Bedroom Tax

[pdq1]

Shortly to be introduced in April where spare bedrooms are heavily taxed.
Many couples sleep in separate bedrooms but because they are married they are classed as sleeping together. Gay relationships may also run into a problem.

Is this a well thought out policy or an excellent way of getting families to downsize?

[sherrardk]

AYG - I read the link and it focuses on those people who will be disadvantaged by the 'bedroom tax'c I would like to know how many people are living in houses with more bedrooms than they need (need, not want) and how many families are living in B & B's because there is no housing available for them. I agree that there needs to be more social housing available but I also think that people in social housing shouldn't expect or get larger houses than they need (need not want).

[joko]

i read somewhere that a man who had his 3 kids for half the week was told they couldnt have bedroom and they could sleep on the couch instead...

also people who work away for a few months at a time - such as the army, ol rigs, etc, are supposed to allow their room to be used for a lodger! - what happens to the lodger when the person returns is not clear ...

but it just shows how they havent really thought it through properly

i do agree though that a couple in a large house with 3 empty rooms needs to downsize.
just because you have lived somwhere a long time doesnt mean you should be entitled to deprive others of a large enough home.

council houses are exactly that - council owned to be used to home those that need them ... current owners do not own them so cannot claim them.

[sir.prize]

But Cameron thinks it is better to give millions of aid to African countries.

Remember Dozy Dave, we are all in this together.

[jackthehat]

I am sure that my adult son (in the Army) would be happy to help me pay for his room, to ensure that he had somewhere to stay whilst on leave........

[askyourgran]

I can see that side of it and I agree with you sherrard, there must be a lot of single people who are rattling around in a 3 bed house, maybe old and confused now that their spouse has died, but haven't a clue how to go about moving somewhere else on their own. In cases the Council should act (sympathetically) and rehouse them, if there is a house for them to go to. I don't think the tenants realise nowadays that the house isn't theirs by rights (only by rents). At one time your house was your home until you died, unless you defaulted payment. It will be a great shame if private landlords did the same. Just tell that to Abu Qatada, he got one for him his wife and five children straight away after leaving jail. What I am saying is that they should consider each case on it's merits. The people in that link are to be hard hit by this. Btw I don't think a council tenant would be able to re-assign a room as an office or playroom etc to escape the tax.

[bednobs]

surely carpets belong to the house? Why would you want to move carpets anyway - it's very unlikely they'd be the same size rooms

[askyourgran]

No, carpets belong to the tenant as do curtains lightshades, etc. Some tenants (on benefits) cannot afford to buy new stuff if they are being moved about, they'll make do and mend.

[cassa333]

With any 'new' system of doing things there will be winner and losers and the begining is where the wrinkles get ironed out.

I do not believe that subsidised social houseing should be for life. It should be for need. If you need three bedrooms AND they are available you get a three bedroom. If you need two bedrooms AND they are available you get three bedrooms.


Once that need has gone ie: family has left home OR you are able to afford market rents etc you no longer need/deserve that sized home or social houseing. Ergo you move to a smaller place or you find the size you want and pay the extra.

If you want your grown up children to visit, if you want a room for visitors pay the market rate or go and get a private rental and let someone who needs it have use of it.

If you have a carer that is needed to live with you then that room is being used and would be declared so don't see the argument that they would have nowhere to stay.

[puddle-duck]

I can see both sides of the argument. I believe that pensioners are exempt from this charge.

The problem is that for many there is nowhere for them to downsize to. Local authorities have very few available one bedroomed properties, so a lot of single tenants are going to find themselves between a rock and a hard place.

[Shazza36]

People who rent and do not claim Housing Benefit will not be affected and people can not keep expecting to get everything for nothing, there are less and less people paying tax etc because more people are out of work, the free ride has to stop somewhere. As a tax payer and with my bills going up and my income not increasing I can't be expected to keep supporting people who DON'T want to support themselves (not the one's who physically can't support themselves.

[bednobs]

well puddle duck perhaps we could use ayg's credo of why can't these people make an effort to find something for themselves, rather than expecting social housing

[EDDIE51]

desktop you have said that there is just you and Mr Desktop in a housing association house . This means you are only entitled to a 1 bedroom house if you claim any housing benefits. The only exception to this is for pension age residents who can stay as they are and still get full housing benefit.

[askyourgran]

We are surmising of course that there will be a suitable home to downsize to, not being forced out into a sink estate, leaving the home you have lovingly cared for for years to someone who doesn't give a monkeys. Pride in ones home will be eroded. This is creating a dilemma for people. What of the disabled person who does not immediately have a carer but will need one before too long. Only to find themselves without anywhere for them to stay if made to move out.
Those who are on assisted living benefits will not be able to afford to pay the extra rent, unless of course the council pays which is surely defeating the object of the exercise.
I do agree that a working family who has a family member working abroad, rigs, inside, etc. should be able to afford to pay for the extra room.

[pastafreak]

I watched a news report on this the other night,and some minutes were spent discussing the very real possibility that those who cannot pay the extra would then be evicted...creating another level of homelessness, and real problems for already over burdened local authorities.

[LoftyLottie]

Agree with Cassa entirely. I think the new system is necessary and correct. HOWEVER, there have to be exceptions to every rule and there have to be enough smaller social homes for people to move into. As for having spare rooms for adult children, grandchildren, etc when they visit, I think that is unnecessary. Visitors can sleep on sofa beds, etc. If adult children are still living at home then they should be contributing to the rent and therefore the 'bedroom' tax can be paid out of their contribution.

Social housing has exceeded the purpose is was meant for in the first place, as have benefits.

[LoftyLottie]

Ask your gran - elderly retired people are exempt from Bedroom Tax and won't be affected in any way.

[Ann]

What exactly is meant by "social housing?" - just council houses? What about housing association schemes where a tenant part-owns the house - does this apply to them too?

[bednobs]

i think though that the amount of disabled people who are on the precipice of needing a live in carer must be very very much lower than the amount of people who are getting housing benefit for houses larger than their family size. In fact, very few people (in my experience of social care) actually have live in carers. Firstly, family members often are not in a position to move in and care for a disabled relative, and if they are getting care provided by the council, it's cheaper for the council to accomodate them in a care home than live in carers (because if someone is so needy they need live in sleep in carers, you actually need 2 so that 1 can have a break, or so they can carry out the care safely)

[askyourgran]

Bednobs My credo was that there are young people who have a number of children and fully expect the council to house them instead of limiting their family or trying to sort themselves out. The people who are asked to move out of their council property to downsize should surely be given the same consideration of an alternative adequate council house, not thown to the mercy of private landlords, especially if on benefits, why should they.