Crosswords1 min ago
Does Anyone Think That By Visiting Stately Homes, It Will Make Our Immigrants Feel More British?
55 Answers
http://
/// Mr Parker told The Telegraph: "We all of us need to have a sense of how did we arrive at where we are today. ///
I think most of us know.
/// "[This is] ever more important because you have people in this country from so many backgrounds and they need to be tied together by something. It is a sense of being an inhabitant of these islands.” ///
/// Mr Parker told The Telegraph: "We all of us need to have a sense of how did we arrive at where we are today. ///
I think most of us know.
/// "[This is] ever more important because you have people in this country from so many backgrounds and they need to be tied together by something. It is a sense of being an inhabitant of these islands.” ///
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Svejk
I don't know what you're talking about.
Do the non-White Britons you know endlessly carp on about how awful the indigenous population of the UK are, or are you basing your position on what the media presents to you?
But leaving that detour aside for the moment, is it not arguable, that individual fully assimilated non-whites won't ever be considered English simply because of their skin colour?
A white person with Polish, Australian, American, Russian etc forebears will be considered English, simply because they 'look' English - ie. white...
I don't know what you're talking about.
Do the non-White Britons you know endlessly carp on about how awful the indigenous population of the UK are, or are you basing your position on what the media presents to you?
But leaving that detour aside for the moment, is it not arguable, that individual fully assimilated non-whites won't ever be considered English simply because of their skin colour?
A white person with Polish, Australian, American, Russian etc forebears will be considered English, simply because they 'look' English - ie. white...
Svejk
That's odd.
It's certainly not how I see myself, and neither do people who know me. Perhaps you have that impression because I have strong views and am not afraid to air them, but you are mistaken if you think I have any sort of antipathy for white Britons.
Only some white Britons.
It's the same with AOG. Just because he posts multiple questions giving him the opportunity to criticise black people (and Muslims and gays etc), doesn't mean he hates all black peoples, Muslims and gays...just some of them.
Anyway, enough about me, is it not arguable, that individual fully assimilated non-whites won't ever be considered English simply because of their skin colour?
A white person with Polish, Australian, American, Russian etc forebears will be considered English, simply because they 'look' English - ie. white...
That's odd.
It's certainly not how I see myself, and neither do people who know me. Perhaps you have that impression because I have strong views and am not afraid to air them, but you are mistaken if you think I have any sort of antipathy for white Britons.
Only some white Britons.
It's the same with AOG. Just because he posts multiple questions giving him the opportunity to criticise black people (and Muslims and gays etc), doesn't mean he hates all black peoples, Muslims and gays...just some of them.
Anyway, enough about me, is it not arguable, that individual fully assimilated non-whites won't ever be considered English simply because of their skin colour?
A white person with Polish, Australian, American, Russian etc forebears will be considered English, simply because they 'look' English - ie. white...
I’m only talking about one thing, sp, and that is the attitude and behaviour of immigrants and their descendants in the UK. Where they were born is immaterial (as far as my argument is concerned anyway) because I maintain those the attitudes and behaviours are present among a sizeable number wherever they were born. Additionally my argument has nothing to do with colour (though it has to be said that the majority of people which are the subject of my argument are non-white). It is equally true of some Europeans – particularly those from places such as Romania and Bulgaria.
I do accept that the dilution of newcomers’ “foreignness” is a harder and longer process for non-white people than it can be for whites. The difficulty is that, like it or not, one’s appearance has a considerable influence on how others perceive a person. That is something that non-white people have to contend with in Europe and a problem that white people have to deal with in Africa. In an ideal world it would not exist, but it does. It probably stems from the time when only white people could be found in Europe, only brown people could be found in Asia and only black people could be found in Africa. Many people think of “European” as white and “African” as black.
But this question has little to do with that. It’s all to do with people’s attitudes and behaviours. It is no use people coming to the UK and frowning on the culture of the people already here. It is no use them living in isolation and not trying to adopt the lifestyles and cultures of the nation in which they live. “Britishness” does not consist of visiting stately homes or walking on the Fells. Many British people – as British as they come – do neither of those things. Among many other thing, being British means simply adopting the behaviour and cultures of those around you and not castigating them if they behave fundamentally differently to you. Most importantly trying to develop an apartheid system which will accommodate cultures which are clearly alien to most people here will only cause division. That is where many people fall down and telling them to visit Tatton Hall will not overcome that.
I do accept that the dilution of newcomers’ “foreignness” is a harder and longer process for non-white people than it can be for whites. The difficulty is that, like it or not, one’s appearance has a considerable influence on how others perceive a person. That is something that non-white people have to contend with in Europe and a problem that white people have to deal with in Africa. In an ideal world it would not exist, but it does. It probably stems from the time when only white people could be found in Europe, only brown people could be found in Asia and only black people could be found in Africa. Many people think of “European” as white and “African” as black.
But this question has little to do with that. It’s all to do with people’s attitudes and behaviours. It is no use people coming to the UK and frowning on the culture of the people already here. It is no use them living in isolation and not trying to adopt the lifestyles and cultures of the nation in which they live. “Britishness” does not consist of visiting stately homes or walking on the Fells. Many British people – as British as they come – do neither of those things. Among many other thing, being British means simply adopting the behaviour and cultures of those around you and not castigating them if they behave fundamentally differently to you. Most importantly trying to develop an apartheid system which will accommodate cultures which are clearly alien to most people here will only cause division. That is where many people fall down and telling them to visit Tatton Hall will not overcome that.
What I mean by personal experience, is that I grew up in London's second most racially diverse boroughs, and your experience of how second and third generation 'immigrants' is completely off-base.
It's simply untrue to say that many of the people my age and younger are not assimilated.
You may believe this, but I don't think you're right.
It's simply untrue to say that many of the people my age and younger are not assimilated.
You may believe this, but I don't think you're right.
SP, I might be wrong but I think your parents came here from the West Indies. Be honest now… do you have one leg firmly planted in West Indian culture, because if you do you can hardly claim to feel wholly British. It seems to me that in your constant defence of everything ‘foreign’ to the indigenous Brit, your ‘roots’ are very much a part of who you are.
naomi24
No - I am not connected to the West Indies.
I have not met any of my family from Jamaica and my sister and nephews are exactly the same.
This is surprisingly common amongst second and especially third generations.
When you write: "It seems to me that in your constant defence of everything ‘foreign’ to the indigenous Brit"
That's because I'm am the only black person on the AB News section, and it's useful to be able to provide an alternative and personal point of view, especially when some people post questions specifically to criticise immigrants in general and black people in particular.
It would be dishonest and strange for me to hold my tongue, when others are allowed to put their opposing points across.
No - I am not connected to the West Indies.
I have not met any of my family from Jamaica and my sister and nephews are exactly the same.
This is surprisingly common amongst second and especially third generations.
When you write: "It seems to me that in your constant defence of everything ‘foreign’ to the indigenous Brit"
That's because I'm am the only black person on the AB News section, and it's useful to be able to provide an alternative and personal point of view, especially when some people post questions specifically to criticise immigrants in general and black people in particular.
It would be dishonest and strange for me to hold my tongue, when others are allowed to put their opposing points across.
This type of thing is not new it would seem, a £1m project to encourage ethnic minorities to visit the UK's national parks was launched in 2005.
And it seems that guided walks mainly for the white middle class visitors are to be scrapped to help fund this scheme.
/// The authority proposed scrapping popular guided walks - said to be used mainly by white, middle-class visitors - to help fund the new schemes. ///
http://
/// Last year Trevor Phillips, chairman of the UK's race watchdog said the absence of minorities from the countryside was a form of "passive apartheid".///
/// Ethnic minorities make up 8% of the UK population but figures show in 2002/3 they represented just 1% of visitors the countryside. ///
Don't our ethnic minorities realise that there is vast countryside outside their towns and cities, and one only has to get in their cars or get on a bus or train to see it?
And it seems that guided walks mainly for the white middle class visitors are to be scrapped to help fund this scheme.
/// The authority proposed scrapping popular guided walks - said to be used mainly by white, middle-class visitors - to help fund the new schemes. ///
http://
/// Last year Trevor Phillips, chairman of the UK's race watchdog said the absence of minorities from the countryside was a form of "passive apartheid".///
/// Ethnic minorities make up 8% of the UK population but figures show in 2002/3 they represented just 1% of visitors the countryside. ///
Don't our ethnic minorities realise that there is vast countryside outside their towns and cities, and one only has to get in their cars or get on a bus or train to see it?
AOG
There are also government-sponsored schemes to get the elderly onto the Internet through NIACE's and Digital Unite.
I think that's a laudable initiative, but you could also argue that seeing as the Internet is freely available to anyone who cares to go to a library, why should the elderly (another minority) have specific funding?
There are also government-sponsored schemes to get the elderly onto the Internet through NIACE's and Digital Unite.
I think that's a laudable initiative, but you could also argue that seeing as the Internet is freely available to anyone who cares to go to a library, why should the elderly (another minority) have specific funding?
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