When Atheism becomes inhumane

[naomi24]

I spent a couple of hours today with a very dignified elderly gentleman who told me practically his life history. Brought up in an orphanage, adopted, and subsequently dreadfully mistreated, he left home at 15 to make his own way in the world. He survived a broken marriage, married again, and is now settled, very respectable, and reliant upon his faith to sustain him psychologically. He is aware of my complete and utter disdain for organised religion, but I have to say I was gentle with him because how can I, as someone who cares desperately about the plight of humanity, justify demolishing with reasoned and demonstrably provable argument this man's very personal shelter from the harshness of reality? Fellow atheists - please - tell me.

[jaydah]

So long as the next person does not impose their will on me they can pass freely & safely. That's my diktat !

[hc4361]

You may care desperately about the plight of humanity but you care nothing for, nor respect, other peoples strongly held beliefs and views.
Smug, arrogant, pompous, zealous.
I would no more welcome you spouting off in my home than Jehovah's Witnesses.

[jd_1984]

^^^Ouch

[starone]

I'm quite fond of quotations, maybe because I am not clever enough to think of any of my own, so this is from a man I used to work for:

"A man convinced against his will, Is of the same opinion still"

[Nadis]

In a way, you answered your own question.
The gentleman would no more want you to dispel his belief than an atheist would like to be told their is a god.
I'm sure if the gentleman wants to know more about your thoughts on the subject to clarify anything then he will ask you.
Don't know if that will persuade him to become atheist though.

[naomi24]

Society, how kind, thank you - and the same to you and yours. Much love. x

jaydah, and it's a good one - only if you think about it, it isn't how things are.

hc4361, you're absolutely right. I don't respect other people's strongly held beliefs and views just as you don't respect mine. Having said that, calling me names does not constitute rational argument. You see, if you'd have given me a good reason for your clear support of the right of the religious to blow innocent people to smithereens, or to allow babies to be born infected with horrendous diseases, I might have been able to compromise, but as it is I can't because, unlike you, I find these crimes against humanity impossible to justify.

jd, no problem. Where there's no rational argument, there can be no injury. ;o)

Starbuck, that's exactly why I don't do politically correct. You can legislate to stop a man saying what you don't want to hear - but you can never stop him thinking it.

ummmm, you were right. :o)

[starone]

hc4, strong, but true.

[society]

"You may care desperately about the plight of humanity but you care nothing for, nor respect, other peoples strongly held beliefs and views.
Smug, arrogant, pompous, zealous.
I would no more welcome you spouting off in my home than Jehovah's Witnesses. "

Hc4361, awwww aren't you doing the same by calling Naomi names? :-)

[naomi24]

Starbuck, you surprise me. So you support the right of the religious to do as they please too regardless of the effect on the rest of the world? I thought you had more sense than that.

[naomi24]

Nadis, I have no intention of persuading him to become an atheist.

[Nadis]

But your question hints at wanting to dispel his beliefs.

[starone]

naomi perhaps we need people with strong beliefs like you have to lead us should we ever need them. It is not only religion that kills look also to the politicians. I have been a pacifist ever since the second world war, which was horrendous, and have often wondered why we all do what the politicians tell us, like a lot of sheep. I have also wondered why if religious leaders are so powerful (e.g. the pope) they do not tell their followers to lay down their arms and refuse to fight. In the case of Christianity surely the basic principle is peace to all men. What happened to the preachings of Jesus, who was a peaceful and gentle man (I do not believe that he was the son of god but his thoughts on life were excellent). Naomi, you should join a political party and make your thoughts apparent where they might do some good.

[Nadis]

Or you wish to prove to him that that his belief is not all it's cracked up to be to alter his comfort zone within his faith.

[Nadis]

No you cannot forcibly persuade him because he has a mind of his own so why ask the question?
What do you really want from other atheists to tell you to tell an old man that what he wants to believe is mostly made up.
What for?

[naomi24]

Nadis, hopefully I've clarified the intention of this question now.

Starbuck, the historical Jesus (if he existed - and I think he did) has very little to do with Christianity and I agree with you entirely on most of what you've said - although I'm not about to enter the crooked world of politics. ;o)

[Nadis]

Yes it's perfectly clear Naomi. Can you answer your own question?

[starone]

But that's just what you should do, naomi. Your honesty could be like a breath of fresh air in the crooked world of politics and as I said, I think you will find this is where the problem lies.

[naomi24]

Nadis, It's perfectly clear that I answered my own question at the time of the discussion, but I would actually like to know what other atheists would have done in the same situation.

[naomi24]

Starbuck, I've always suffered from square peg syndrome. :o)

[Nadis]

Oh I see Naomi, so you don't want to change the gentleman's belief or tell him what he should or shouldn't have faith in?
So you don't have to justify anything if your not going to do anything.