Gunning for God

[naomi24]

I’m currently reading ‘Gunning for God’, by John C Lennox, Professor of Mathematics at Oxford, Fellow in Mathematics and the Philosophy of Science, and Pastoral Advisor at Green Templeton College, Oxford. It started quite promisingly, I thought, but quickly descended into the usual assault on the works of Richard Dawkins, Sam Harris, Christopher Hitchens, et al. I’m about a third of the way through it now, and although the author is vigorous in his condemnation of atheism (often irrationally so), he has yet to explain his reasons for defending religion – and frankly, with works of this genre, this complete failure to address the fundamental issues is becoming rather tedious. I’m hoping the next two thirds will offer something a little more interesting, but in the meantime can anyone recommend a book that doesn’t depend upon atheist-bashing and that actually offers a good case for religion? And if anyone suggests the Bible, the Koran, or the Book of Mormon – wotchit! ;o)

[jake-the-peg]

It seems to me that the Koran's relationship to science is rather like Nostradamus' relationship to history!

[jomifl]

Jake, very succinctly put. :-)

[keyplus90]

Jomifl - This question is not about what Quran says about science. But as you asked then Life on other planets comes to mind.

[naomi24]

Ladybirder, thanks very much for that. I’ll have a look at it. I saw a few moments of the programme where someone was saying that religion offers people choice. Couldn’t help thinking that without religion people have rather more choice.

Jom, Keyplus has told us that all future scientific discoveries are to be found in the Koran. How he knows that, I have no idea. However, when science comes up with something new you can bet your boots that some Islamic ‘scholar’ will examine the text to find the astounding ‘evidence’ and post it on an Islamic website. Of course, the ‘scholar’ will go by a bit of a roundabout route to illustrate his findings – they always do - and you'll never find it on any reputable scientific website - but mark my words - the evidence will be there - and Keyplus will believe it. Funny how no one outside Islam ever lauds these amazing discoveries. You’d think they’d take the world of science by storm and make global headlines. ;o)

[naomi24]

Keyplus, you brought science into this discussion – no one else - and I’ve told you many times that Mohammed was not the first by far to mention the possibility of life on other planets. He was way behind the times.

[keyplus90]

Who is talking about Muhammad (pbuh)? Message was given to so many messengers before him. However if I take your argument then what science has found so far that was not already known then?

[naomi24]

Keyplus, //Who is talking about Muhammad//

I’m talking about Mohammed – the author of the Koran. The only messages he received were from the people he had dealings with.

//However if I take your argument then what science has found so far that was not already known then?//

If information was previously in the public arena, science acknowledges that.

[jomifl]

Keyplus, Naomi beat me to it by mentioning that it was you that brought science into this thread.
I appear to have paid you an unjustifiable compliment by suggesting that you might understand my question. Speculation (such as the existence of life on another planet) is not a scientific discovery, since a non scientist could do that. A scientific discovery is some fundamental theorical concept that changes our understanding of the universe or some part of it. Anyone can speculate even mohammed, he did not have any evidence for life on other planets did he (since he did not know about planets) any more than he had evidence for the existence of god. You will have to do better than that.

[birdie1971]

↑ “... You will have to do better than that...”

That'll be the day!

[keyplus90]

I knew what would be the response. And I am not amazed.

[jomifl]

Have you thought of taking up fortune telling Keyplus? You are running mohammed a close second, perhaps.

[naomi24]

Keyplus, you take off on a subject, and end up with a whimper. I sometimes wonder why you bother.

[Reg1900]

If you are genuinely interested in finding out more an Alpha course may be your best option. It is available in book form..to find out more information copy and paste this link into your browser: http://uk-england.alpha.org/

[naomi24]

Thanks Reg. One of our friends, the local vicar, is involved in running these courses - but I doubt she'd want me to go along. ;o)

[keyplus90]

/////One of our friends, the local vicar, is involved in running these courses - but I doubt she'd want me to go along. ;o)////

I wonder why?

[tamborine]

I dont think Mother Theresa wrote a book but her work proved her love of God, to the benefit of todays generation.

[tamborine]

Error - Mother Theresa did write :

http://www.time.com/t...,9171,1655720,00.html

[naomi24]

Keyplus, no need to wonder. I’m happy to answer questions, so you only need to ask. It’s because on the subject of religion, I disagree with her.

Tamborine, Mother Teresa wasn’t all you might believe.

[mibn2cweus]

‘Gunning for God’ ? ? ?

Tempting . . . but

Given the inevitability of missing a target that doesn't exist what other alternative does one have but to turn guns and take aim at those who point out the consequences of spreading the rumour as the religulous have always done throughout the ages.

God is impenetrable with bullets by virtue of existing only as an idea and ideas are only vulnerable to the light of reason. It is only when reason has proven to be the enemy that one turns to the only alternative persuasive means which the gun (which actually does exist) embodies.

Faith and Force - The Destroyers of the Modern World . . .
http://freedomkeys.com/faithandforce.htm

[RATTER15]

Tambo, Mother Theresa also convinced millions of people that condoms aided the spread of aids, through her words she probably contributed to the death of hundreds of thousands of innocent men women and children.

Thats religious morals for you!!!