Cameron's Prison Reforms

[agchristie]

What do you think?

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2016/feb/08/cameron-give-more-power-governors-prisons-shakeup

[douglas9401]

He's a one that Dave isn't he? Handing power (future blame) to governors while setting himself up as the reformer. If it all blows up in our faces or fizzles out due to a lack of interest then it's a failure for the jails, not him.
Any success though can still be grabbed with both hands by the smirking article.

[agchristie]

Don't worry Douglas, Mr Cameron's full potential has yet to be harnessed. :(

[sandyRoe]

Is there any evidence that a regime which feather-beds inmates is more efficacious in reforming them than the harsher treatment(hard labour, the cat, treadmills, etc.) Which was the norm in Victorian times?

[jomifl]

It is about time the prison reforms were reformed. Perhaps governing the govenors will be a step....errr forward?

[sandyRoe]

I should have added, if there isn't then it would do the Tories no harm to go back to a stricter system.

[andy-hughes]

I think that this is an area where stereotyping and narrow thinking are easy options, and I applaud the government for trying to find different ways to address the issues involved.

I completely fail to see the purpose of 'league tables' for prisons, but then I have always been baffled by the Tories' love of this measuring system, mainly because it is meaningless.

If one prison 'scores higher' than another, what does that mean? Is everyone going to request a move to the 'better' prison, or, more worryingly, are staff at the 'scores lower' prison simply going to be demoralised?

A merit system only works if there is a real reason for measuring one against another - whatever the object being measured - and in the case of prisons, schools, police forces, hospitals, it is meaningless, offers a 'solution' where none exists, panders to the 'free market' ideology that is a cornerstone of Tory thinking, and ends up being mean and divisive, with no real benefit to anyone except those paid to keep score.

[douglas9401]

In summary then, it's a good idea but a bad idea.

Thank you.

[CrapAtCryptics]

Prisons are for punishment and cant compete with the constant influx of modern information and attitudes. To remove the worst elements of our poulation from society for the protection of that society is still a valid reason. Rehabilitation has been constantly undermined by every government by cost and staff cutting to the extent now where staff are leaving in droves. With shorter sentences predominant the minute criminals leave prison any rehabiliation work is lost and they return to their usual lifestyle.

[Haggisdj]

I like the part about league tables. Do you think career-criminal familes will move so they are in the catchment area of a better prison?

[sevenOP]

I find it difficult to determine whether you act as Devil's Advocate on many threads sandyRoe, but on this thread if you are serious then the effects of social evolution seems to have bypassed you; as for the evidence you asked about, I could find little hard evidence, a common problem in history:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/history/british/victorians/crime_01.shtml

I think waiting for the details to be revealed is a good idea.

We had this Ministry of Justice Review in November 2015:
https://www.gov.uk/government/news/ministry-of-justices-settlement-at-the-spending-review-2015

I hope the details will include making the prisons tobacco free, and drug free, and inmate mobile phone free, and slopping out free.

[youngmafbog]

Reform them to proper prisons. Outsource to Turkey or Thailand where they know how to run a jail.

And yet we get more hot air from him on knife crime. This man is an arrogant toff who needs to get out.

I wonder how many of these' satellite' tag people will be straight to a 'ooman rights lawyer?

[youngmafbog]

Listening to him speak. What a load of waffle and not answering any questions.

[whiskeryron]

Let us for goodness sake be honest. We live in a so called civilised society, criminals by their very nature are UNcivilisnsed & therefore should be separated from the rest of society. The French had the right idea when they ran Devil's Island, a remote island far from their civilised society. I think we should concentrate more along those lines rather than snuggle up to the do gooders who want to make life more comfortable for prison inmates.

[mikey4444]

I'm not sure if this is a party-political issue. dave is the PM and he is perfectly entitled to bring this subject up if he thinks fit.

The most important measure of how a penal system works is the reoffending rate. At present its pretty dreadful, so its right and proper that we look at this and see what can be done to improve it.

I was listening to the Today Program early this morning, and they were discussing women having babies in prison. It was mentioned that one woman had just had a baby inside, and she herself had been born inside 30-odd years before !

It would seem to me that there is a great deal of improvement to be made in this issue !

[modeller]

Why is he bringing this up now . Could it be to stop us discussing the EU ?
His proposals for a reformed EU are very weak and he's gagged his anti-EU ministers . He wants to bring forward the referendum before the anti brigade can marshal their facts. I bet he will suddenly announce a date.

With regards to prison reforms I remember one of my students who spent a few weeks 'inside' said " Before he went in he was frightened of prison but afterwards he said he was not bothered any more , " It was a doddle !" .

[david small]

Build more prisons. Anonymous employee prison officers so they cannot be intimidated by felons. Toughen up the regime, more regimental. A sentence issued to be served in full. No smoking, no drugs, legal or otherwise. Work mandatory.

[mikey4444]

If what is happening now is "gagging" his anti-EU Ministers, I'd like to see what it would be like if he really tried !

[sandyRoe]

SevenOP, I had in mind the Tory attitude towards young offenders during Thatcher's early years in office when I first answered. They looked to the 19th Century for a catchy title for their proposed treatment of young people who found themselves in the maw of the penal system, 'a short, sharp shock'.
I think I remember watching Tory backwoodsmen, and women, baying for blood as the details were revealed during a televised session of their party conference.

[agchristie]

Short, sharp, shock - was that Willie Whitelaw who used that phrase?

[sandyRoe]

I think it was, yes.