Crosswords2 mins ago
Witnessed A Ladies Death Today :(
48 Answers
Hi everyone, today has been a sad day!
I was in my local council offices today, a lady sat near my husband and was waving at my baby, and he was waving back.
Next thing, she appears to have some sort of fit, making snoring type noises and collapses.
The council staff all got up and were staring saying to each other what do we do? Should I call an ambulance, but 2 members of the public were trying to help her, lay her down but no council staff did!
The lady then stopped breathing, a first wider happened to walk in and found the lady had no pulse and started CPR, the ambulance took a good 8 minutes if not more.
They were working on her for quite a while bless her.
I thought public places were supposed to have Dfibs, so that emergency heart shocking can be given in the time frame that it needs to be for a better outcome for the person.
I don't kno if it would have made a difference to this lady but I kno shopping malls and supermarkets have them.
They put up screens and his her and the staff doing CPR as best as could be, was just so sad! She was playing with my son then the next second she died!
I was in my local council offices today, a lady sat near my husband and was waving at my baby, and he was waving back.
Next thing, she appears to have some sort of fit, making snoring type noises and collapses.
The council staff all got up and were staring saying to each other what do we do? Should I call an ambulance, but 2 members of the public were trying to help her, lay her down but no council staff did!
The lady then stopped breathing, a first wider happened to walk in and found the lady had no pulse and started CPR, the ambulance took a good 8 minutes if not more.
They were working on her for quite a while bless her.
I thought public places were supposed to have Dfibs, so that emergency heart shocking can be given in the time frame that it needs to be for a better outcome for the person.
I don't kno if it would have made a difference to this lady but I kno shopping malls and supermarkets have them.
They put up screens and his her and the staff doing CPR as best as could be, was just so sad! She was playing with my son then the next second she died!
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Terrible thing to happen. Same thing happened to me just before Christmas. My neighbour came round very distressed, his partner was on the sofa unable to wake up, we called an ambulance but he was already dead. he had been out driving that morning, he was sat with Christmas cards in his hand ready to write, he just died there and then with no warning. Very sad but I hope I go that way.
thats awful sheribee, i hope your little one didnt 'undertsand' something was wrong, and yes what a lovely thing for her to have as her last actions, rather than just a stuffy council office.
and yes i think the card with the story in is a nice idea, maybe even a little photo of your baby.
it will be nice for the family because if she was in a council office they may assume she was there under some stressful circumstances, dealing with a problem etc and was likely feeling a bit miserable or upset, so knowing that literally her last actions was playing with a baby and laughing would be a comfort, but its also nice for you...will make you feel a wee bit better i would think.
i am sure the council will be able to pass it on.
this 'standing around not knowing what to do' is one of the reasons why i think they should introduce first aid into schools - primary and secondary - and do it every so often as a refresher - they often have short modules of things in schools and i am sure they coudl make room for a few sessions of it over the course of a year.
it saddens me to think just how many lives are lost every day because people dont know what to do and just freeze in fear and embarrassment.
if it was taught from an early age it would become 'inbuilt', second nature, and people would find it easier to do - and not so 'weird'.
they would be confident they could do it right and therefore not embarrassed or shy etc
i have had a few experiences where people have just stood around, unsure what to do ... sadly on two occasions i did exactly the same thing - i was a lot younger and it was before i did a first aid course, but still - everyone just expected "someone who KNOWS what to do will step in, in a minute".
and yes i think the card with the story in is a nice idea, maybe even a little photo of your baby.
it will be nice for the family because if she was in a council office they may assume she was there under some stressful circumstances, dealing with a problem etc and was likely feeling a bit miserable or upset, so knowing that literally her last actions was playing with a baby and laughing would be a comfort, but its also nice for you...will make you feel a wee bit better i would think.
i am sure the council will be able to pass it on.
this 'standing around not knowing what to do' is one of the reasons why i think they should introduce first aid into schools - primary and secondary - and do it every so often as a refresher - they often have short modules of things in schools and i am sure they coudl make room for a few sessions of it over the course of a year.
it saddens me to think just how many lives are lost every day because people dont know what to do and just freeze in fear and embarrassment.
if it was taught from an early age it would become 'inbuilt', second nature, and people would find it easier to do - and not so 'weird'.
they would be confident they could do it right and therefore not embarrassed or shy etc
i have had a few experiences where people have just stood around, unsure what to do ... sadly on two occasions i did exactly the same thing - i was a lot younger and it was before i did a first aid course, but still - everyone just expected "someone who KNOWS what to do will step in, in a minute".
sheribee, my son-in-law is a manager of a leisure centre and is fully trained to use de-fibrulators.
On one occasion he rescued a man, also a heart attack victim, from the pool and was able to revive him only for him to die later in hospital.
He has also given a man CPR, (before the de-fibrulator was installed) and the man survived.
So one never knows if even the most advance treatment would, or would not have saved this poor lady's life.
You will probably keep beating yourself up about this incident but the important thing is, we are all human and no-one knows how they will react in certain circumstances until they happen.
As has already been said on here, the lady went doing something not every person has the opportunity to do at the time of their death and that is making other human beings happy, because I'm sure it was not just your baby who was enjoying the moment. You and your husband were obviously enjoying it too.
The fact that you are able to possibly bring some comfort to the grieving family now by carrying out your suggestion is, I'm sure, a brilliant idea. If you are unable to contact them by any other means maybe a short letter to your local paper inviting the family to fuller details as you have already written them here, should they so desire, may do the trick.
God bless you for your caring heart and I hope and pray it all works out for you.
On one occasion he rescued a man, also a heart attack victim, from the pool and was able to revive him only for him to die later in hospital.
He has also given a man CPR, (before the de-fibrulator was installed) and the man survived.
So one never knows if even the most advance treatment would, or would not have saved this poor lady's life.
You will probably keep beating yourself up about this incident but the important thing is, we are all human and no-one knows how they will react in certain circumstances until they happen.
As has already been said on here, the lady went doing something not every person has the opportunity to do at the time of their death and that is making other human beings happy, because I'm sure it was not just your baby who was enjoying the moment. You and your husband were obviously enjoying it too.
The fact that you are able to possibly bring some comfort to the grieving family now by carrying out your suggestion is, I'm sure, a brilliant idea. If you are unable to contact them by any other means maybe a short letter to your local paper inviting the family to fuller details as you have already written them here, should they so desire, may do the trick.
God bless you for your caring heart and I hope and pray it all works out for you.
Just read about your experience sheribee. When this kind of thing happens in front of your eyes it takes a long time to get it out of your head, it's as though the 'remote' is stuck on 'replay'.
I have just done a first aid course and hope I never have to use it for anything more than a nose bleed.
I would definitely try to find out who she was and write a note to the family, it will make you feel a bit better x
I have just done a first aid course and hope I never have to use it for anything more than a nose bleed.
I would definitely try to find out who she was and write a note to the family, it will make you feel a bit better x
sheribee....yes quite an upsetting experience and i doubt if the outcome could have been any different.
sqad's advice.......if you are going to have a survivable heart attack then have it when you are young and in the presence of trained personnel who know how to use a defibrillator.
I am not happy about defibrillators spread throughout the buildings of the UK with the number of "gung ho!" amateur doctors around, as i feel that we may kill more people than we would save.
A defibrillator CANNOT restart a heart that has stopped.....there must be a pulse. which means that there is an electrical response still present in the heart, in which case defibrillation is effective.
Just a few thoughts on the matter......
sqad's advice.......if you are going to have a survivable heart attack then have it when you are young and in the presence of trained personnel who know how to use a defibrillator.
I am not happy about defibrillators spread throughout the buildings of the UK with the number of "gung ho!" amateur doctors around, as i feel that we may kill more people than we would save.
A defibrillator CANNOT restart a heart that has stopped.....there must be a pulse. which means that there is an electrical response still present in the heart, in which case defibrillation is effective.
Just a few thoughts on the matter......
It is somewhat complicated depending on exactly what sort of "heart attack" she had .
The AEDs available now (defribrillators) are very good and can make a big difference in survival if someone has a sudden cardiac arrest as opposed to a heart attack
http://
Different figures are bandied about but 14% survival without defribrillation compared to 36% survival with was seen in one Japanese study.
http://
We have one wher I work and I'm trained to use it (but you don't really need a lot of training they self-diagnose and won't shock unless they detect a heart that needs shocking) but their availability in the UK is patchy and we really need more and more people to push for them to be available
The AEDs available now (defribrillators) are very good and can make a big difference in survival if someone has a sudden cardiac arrest as opposed to a heart attack
http://
Different figures are bandied about but 14% survival without defribrillation compared to 36% survival with was seen in one Japanese study.
http://
We have one wher I work and I'm trained to use it (but you don't really need a lot of training they self-diagnose and won't shock unless they detect a heart that needs shocking) but their availability in the UK is patchy and we really need more and more people to push for them to be available
Sqad, I find your answer odd.
You say defibrillators may kill more people than they save. However, as Jake points out, modern ones diagnose the patient and will not deliver a shock if unnecessary.
You also say "A defibrillator CANNOT restart a heart that has stopped.....there must be a pulse". Are you sure of that?
Surely the very point of a defib is to restart a heart that has stopped?
You say defibrillators may kill more people than they save. However, as Jake points out, modern ones diagnose the patient and will not deliver a shock if unnecessary.
You also say "A defibrillator CANNOT restart a heart that has stopped.....there must be a pulse". Are you sure of that?
Surely the very point of a defib is to restart a heart that has stopped?
This extract is from googling Wikipedia ................
As devices that can quickly produce dramatic improvements in patient health, defibrillators are often depicted in movies, television, video games and other fictional media. Their function, however, is often exaggerated, with the defibrillator inducing a sudden, violent jerk or convulsion by the patient; in reality, although the muscles may contract, such dramatic patient presentation is rare. Similarly, medical providers are often depicted defibrillating patients with a "flat-line" ECG rhythm (also known as asystole); this is not done in real life as the heart is not restarted by the defibrillator itself. Only the cardiac arrest rhythms ventricular fibrillation and pulseless ventricular tachycardia are normally defibrillated. This is because the whole point of the exercise is to shock the patient INTO asystole[citation needed] and then let their heart start back beating normally. Someone who is already in asystole cannot be helped by electrical means, and usually needs urgent CPR and intravenous medication. There are also several heart rhythms that can be "shocked" when the patient is not in cardiac arrest, such as supraventricular tachycardia and ventricular tachycardia that produces a pulse; this more-complicated procedure is known as cardioversion, not defibrillation.
As devices that can quickly produce dramatic improvements in patient health, defibrillators are often depicted in movies, television, video games and other fictional media. Their function, however, is often exaggerated, with the defibrillator inducing a sudden, violent jerk or convulsion by the patient; in reality, although the muscles may contract, such dramatic patient presentation is rare. Similarly, medical providers are often depicted defibrillating patients with a "flat-line" ECG rhythm (also known as asystole); this is not done in real life as the heart is not restarted by the defibrillator itself. Only the cardiac arrest rhythms ventricular fibrillation and pulseless ventricular tachycardia are normally defibrillated. This is because the whole point of the exercise is to shock the patient INTO asystole[citation needed] and then let their heart start back beating normally. Someone who is already in asystole cannot be helped by electrical means, and usually needs urgent CPR and intravenous medication. There are also several heart rhythms that can be "shocked" when the patient is not in cardiac arrest, such as supraventricular tachycardia and ventricular tachycardia that produces a pulse; this more-complicated procedure is known as cardioversion, not defibrillation.
Hoppy
\\\You say defibrillators may kill more people than they save. However, as Jake points out, modern ones diagnose the patient and will not deliver a shock if unnecessary.\\\
Jake is correct.
\\\You also say "A defibrillator CANNOT restart a heart that has stopped.....there must be a pulse". Are you sure of that? \\\
Yes
\\\Surely the very point of a defib is to restart a heart that has stopped?\\
No.
Read Ann's post which explains it better than I could (I don't mean that ;-)
\\\You say defibrillators may kill more people than they save. However, as Jake points out, modern ones diagnose the patient and will not deliver a shock if unnecessary.\\\
Jake is correct.
\\\You also say "A defibrillator CANNOT restart a heart that has stopped.....there must be a pulse". Are you sure of that? \\\
Yes
\\\Surely the very point of a defib is to restart a heart that has stopped?\\
No.
Read Ann's post which explains it better than I could (I don't mean that ;-)
Took a while to fall asleep last night then had a terrible dream that my friends baby died and we went to see him in the mortuary, he was in a pram and blue and cold.
Quite worried about sleeping tonight now!
Still can't stop thinking I wish I'd done something, rather than letting others do it. I worked in care for years, did numerous 1st aid refreshers, but my last one was about 7 yrs ago, I just felt that I probably knew less than others, but I keep replaying what I could have done!
Quite worried about sleeping tonight now!
Still can't stop thinking I wish I'd done something, rather than letting others do it. I worked in care for years, did numerous 1st aid refreshers, but my last one was about 7 yrs ago, I just felt that I probably knew less than others, but I keep replaying what I could have done!
-- answer removed --
Awww sheribee, take care. Its only natural that you should have these thoughts in your mind and in your sleep. Its the shock coming out.
Give yourself time and try to relax as much as you can. Whenever you relive what you think you could have done, maybe try to divert your thoughts to your baby and him waving and smiling at the lady.
Things will get better for you in a few days. Sleep well.
Give yourself time and try to relax as much as you can. Whenever you relive what you think you could have done, maybe try to divert your thoughts to your baby and him waving and smiling at the lady.
Things will get better for you in a few days. Sleep well.
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