Quizzes & Puzzles0 min ago
3,500 girls are at risk of mutilation in the capital
The report by black and ethnic minority women's organisation Imkaan found that in the city 3,500 baby girls are born every year to mothers who have suffered female genital mutilation, and therefore are at risk themselves. This is an increase of 65 per cent in 10 years.
The Forced Marriage Unit dealt with 330 cases of women and girls at risk of forced marriage in London last year.
http://www.thisislond...ion-in-the-capital.do
This is happening in 21st century Britain. How do we stop it?
The Forced Marriage Unit dealt with 330 cases of women and girls at risk of forced marriage in London last year.
http://www.thisislond...ion-in-the-capital.do
This is happening in 21st century Britain. How do we stop it?
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I believe they do this to prevent the woman from enjoying sex so that they have no inclination to commit adultery and so stay in their husband's house. In view of the pleasure it gives I believe this to be absolutely monstrous and a great pity that there is not some equal punishment which could be given to the people who perpetrate this crime against humanity. I cannot imagine the sterile and pleasureless life these poor women are committed to - or I should say, I do not want to imagine it. As for allowing their children to have the same thing done to them, I cannot imagine that either, unless the male population is all powerful and the baby is taken from the mother with no way of obstructing the deed.
In a world where a woman's purity/chastity/fidelity is prized beyond everything else, religious exhortations to preserve these become corrupted; the instruction to 'dress modestly' sees women whipped and stoned for going unclad in a burkha and murdered for associating with men who might sully their chastity.
Gential Mutilation is a widespread practice carried out by, mainly, muslim societies, in the belief that it will reduce the female libido and prevent the woman from enjoying sex and therefore being less likely to stray from her husband.
Unfortunately, the very people most complicit in this barbarous acts are older women themselves. And they would rather be punished by a secular judiciary for having ensured a female child's religious purity than derelict their duty and compromise the child culturally.
Gential Mutilation is a widespread practice carried out by, mainly, muslim societies, in the belief that it will reduce the female libido and prevent the woman from enjoying sex and therefore being less likely to stray from her husband.
Unfortunately, the very people most complicit in this barbarous acts are older women themselves. And they would rather be punished by a secular judiciary for having ensured a female child's religious purity than derelict their duty and compromise the child culturally.
Monkeyfun, //does it say in any of the holy books of islam that female mutilation has to be done? //
In the Sunnah, Muhammad states that circumcision was a "law for men and a preservation of honour for women".
That doesn't mean that the majority of Muslims follow that advice - well at least not for women - but it is often used to justify female circumcision. The Koran itself says ' "Let there be no change in Allah's creation". (Qur'an 30:30) - but, despite the contents of that book being the 'unalterable' word of God (allegedly) that bit is ignored where Muslim men are concerned.
//This couldn't be just tabloid scaremongering could it//
No.
http://imkaan.org.uk/...ASE%20-%2025NOV11.pdf
And bear in mind this report only concerns London. In the notes to editors, the press release states:
The Imkaan report, The Missing Link, is a London study. However it is well known that there are many towns and cities in other parts of the UK where these forms of violence occur and need urgent attention.
I wonder just how many girls are subjected to these barbaric practices nationwide?
Daffy, I think the reference to Irish Travellers probably relates to enforced marriages and not to genital mutilation.
In the Sunnah, Muhammad states that circumcision was a "law for men and a preservation of honour for women".
That doesn't mean that the majority of Muslims follow that advice - well at least not for women - but it is often used to justify female circumcision. The Koran itself says ' "Let there be no change in Allah's creation". (Qur'an 30:30) - but, despite the contents of that book being the 'unalterable' word of God (allegedly) that bit is ignored where Muslim men are concerned.
//This couldn't be just tabloid scaremongering could it//
No.
http://imkaan.org.uk/...ASE%20-%2025NOV11.pdf
And bear in mind this report only concerns London. In the notes to editors, the press release states:
The Imkaan report, The Missing Link, is a London study. However it is well known that there are many towns and cities in other parts of the UK where these forms of violence occur and need urgent attention.
I wonder just how many girls are subjected to these barbaric practices nationwide?
Daffy, I think the reference to Irish Travellers probably relates to enforced marriages and not to genital mutilation.
We can speculate what should be done to stop it, but it will make no difference to the problem whatsoever, short of making it a criminal offence as NOX pointed out:
/// anyone found involved in this heinous crime needs a mantadory prison sentence-///
But I can't see our politicians bringing out such measures, in case it 'offends'.
This is one of the many disadvantages of bringing together peoples of diverse cultures.
The idyllic dream of bringing together in one big 'melting pot' can never materialise.
/// anyone found involved in this heinous crime needs a mantadory prison sentence-///
But I can't see our politicians bringing out such measures, in case it 'offends'.
This is one of the many disadvantages of bringing together peoples of diverse cultures.
The idyllic dream of bringing together in one big 'melting pot' can never materialise.
-- answer removed --
I wish i knew, whichever way you look at it, this subject brings out strong emotions, and whenever i have watched documentaries on it, or read articles, i truly despair. How in modern Britain does no one notice, or is the practice done by their own doctors, and kept under wraps so to speak.
Education should be the key, and because one does it, doesn't mean you have to subject your child to it, barbaric.
Education should be the key, and because one does it, doesn't mean you have to subject your child to it, barbaric.
Mufti Naomi ( a world re-known scholar of Islam) – You are at it again. Twisted meanings of Hadith, quoting Quranic verses out of context. What else. I thought this duty had been sanctioned to one of your assistant. I felt like asking you about the details of Sunnah you quoted in your above post but knowing you very well, I know you would start twisting words even more and as I am going away for about a month tomorrow, I will not have time to post again and it would be waste of time.
So what is the option? Option is to say what I believe is right. Common sense tells me that in 1.8 billion Muslims you would hardly find a man who has not been circumcised. But among same population how many women are there who has been circumcised? If not then why Muslims have taken it so seriously for males but not for females? Reason is very simple. Muslims learn Islam from their own sources and do not depend upon people like Naomi. Women circumcision has nothing to do with Islam or any religion. It is cultural tradition in few African countries and I am sure Naomi is aware of this but does not want to believe as it would not serve the objective she is after. However male circumcision is religious and medical evidence about the benefits to support is more than enough. We have talked about this sooooooooo many times and therefore if your memory is short then just check your archives as I am sure you have them all. That’s all.
So what is the option? Option is to say what I believe is right. Common sense tells me that in 1.8 billion Muslims you would hardly find a man who has not been circumcised. But among same population how many women are there who has been circumcised? If not then why Muslims have taken it so seriously for males but not for females? Reason is very simple. Muslims learn Islam from their own sources and do not depend upon people like Naomi. Women circumcision has nothing to do with Islam or any religion. It is cultural tradition in few African countries and I am sure Naomi is aware of this but does not want to believe as it would not serve the objective she is after. However male circumcision is religious and medical evidence about the benefits to support is more than enough. We have talked about this sooooooooo many times and therefore if your memory is short then just check your archives as I am sure you have them all. That’s all.
sick to the pit of my stomach reading this. On the increase, when yes im sure it is a offence in this country and also abroad, the government brought out an act years ago and it does carry a prison sentence if found happening in this country and also abroad. I would report anyone involved in this sort of behaviour and if that labels me racist then I am a racist!
Em, I'm not surprised.
Keyplus, //Women circumcision has nothing to do with Islam or any religion. It is cultural tradition in few African countries and I am sure Naomi is aware of this but does not want to believe as it would not serve the objective she is after.//
Keyplus doesn't fail to recognise the fact that this horrendous practice is mainly carried out within Islamic societies - he refuses to recognise it. Perhaps he should study the influential people within his own religion a bit more because he has clearly never heard of the likes Sheikh Yussef al-Badri, who together with a group of Islamic fundamentalists, doctors and lawyers, brought a lawsuit before the Egyptian court arguing that the state could not forbid female circumcision because it is required under Islamic law. The Sheikh told the council that he had found three new 'hadiths' (acts and words ascribed to the prophet Muhammad) proving that he [Mohammed] had authorised female circumcision.
Although the court ruled that "henceforth, it is illegal for anyone to carry out circumcision operations, even if the girl or her parents agree to it", according to official estimates at the time, more than 90 per cent of Egyptian girls were circumcised, more than 70 per cent of the operations were carried out at home in unsanitary conditions and many girls bled to death.
I've edited the above from a BBC news report.
With regard to Keyplus' reference to the 'objective' I am after, an end to the subjugation of Muslim women would be a good start. In the 21st Century there can be no acceptable excuse for this - not even religion.
Sqad, Keyplus concedes that male circumcision is carried out for religious purposes, but backs it up by saying that it's been proven by modern science to be more hygienic. The practice of male circumcision within Islam really amounts to Mohammed's penchant for emulating the Jews who, since Abraham's alleged covenant with God, have continued the practice. Having said that, as far as I'm aware, there is nothing in Jewish literature that could be construed as divine authority to carry out female circumcision and the practice has never been recognised in Jewish law.
Keyplus, //Women circumcision has nothing to do with Islam or any religion. It is cultural tradition in few African countries and I am sure Naomi is aware of this but does not want to believe as it would not serve the objective she is after.//
Keyplus doesn't fail to recognise the fact that this horrendous practice is mainly carried out within Islamic societies - he refuses to recognise it. Perhaps he should study the influential people within his own religion a bit more because he has clearly never heard of the likes Sheikh Yussef al-Badri, who together with a group of Islamic fundamentalists, doctors and lawyers, brought a lawsuit before the Egyptian court arguing that the state could not forbid female circumcision because it is required under Islamic law. The Sheikh told the council that he had found three new 'hadiths' (acts and words ascribed to the prophet Muhammad) proving that he [Mohammed] had authorised female circumcision.
Although the court ruled that "henceforth, it is illegal for anyone to carry out circumcision operations, even if the girl or her parents agree to it", according to official estimates at the time, more than 90 per cent of Egyptian girls were circumcised, more than 70 per cent of the operations were carried out at home in unsanitary conditions and many girls bled to death.
I've edited the above from a BBC news report.
With regard to Keyplus' reference to the 'objective' I am after, an end to the subjugation of Muslim women would be a good start. In the 21st Century there can be no acceptable excuse for this - not even religion.
Sqad, Keyplus concedes that male circumcision is carried out for religious purposes, but backs it up by saying that it's been proven by modern science to be more hygienic. The practice of male circumcision within Islam really amounts to Mohammed's penchant for emulating the Jews who, since Abraham's alleged covenant with God, have continued the practice. Having said that, as far as I'm aware, there is nothing in Jewish literature that could be construed as divine authority to carry out female circumcision and the practice has never been recognised in Jewish law.
Em10 - “Keyplus shame you didn't look at the link I provided, gives more information, and isn't biased, distorted.”
Unfortunately for both us and him, Grand Mufti Keyplus cannot differentiate between the distorted and the undistorted; the biased and the unbiased. Such distinctions are lost upon him. It's such a shame that the great man himself has temporarily left the building and is therefore unable to impart his vast knowledge of Islam upon us mere mortals.
Unfortunately for both us and him, Grand Mufti Keyplus cannot differentiate between the distorted and the undistorted; the biased and the unbiased. Such distinctions are lost upon him. It's such a shame that the great man himself has temporarily left the building and is therefore unable to impart his vast knowledge of Islam upon us mere mortals.
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