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Fox Hunting & Cameron
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while foxes are over populating urban areas & farmland, I cant see a pack of hounds followed by 20+ mounted horses chasing one fox, to be an effective cull. Has the black spider been bending our PMs ear?
while foxes are over populating urban areas & farmland, I cant see a pack of hounds followed by 20+ mounted horses chasing one fox, to be an effective cull. Has the black spider been bending our PMs ear?
Answers
Over one hundred years ago, Oscar Wilde described fox hunting as the pursuit of the inedible by the unspeakable, and I see no reason to doubt that he was right. When fox hunting was finally banned years ago, the vote was not whipped...ie all Parties allowed their MPs a free vote. The Bill was supported overwhelmingly, by the Tories as well as Labour.
If dave expects that he can repeal the Act now, he must be stark raving bonkers. The people who want to bring back fox hunting, would also dearly love to bring back otter hunting......hunting a wild creature whose only sin is to want fish for its dinner, the same fish that men want to catch with a rod and line, not for dinner but for sport.
The same people would also dearly like to bring back hare coursing, a "sport" where live, wild hares are released into a field and two greyhounds are encouraged to chase after it and tear it apart.
Both right wingers and left wingers can unite on this issue....its time to stand up and be counted. Let you MP know that you abhor any attempt to bring back hunting wild creatures with dogs.
Its disgusting. Period.
If dave expects that he can repeal the Act now, he must be stark raving bonkers. The people who want to bring back fox hunting, would also dearly love to bring back otter hunting......hunting a wild creature whose only sin is to want fish for its dinner, the same fish that men want to catch with a rod and line, not for dinner but for sport.
The same people would also dearly like to bring back hare coursing, a "sport" where live, wild hares are released into a field and two greyhounds are encouraged to chase after it and tear it apart.
Both right wingers and left wingers can unite on this issue....its time to stand up and be counted. Let you MP know that you abhor any attempt to bring back hunting wild creatures with dogs.
Its disgusting. Period.
But does Dave want to bring it back? As I said, the link to the Countryside Magazine in the Independent is a dead page and the only relevant link that I could find on that website is dated 2012. Honestly I think to him and to most of the conservative party its a poisoned chalice. Pragmatically they have much more important things to deal with. I suspect that the majority of MP's of all the parties don't give a damn either way. The conservative party had to leave it in the manifesto or risk offending rich and influential supporters. they know damn well that it will cause trouble if it comes to public attention again. I am firmly on the anti hunting side of the argument but well.....I don't find the facts here convincing.
The fox hunting debate raises its head often on the AB, and the two sides line up to argue their points - which are sufficiently disparate to find little or no common ground.
As advised - foxes do not kill 'for fun' - a hen house full of dead chickens means the fox was disturbed before he could carry off and bury all his kills.
A henhouse full of dead chickens means a farmer has no built his henhouse properly - the fox will do what it must, the responsibility to protect the chickens lies with the farmer.
As to the notion of foxhunting - I would have more respect for the hunting fraternity if they had the courage of their convictions - if they admitted that they hunt for the fun of it, rather than trying to dignify what they do as some kind of countryside management, which it clearly is not because it is manifestly ineffective as a method of controlling foxes.
If - as they say - hunting is designed to keep the fox population down, they would have given it up years ago for the useless success rate that makes that reason redundant.
Hunters hunt because they enjoy the thrill of the chase. They argue that 'city people' do not understand 'country ways' - in that country people regard animals without the anthroporphisism that city people tend to do.
Animals are working tools - and can be loved as such - or they are stock for profit, but the difference in views is there, and apparent for all to see.
I think hunting is barbaric, it has no redeeming qualities whatever.
If people want to dress up and go for a vigorous ride in the country- good luck to them - just leave the wildlife out of it.
As advised - foxes do not kill 'for fun' - a hen house full of dead chickens means the fox was disturbed before he could carry off and bury all his kills.
A henhouse full of dead chickens means a farmer has no built his henhouse properly - the fox will do what it must, the responsibility to protect the chickens lies with the farmer.
As to the notion of foxhunting - I would have more respect for the hunting fraternity if they had the courage of their convictions - if they admitted that they hunt for the fun of it, rather than trying to dignify what they do as some kind of countryside management, which it clearly is not because it is manifestly ineffective as a method of controlling foxes.
If - as they say - hunting is designed to keep the fox population down, they would have given it up years ago for the useless success rate that makes that reason redundant.
Hunters hunt because they enjoy the thrill of the chase. They argue that 'city people' do not understand 'country ways' - in that country people regard animals without the anthroporphisism that city people tend to do.
Animals are working tools - and can be loved as such - or they are stock for profit, but the difference in views is there, and apparent for all to see.
I think hunting is barbaric, it has no redeeming qualities whatever.
If people want to dress up and go for a vigorous ride in the country- good luck to them - just leave the wildlife out of it.
It may be 'eloquently put' if that is your idea of eloquence however it contains several glaring inaccuracies:
//the responsibility to protect the chickens lies with the farmer.// - Which includes hunting foxes which prey on his chooks.
//As to the notion of foxhunting - I would have more respect for the hunting fraternity if they had the courage of their convictions - if they admitted that they hunt for the fun of it, rather than trying to dignify what they do as some kind of countryside management, which it clearly is not because it is manifestly ineffective as a method of controlling foxes.// - A traditional mounted foxhunt serves two purposes, it's principle purpose is to effectively hunt and despatch foxes, the secondary purpose is to provide the opportunity for a fun day out in the country for the followers who thereby fund the pest control function.
//useless success rate// - Hunt's aren't always successful but they are a large part of the time.
//Hunters hunt because they enjoy the thrill of the chase// - true, but incomplete: Hunters hunt because they enjoy the thrill of the chase and provide a valuable service the farming community.
//it has no redeeming qualities whatever// - Untrue, it kills foxes.
//the responsibility to protect the chickens lies with the farmer.// - Which includes hunting foxes which prey on his chooks.
//As to the notion of foxhunting - I would have more respect for the hunting fraternity if they had the courage of their convictions - if they admitted that they hunt for the fun of it, rather than trying to dignify what they do as some kind of countryside management, which it clearly is not because it is manifestly ineffective as a method of controlling foxes.// - A traditional mounted foxhunt serves two purposes, it's principle purpose is to effectively hunt and despatch foxes, the secondary purpose is to provide the opportunity for a fun day out in the country for the followers who thereby fund the pest control function.
//useless success rate// - Hunt's aren't always successful but they are a large part of the time.
//Hunters hunt because they enjoy the thrill of the chase// - true, but incomplete: Hunters hunt because they enjoy the thrill of the chase and provide a valuable service the farming community.
//it has no redeeming qualities whatever// - Untrue, it kills foxes.
shoota - //the responsibility to protect the chickens lies with the farmer.// - Which includes hunting foxes which prey on his chooks. //
If the farmer built his hen house properly, there would be no killing by foxes - and no need to hunt them for that reason.
//As to the notion of foxhunting - I would have more respect for the hunting fraternity if they had the courage of their convictions - if they admitted that they hunt for the fun of it, rather than trying to dignify what they do as some kind of countryside management, which it clearly is not because it is manifestly ineffective as a method of controlling foxes.// - A traditional mounted foxhunt serves two purposes, it's principle purpose is to effectively hunt and despatch foxes, the secondary purpose is to provide the opportunity for a fun day out in the country for the followers who thereby fund the pest control function. //
It's primary function fails then - you know as well as I do that the hunt fails more than it succeeds. And if chasing animals and tearing them apart represents a 'fun day out', then perhaps country people need to find other things to do 'for fun' that don't involve sadism.
//useless success rate// - Hunt's aren't always successful but they are a large part of the time.//
I would dispute that -
Fox Mortality In Britain
From Table 2 below you can see that people kill around 300,000 foxes each year in Britain, about equivalent to all the fox cubs born annually. Fox hunts kill about 20,000 foxes a year. Motorists, snare setters and shooters kill the great majority of foxes. Thus foxes suffer a high mortality rate and fox hunters are only one of their troubles.
Table 2. Rough numbers of foxes killed annually in Britain.
Figures are from a number of sources.
Adult population 200,000
Cub population 300,000
Causes of mortality:
Motorists 50,000 - 100,000
Snare setters 50,000 - 100,000
Shooters 50,000 - 100,000
Terriermen &
fox destruction clubs 20,000
Mounted hunts with hounds:
Adult foxes 10,000 - 12,000
Fox cubs 8,000 - 10,000
//Hunters hunt because they enjoy the thrill of the chase// - true, but incomplete: Hunters hunt because they enjoy the thrill of the chase and provide a valuable service the farming community.//
The above statistics demonstrate that hunting kills are about equal to the number of foxes born - i.e. it does nothing to eradicate the fox population.
//it has no redeeming qualities whatever// - Untrue, it kills foxes. //
That is what makes it true!
14:25 Thu 14th May 2015
If the farmer built his hen house properly, there would be no killing by foxes - and no need to hunt them for that reason.
//As to the notion of foxhunting - I would have more respect for the hunting fraternity if they had the courage of their convictions - if they admitted that they hunt for the fun of it, rather than trying to dignify what they do as some kind of countryside management, which it clearly is not because it is manifestly ineffective as a method of controlling foxes.// - A traditional mounted foxhunt serves two purposes, it's principle purpose is to effectively hunt and despatch foxes, the secondary purpose is to provide the opportunity for a fun day out in the country for the followers who thereby fund the pest control function. //
It's primary function fails then - you know as well as I do that the hunt fails more than it succeeds. And if chasing animals and tearing them apart represents a 'fun day out', then perhaps country people need to find other things to do 'for fun' that don't involve sadism.
//useless success rate// - Hunt's aren't always successful but they are a large part of the time.//
I would dispute that -
Fox Mortality In Britain
From Table 2 below you can see that people kill around 300,000 foxes each year in Britain, about equivalent to all the fox cubs born annually. Fox hunts kill about 20,000 foxes a year. Motorists, snare setters and shooters kill the great majority of foxes. Thus foxes suffer a high mortality rate and fox hunters are only one of their troubles.
Table 2. Rough numbers of foxes killed annually in Britain.
Figures are from a number of sources.
Adult population 200,000
Cub population 300,000
Causes of mortality:
Motorists 50,000 - 100,000
Snare setters 50,000 - 100,000
Shooters 50,000 - 100,000
Terriermen &
fox destruction clubs 20,000
Mounted hunts with hounds:
Adult foxes 10,000 - 12,000
Fox cubs 8,000 - 10,000
//Hunters hunt because they enjoy the thrill of the chase// - true, but incomplete: Hunters hunt because they enjoy the thrill of the chase and provide a valuable service the farming community.//
The above statistics demonstrate that hunting kills are about equal to the number of foxes born - i.e. it does nothing to eradicate the fox population.
//it has no redeeming qualities whatever// - Untrue, it kills foxes. //
That is what makes it true!
14:25 Thu 14th May 2015
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