Business & Finance40 mins ago
Breaking News: 2 More British Soldiers Killed In Afghanistan
...by a man in Afghan army uniform.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-17510491
How many more before 2014, when we hand all security issues back to the Afghans and watch all the work done so far undone within 12/18 months?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-17510491
How many more before 2014, when we hand all security issues back to the Afghans and watch all the work done so far undone within 12/18 months?
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alba - I am waiting to hear the government spin that puts any kind of gloss on the savage waste of money resources and lives that this entire debacle continues to consume.
No dount there will be lots of trupeting about 'getting the job done' and 'leaving Afghanistam in safe hands' and 'establishing democracy' all of which are lies damned by the obscenity of their cost.
Because no government will lose face by admitting that they have achieved nothing, and will not face up to their responsibilities in the deaths and destruction, we must limp through this tragedy for another year until we leave, having 'done no job' and 'established nothing.
The biggest tragedy of all will be the poor relatives and friends of dead soldiers who will try and believe that their loved ones did not die in vain, and then have to see the evidence that they did so, unfolding before them.
And where is the man who started this whole horrible pantomime .... er.... hang on .... it's coming ... George ..... no, it's gone.
No dount there will be lots of trupeting about 'getting the job done' and 'leaving Afghanistam in safe hands' and 'establishing democracy' all of which are lies damned by the obscenity of their cost.
Because no government will lose face by admitting that they have achieved nothing, and will not face up to their responsibilities in the deaths and destruction, we must limp through this tragedy for another year until we leave, having 'done no job' and 'established nothing.
The biggest tragedy of all will be the poor relatives and friends of dead soldiers who will try and believe that their loved ones did not die in vain, and then have to see the evidence that they did so, unfolding before them.
And where is the man who started this whole horrible pantomime .... er.... hang on .... it's coming ... George ..... no, it's gone.
No argument from me at all Andy. Thoroughly agree with you.
One thing which does make me wonder is when a relative of a killed 18/19 year old is interviewed, they always say 'he wanted to be a soldier from when he was 5' Different topic for discussion I'll concede.
I've mentioned before, why wait ? Get them out now. From what I've read/heard in the media the majority of the UK want them out, but what Government actually listens to the 'people' unless it's voting time.
One thing which does make me wonder is when a relative of a killed 18/19 year old is interviewed, they always say 'he wanted to be a soldier from when he was 5' Different topic for discussion I'll concede.
I've mentioned before, why wait ? Get them out now. From what I've read/heard in the media the majority of the UK want them out, but what Government actually listens to the 'people' unless it's voting time.
Hi alba - I understand we are on the same page here, and I am sure you take no pleasure from the unfolding failure disguised ans a 'victory' that is heading our way.
As far as soldiers are concerned, I adopt the stance that fighting and killing is what they sign up for, and train for, and that is their job, and they must regard death or injury as an occupational hazard - but that must be small comfort to their families and friends when they fail to come home.
It's the sheer bull-headed blindness of the whole thing that makes me weep. We are not a world power with world power military sources to indulge our passion for making others live as we do. These invasions (they are not 'wars') are created by politicians on both sides, and i seriously wonder if they do consider the wills of their respective peoples?
I said about ten years ago that Iraq was this generation's Viet Nam, and so it has proved to be. Pray god that America does not elect another Republican - because the finance that backed him will want payback in terms of arms sales and foreign intervention, and we have surely had enough of that.
As far as soldiers are concerned, I adopt the stance that fighting and killing is what they sign up for, and train for, and that is their job, and they must regard death or injury as an occupational hazard - but that must be small comfort to their families and friends when they fail to come home.
It's the sheer bull-headed blindness of the whole thing that makes me weep. We are not a world power with world power military sources to indulge our passion for making others live as we do. These invasions (they are not 'wars') are created by politicians on both sides, and i seriously wonder if they do consider the wills of their respective peoples?
I said about ten years ago that Iraq was this generation's Viet Nam, and so it has proved to be. Pray god that America does not elect another Republican - because the finance that backed him will want payback in terms of arms sales and foreign intervention, and we have surely had enough of that.
AOG recently wrote this
// No matter how many apologies and from whom, this murderous action will be embedded in each and ever Afghans minds for years to come, be them the Taliban or the ordinary Afghan people.
Since we have spent years and many service personnels lives trying to foster good relationships with the non-activist Afghans, all this 'good' work is now of no avail, due to this action. //
After the Robert Bales murders, an attack such the one today was inevitable. It is regrettable, but not worth ending the mission over.
// No matter how many apologies and from whom, this murderous action will be embedded in each and ever Afghans minds for years to come, be them the Taliban or the ordinary Afghan people.
Since we have spent years and many service personnels lives trying to foster good relationships with the non-activist Afghans, all this 'good' work is now of no avail, due to this action. //
After the Robert Bales murders, an attack such the one today was inevitable. It is regrettable, but not worth ending the mission over.
I also once wrote, seeing that none of our enemies in Afghanistan wear uniforms, there is no picking and choosing who our enemies are, therefore they should all be treated with the same caution, for this I was widely criticised, and accused of making an 'over generalisation'.
But it seems I was correct in my generalisation, in fact it now seems that we can't even trust those that wear a 'friendly'.
uniform.
If we must linger in Afghanistan until 2014, we should be doing everything in our power to protect the troops we have out there.
By that I mean an end to our 'velvet glove' approach, no more letting our troops go out fully exposed on pointless 'hearts and minds' patrols, so as to speak to the 'natives', let the Afghan troops go out, we should remain in our secure compounds.
But it seems I was correct in my generalisation, in fact it now seems that we can't even trust those that wear a 'friendly'.
uniform.
If we must linger in Afghanistan until 2014, we should be doing everything in our power to protect the troops we have out there.
By that I mean an end to our 'velvet glove' approach, no more letting our troops go out fully exposed on pointless 'hearts and minds' patrols, so as to speak to the 'natives', let the Afghan troops go out, we should remain in our secure compounds.
<<no more letting our troops go out fully exposed on pointless 'hearts and minds' patrols, so as to speak to the 'natives', let the Afghan troops go out, we should remain in our secure compounds. >>
No. That won't work.
Our troops aren't just 'popping out for a chat' - the patrols are continuously rubbing up against taliban, gradually edging them out of areas and frequently engage.
Sadly, the afghan troops are simply not up to it.
No. That won't work.
Our troops aren't just 'popping out for a chat' - the patrols are continuously rubbing up against taliban, gradually edging them out of areas and frequently engage.
Sadly, the afghan troops are simply not up to it.
Zeuhl - a fair point - and why would they be?
It's getting time for the Afghan soldiers to realise which side they are on - those nice British soldiers with their pretty uniforms, and brand new guns who have gone home, and aren't coming back, or the Taliban, who live here, and know where the Afghan soldiers live, and where their wives do their shopping, and their children go to school.
Not one of the toughest diecisions to make is it?
It's getting time for the Afghan soldiers to realise which side they are on - those nice British soldiers with their pretty uniforms, and brand new guns who have gone home, and aren't coming back, or the Taliban, who live here, and know where the Afghan soldiers live, and where their wives do their shopping, and their children go to school.
Not one of the toughest diecisions to make is it?
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