know you love to play Devil's Advocate, but even you are on seriously thin ice with this one. ///
Yes I admit that here I am playing Devil's Advocate, I just wanted to put a different perspective on the matter hence my last paragraph, but not only that, I thought I would wake you all up, judging by the slow response on the news section today, and it has certainly achieved that.
/// Why on earth would one man of any colour confront a gang of football supporters, aggressively or otherwise? And if he did, you appear to think that being pushed off the train was merely getting what he deserved for being so confrontational. ///
Well for starters this man appears to have done just that, because from the video how can anyone say that he actually just wanted to gain entry to the carriage so as to continue on his travels?
Also you are supposing what I think when you put "you appear to think that being pushed off the train was merely getting what he deserved for being so confrontational", no one deserves to be pushed off a train or anything else for that matter, it is just a fact of life that in an argument there can be a lot of 'pushing and shoving' involved.
/// As someone who virtually makes a profession out of condemning the behaviour of those who are guests in our country, could you not apply a little consistency, and condemn the English visitors assaulting a French citizen? ///
You have to spoil yet another perfectly reasonable argument by resorting to cheap jibes "As someone who virtually makes a profession out of ....." indeed?
I make no excusers for such behaviour abroad or at home, just making a perfectly reasonable argument as I have said before.
/// AOG - I know you love to play Devil's Advocate, but even you are on seriously thin ice with this one. ///
Yes I admit that here I am playing Devil's Advocate, I just wanted to put a different perspective on the matter hence my last paragraph, but not only that, I thought I would wake you all up, judging by the slow response on the news section today, and it has certainly achieved that.
/// Why on earth would one man of any colour confront a gang of football supporters, aggressively or otherwise? And if he did, you appear to think that being pushed off the train was merely getting what he deserved for being so confrontational. ///
Well for starters this man appears to have done just that, because from the video how can anyone say that he actually just wanted to gain entry to the carriage so as to continue on his travels?
Also you are supposing what I think when you put "you appear to think that being pushed off the train was merely getting what he deserved for being so confrontational", no one deserves to be pushed off a train or anything else for that matter, it is just a fact of life that in an argument there can be a lot of 'pushing and shoving' involved.
/// As someone who virtually makes a profession out of condemning the behaviour of those who are guests in our country, could you not apply a little consistency, and condemn the English visitors assaulting a French citizen? ///
You have to spoil yet another perfectly reasonable argument by resorting to cheap jibes "As someone who virtually makes a profession out of ....." indeed?
I make no excusers for such behaviour abroad or at home, just making a perfectly reasonable argument as I have said before.
AOG
You wrote:
"but instead of the black man trying to board the train was he actually trying to confront these football supporters in an aggressive way, and if he was isn't it obvious that they would try and push him away."
No...he was trying to board the train. He looked to be on his way to work judging by the way he was dressed (and this is confirmed in later reports).
You wrote:
"but instead of the black man trying to board the train was he actually trying to confront these football supporters in an aggressive way, and if he was isn't it obvious that they would try and push him away."
No...he was trying to board the train. He looked to be on his way to work judging by the way he was dressed (and this is confirmed in later reports).
The reason I don't believ he was being aggressive is because you can quite clearly see that at one point when he tries to board, he turns his back to the mob, but this isn't good enough for them, as they push him off again.
Also, why did you write:
"Yes we all know that the crowd were suppose to be shouting "We’re racist, we’re racist, and that’s the way we like it". (because the Guardian has told us that)"
It's patently obvious what is being chanted.
Can't you hear it???
Also, why did you write:
"Yes we all know that the crowd were suppose to be shouting "We’re racist, we’re racist, and that’s the way we like it". (because the Guardian has told us that)"
It's patently obvious what is being chanted.
Can't you hear it???
andy-hughes
/// What in earth is a 'bravado racist chant'? ///
I would have thought that a so called educated person you would ghave had no difficulty in interpreting that Andy?
Well let me enlighten you, When in a crowd one can sometimes, chant certain feelings that one would not do alone.
i.e. A false show of courage in a crowd.
/// What in earth is a 'bravado racist chant'? ///
I would have thought that a so called educated person you would ghave had no difficulty in interpreting that Andy?
Well let me enlighten you, When in a crowd one can sometimes, chant certain feelings that one would not do alone.
i.e. A false show of courage in a crowd.
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