Listener 4184: Claim by Raich

[starwalker]

Having struggled to get started, I found the claim with less than half of the grid filled. Now I am struggling again with the final few answers. Lots of fun though.
Dammit ! There goes the Z cup again for this week.

[jim360]

I also managed last week's but found that one a nightmare (but with a cute endgame) so am glad that this one was much easier!

[aldanna]

I an stuck on a very few squares in the top left corner (obviously an error to turn down offered help from my grandsons, 7 & 9) but found most of the grid a quick fill. I have the claim but no idea what it means, so some way to go yet.

[Alekhine]

Gentle as the Easter Bunny.

Now for the serious business this weekend ... Oldham away.

Come on, you Reds.

[jim360]

Well if that's the case aldanna then google is your friend :) . Very tricky if you don't recognise the claim or when it was made...

[aldanna]

Easy when you know! After-lunch pdm and ... thanks for the tip, Jim, but I didn't even need Google. Mind you, I go back a good bit further than you do.

[qwerty99]

Another indifferent Listener after a couple of better ones, but an interesting theme, and the letters of the "claim" looked like gobbledegook until I suddenly saw the light. I have to agree wth Trux; it was a shameful day and I remember it well. I remember exactly where I was working and what I was doing as the results of the contest came through

[tenflags]

With the claim and mostly done just checked in to see that i'm not the only one who's fiddling with a couple of bits in NW corner... time for dinner and watch the golf methinks.

[borealis]

Zabadak’s comment of Times level clues is interesting. I found these more Times style - more intuitive and perhaps looser than usual for the Linstener. On checking back I find nothing imprecise, but I’d be intrigued to hear other’s views.

Did anyone feel that the protagonists were originally intended by the setter to be elsewhere?
Four letters are in the right places for this.

[cluelessJoe]

Very symmetrically observant of you borealis - I wondered the same, and it would have been a more satisfying conclusion had Raich persevered along that line.

[tenflags]

that did the trick... now some traditional DIY before tonights finale. Looks like the British boys might have blown it though.

[jim360]

Would be lovely if you are right borealis, finally caught your drift. Maybe if so a fascinating insight into the trials of setting a Listener?

[Stavrolex]

Hmm, can't say I found that any easier than last week's, which I found a bit dull having worked out the theme fairly early on. Both done & dusted in a couple of hours, which suits me just fine given all the other chores waiting to be done. Just goes to show how much is down to personal preference. I thought the clues were fine and can't see anything remotely wrong with 39d. Not a theme of which I cared to be reminded but I won't hold that against Raich, to whom many thanks for a fun challenge.

[the_heisman]

I liked the final twist a lot and was very far away from the theme having utterly convinced myself of two successive red herrings. I'm a little surprised at the reaction of some to the outcome of the contest given the alternative.

[bobbycollins]

That was fun, but still no stinkers this year

[Philoctetes]

Using this as a starting point, can I ask about names? Pre-2011, there was what one could regard as a definitive list, but this has gone. Does this mean that there are no holds barred in the use of alternative spellings? Could "Chelsee" make an appearance? Would Nikh be tolerated?

[the_heisman]

I agree Bobby Collins - although based on my performance in last year's stats (35 correct out of 43 submitted) I have no need of stinkers to come unstuck.

[Cruncher]

Nice twist in the tail. Wondered why the top corner seemed so tricky. Nicely put together. Thanks for the recommendation on the Magpie, Walterloo. Took one look at that puzzle and put it away again

[Ruthrobin]

Philoctetes, I am only extrapolating from what we have seen this year, but it looks as though first names that were in the 2008 list can still be used (like Ian or Esme, say), and any proper nouns that are basic culture, like Madrid, but you might have trouble if you submitted one full of Nikhs, Oudadougous, Ushuaias or Baikonurs.

[silversolver]

I am a latecomer this week and found this one a bit trickier than others, by the sound of it. Not helped by having no access to the internet so had to rely on the old-fashioned method of thumbing through the big red book. However, it all fell into place in the end and was indeed an enjoyable puzzle. I suspect that "stinker" will turn up one of these weeks...

[Whenland]

Still struggling here. Just over half the clues solved and only 6 letters of the claim. Mrs Whenland has found an "interesting" hidden name, however. Don't know why it's so difficult as we managed last week's one okay and thoroughly enjoyed it - yet all other posters seem to have found 4184 a doddle. Haven't completed the Azed either - a single entry resisting all solving attempts. Must have a mistake somewhere, I suppose. Ho hum ...