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The Labour Party - After The Election...
There seems to be a theory on twitter - the worse (seat wise) the Labour Party do the easier it will be to get rid of Corbin (yes I can spell it but choose not to). Could anyone explain it to me please? It was discussed by amongst others dan hodges
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Jim, //It could say that they care more about ideals…//
It could be – in which case we have to ask “Whose ideals?”. Certainly not those of the majority of the electorate, which brings me back to the disdain in which they hold the Labour faithful – and the rest of us. What an arrogant bunch they are!
It could be – in which case we have to ask “Whose ideals?”. Certainly not those of the majority of the electorate, which brings me back to the disdain in which they hold the Labour faithful – and the rest of us. What an arrogant bunch they are!
You are right cassa, Corbyn would not win an election were he to stand again. For reasons I explained in a post in another thread. People like Len McCluskey have already said they would not support him.
The problem with labour's manifesto is that although it is full of "things" it is bereft of ideas. It's just Ban this, Introduce that, pay for this, pay for that etc etc. I would love to see a lot of the things in it, and I am sure many people who are not going to vote labour would also, but history teaches us that only a modern forward looking labour party wins elections, and this is anything but. And when Labour doesn't win, guess who wins....
The problem with labour's manifesto is that although it is full of "things" it is bereft of ideas. It's just Ban this, Introduce that, pay for this, pay for that etc etc. I would love to see a lot of the things in it, and I am sure many people who are not going to vote labour would also, but history teaches us that only a modern forward looking labour party wins elections, and this is anything but. And when Labour doesn't win, guess who wins....
It's hardly wrong or arrogant to believe in your ideals and want to share them with others. The fault comes when you don't engage with others -- and it's obvious that some people simply don't want to. That doesn't invalidate the ideals that the left hold -- except, perhaps, the one about working together that clearly means "only with people who wholeheartedly agree with you".
It was only a week ago that I saw one example of this, I'm sure you can find others if you look hard enough. Some advert by Heineken that featured two people with opposite views coming together and being offered to choose to talk about them. You know the sort of thing: some radical feminist meets a "man's man"; a transwoman meets a guy who thinks that there are only two genders. The ad itself is a publicity stunt but, for myself, I thought it offered the right message, ie about addressing differences rather than avoiding them.
Unfortunately, a number of people who are clearly on the left would disagree. Dare say you can find right-wingers who wouldn't give my views the time of day if I had to try and say them rather than write them; but anyway, it was disheartening to read a message about reaching out dismissed as " have fun reasoning with fascists."
Sigh...
But anyway. I suspect on AB I'm preaching mostly to the converted.
It was only a week ago that I saw one example of this, I'm sure you can find others if you look hard enough. Some advert by Heineken that featured two people with opposite views coming together and being offered to choose to talk about them. You know the sort of thing: some radical feminist meets a "man's man"; a transwoman meets a guy who thinks that there are only two genders. The ad itself is a publicity stunt but, for myself, I thought it offered the right message, ie about addressing differences rather than avoiding them.
Unfortunately, a number of people who are clearly on the left would disagree. Dare say you can find right-wingers who wouldn't give my views the time of day if I had to try and say them rather than write them; but anyway, it was disheartening to read a message about reaching out dismissed as " have fun reasoning with fascists."
Sigh...
But anyway. I suspect on AB I'm preaching mostly to the converted.
https:/
Here is a link to the twitter conversation
Here is a link to the twitter conversation
You get the sense he's actually enjoying himself, basking in the adoration of his acolytes and fiddling while the Labour party burns.
They look destined to become like the Greens. Essentially a large pressure group with no realistic chance of forming a government.
I think Corbyn would be happy with that.
They look destined to become like the Greens. Essentially a large pressure group with no realistic chance of forming a government.
I think Corbyn would be happy with that.
TTT.....We can argue about that ( 14:09 ) till the cows come home, but here is something you can't question.....the Tories lost, big time in 1997, and then again in 2001, and 2005 !
And the overriding reason that they lost 3 times in a row, is that they had 3 daft, consecutive Leaders, who were unelectable.
Remind you of anyone ?
And the overriding reason that they lost 3 times in a row, is that they had 3 daft, consecutive Leaders, who were unelectable.
Remind you of anyone ?
Hoppy....both Labour and the Tories have had their time in the spotlight in the past, and both have been unelectable at times as well.
Mrs May reminds me of that line in Julius Caesar....
" There is a tide in the affairs of men, which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune"
The Tories will cock things up eventually, as they always have done in the past, and Labour will be there to pick up the pieces when they do.
Mrs May reminds me of that line in Julius Caesar....
" There is a tide in the affairs of men, which, taken at the flood, leads on to fortune"
The Tories will cock things up eventually, as they always have done in the past, and Labour will be there to pick up the pieces when they do.
Jim, //It's hardly wrong or arrogant to believe in your ideals and want to share them with others.//
Not wrong, just plain stupid – and that’s arrogant. The electorate has made it abundantly clear that Labour ‘ideals’ are not what it wants. Nevertheless, Labour’s motley band continues to bang its thoroughly knackered drum without even considering that only their dyed-in-the-wool faithful, who remain, politically, entrenched in a by-gone age, still find the rhythm in the least bit pleasing. The rest of us recognise that tastes, expectations, and aspirations have changed - and we've left them behind - floundering.
Not wrong, just plain stupid – and that’s arrogant. The electorate has made it abundantly clear that Labour ‘ideals’ are not what it wants. Nevertheless, Labour’s motley band continues to bang its thoroughly knackered drum without even considering that only their dyed-in-the-wool faithful, who remain, politically, entrenched in a by-gone age, still find the rhythm in the least bit pleasing. The rest of us recognise that tastes, expectations, and aspirations have changed - and we've left them behind - floundering.
I agree with Balders - the Labour Party keels over and begins to die on the vine, arise the Democrat Party as a potential Phoenix, fuelled by 100+MPs or ex MPs (leader Benn or Starmer, possibly Ben Bradshaw).....and hopefully, they hold on to some as a 150+ majority for Theresa May's mother of all tanks party is not healthy for democracy, 100 is bad enough.
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