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This Is What Some Have Waited To Hear, It Is The Muslim Council Of Britain Who Have The The Problem.
22 Answers
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Mr Cameron said: "Anyone, frankly, reading this letter, who has a problem with it, I think really has a problem. I think it is the most reasonable, sensible, moderate letter that Eric could possibly have written.
Mr Cameron said: "Anyone, frankly, reading this letter, who has a problem with it, I think really has a problem. I think it is the most reasonable, sensible, moderate letter that Eric could possibly have written.
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The letter is actually quite godd.
But the Government should not be telling Muslims what they must do. They are well aware of their young people leaving and dying. I am sure they are not happy about the situation any more than we are. But the young are not being radicalise at mosques they are watching stuff on the internet, and in contact with people already there via twitter. The Government are asking the Muslim Council to do something which is largely beyond their power. That embarrasses them.
Of course, if anyone wrote to the Government telling them what they must do, they would instantly comply.
But the Government should not be telling Muslims what they must do. They are well aware of their young people leaving and dying. I am sure they are not happy about the situation any more than we are. But the young are not being radicalise at mosques they are watching stuff on the internet, and in contact with people already there via twitter. The Government are asking the Muslim Council to do something which is largely beyond their power. That embarrasses them.
Of course, if anyone wrote to the Government telling them what they must do, they would instantly comply.
And the Government should be doing more. This letter is to deflect from their own woeful record .
The route these young jihadists take to Syria is well known.
Turkey require a VISA to travel there, which must be purchased in advanced. It should be easy to check those VISA's for young British Asians, and stop them travelling in the first place. A very easy measure to impliment, but we don't.
The route these young jihadists take to Syria is well known.
Turkey require a VISA to travel there, which must be purchased in advanced. It should be easy to check those VISA's for young British Asians, and stop them travelling in the first place. A very easy measure to impliment, but we don't.
I can well imagine Eric Pickles having plenty of input into the letter.
Gromit, travelling to Turkey isn't in itself a crime, so it's hard to see how the Government can just stop people from travelling there, especially if it's specifically "young British Asians" that are stopped from doing so. That's going to fail so badly at every level of justice...
Gromit, travelling to Turkey isn't in itself a crime, so it's hard to see how the Government can just stop people from travelling there, especially if it's specifically "young British Asians" that are stopped from doing so. That's going to fail so badly at every level of justice...
Gromit
/// But the Government should not be telling Muslims what they must do. ///
They live in Britain don't they, the rest of us are always being told what to do by the Government, why should Muslims be treated any different?
/// But the young are not being radicalise at mosques. ///
And how would you know that Gromit, are you a regular visitor to these Mosques?
And have you forgotten Finsbury Park mosque, why is it unreasonable to believe that there aren't any others.
/// But the Government should not be telling Muslims what they must do. ///
They live in Britain don't they, the rest of us are always being told what to do by the Government, why should Muslims be treated any different?
/// But the young are not being radicalise at mosques. ///
And how would you know that Gromit, are you a regular visitor to these Mosques?
And have you forgotten Finsbury Park mosque, why is it unreasonable to believe that there aren't any others.
Turkey require a VISA to travel there, which must be purchased in advanced. It should be easy to check those VISA's for young British Asians, and stop them travelling in the first place.
I thought you were against the government telling people what to do?
From your statememt above it sounds like you think all young Muslims going to Turkey should be treat has criminals.
I thought you were against the government telling people what to do?
From your statememt above it sounds like you think all young Muslims going to Turkey should be treat has criminals.
Talbot
// I thought you were against the government telling people what to do? //
I am, but special cases can be made for people planning to go and fight for our enemy.
// From your statememt above it sounds like you think all young Muslims going to Turkey should be treat has criminals. //
No, not be treated as criminals, but looked at more closely. We have a profile of people who go to Syria to fight, they are between 16-25, Muslim, male (smetimes female) and is flying to Istanbul. If a traveller fits that profile, then further enquiries should be made. Not arrested or criminalised, but asked about their end destination, proof of accommodation in Turkey etc.
// I thought you were against the government telling people what to do? //
I am, but special cases can be made for people planning to go and fight for our enemy.
// From your statememt above it sounds like you think all young Muslims going to Turkey should be treat has criminals. //
No, not be treated as criminals, but looked at more closely. We have a profile of people who go to Syria to fight, they are between 16-25, Muslim, male (smetimes female) and is flying to Istanbul. If a traveller fits that profile, then further enquiries should be made. Not arrested or criminalised, but asked about their end destination, proof of accommodation in Turkey etc.
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bazwillrun
" If a traveller fits that profile, then further enquiries should be made. Not arrested or criminalised, but asked about their end destination, proof of accommodation in Turkey etc. "
yeah, lets give them all the time and chances available to get away and off the radar of the security services.... //
It would be better than what happens to them now - Nothing.
And one would hope that if they are on the radar of the security services already, travelling to Istanbul would be highly suspicious. And worthy of being pulled at the UK airport.
bazwillrun
" If a traveller fits that profile, then further enquiries should be made. Not arrested or criminalised, but asked about their end destination, proof of accommodation in Turkey etc. "
yeah, lets give them all the time and chances available to get away and off the radar of the security services.... //
It would be better than what happens to them now - Nothing.
And one would hope that if they are on the radar of the security services already, travelling to Istanbul would be highly suspicious. And worthy of being pulled at the UK airport.
Gromit, //But the young are not being radicalise at mosques they are watching stuff on the internet, and in contact with people already there via twitter.//
Nonsense! The internet most certainly plays a big part, but young people are being radicalised in mosques, and schools, and colleges, and universities.
This is a letter from a Muslim published in the London Evening Standard last night:
//As a British Muslim I feel increasingly let down. High profile Muslim spokespeople have, rather than explain the truth - that Charlie Hebdo ridicules one and all - painted it as spreading anti-Muslim hate. After any atrocity, Muslim voices propagate the idea of valid grievance: for instance that the West holds Muslim lives cheap, without mentioning that the biggest killers of Muslims are Muslims.
Speakers from organisations portrayed as mainstream are invited to mosques and universities and preach that in an "ideal state" apostates should be killed, homosexuality is filthy etc. That the Government should be concerned and is applying scrutiny through Ofsted and the Charity Commission is again condemned as an "Islamophobic witch-hunt".
It's time the media stopped chasing voices deemed "authentic", who help feed the victim narrative, and give space to British Muslims challenging the problems we have from within.//
Nonsense! The internet most certainly plays a big part, but young people are being radicalised in mosques, and schools, and colleges, and universities.
This is a letter from a Muslim published in the London Evening Standard last night:
//As a British Muslim I feel increasingly let down. High profile Muslim spokespeople have, rather than explain the truth - that Charlie Hebdo ridicules one and all - painted it as spreading anti-Muslim hate. After any atrocity, Muslim voices propagate the idea of valid grievance: for instance that the West holds Muslim lives cheap, without mentioning that the biggest killers of Muslims are Muslims.
Speakers from organisations portrayed as mainstream are invited to mosques and universities and preach that in an "ideal state" apostates should be killed, homosexuality is filthy etc. That the Government should be concerned and is applying scrutiny through Ofsted and the Charity Commission is again condemned as an "Islamophobic witch-hunt".
It's time the media stopped chasing voices deemed "authentic", who help feed the victim narrative, and give space to British Muslims challenging the problems we have from within.//
Naomi,
Muslim parents in this Daily Telegraph article, blame 'Sheikh Google.
http://
Muslim parents in this Daily Telegraph article, blame 'Sheikh Google.
http://
Gromit, the letter wasn’t anonymous – I didn’t post the author’s name - but we could go on all day posting tit for tat links. Here’s one:
http://
Use your common sense. Of course they’re going to say the mosque plays no part in radicalisation. What else would you expect? Good old google!!!
http://
Use your common sense. Of course they’re going to say the mosque plays no part in radicalisation. What else would you expect? Good old google!!!
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