Connections 314 - Sat 20 April
Quizzes & Puzzles6 mins ago
breaking your child's spirit
34 Answers
What would you have done in this situation? Today I heard a Mum yelling at her boy ”I'm so f˄ck1ng tired of you...!” The boy was about six and they were on their way home probably after a long day at work and preschool respectively. Instead of staying close to his mother he had climbed onto a mountain of snow by the side of the footpath and this was what had set her off, tired and dying to get home as she probably was. Her tone of voice was every bit as aggressive as the wording implies.
I slowed my steps down trying to think of something to say to her that wouldn't make her even more aggressive. Next, the boy slid down the mountain of snow to - reluctantly - join her and I heard her say ”Good job, Charlie! There's a clever boy...” and I felt some relief at what I thought was a happy ending - of sorts. But the full sentence turned out to be ”There's a clever boy, touching the dog pee and everything!” His mitten had happened to touch some yellow snow as he landed at the base of the snow mountain...
She then stormed off at a pace he couldn't have kept had he wanted to. The last thing I saw, he was following behind, slowly, reluctantly. I wanted to tell him there is love in the world but I didn't. In situations like these, two things tend to stop me from acting. One, there's so little ”room” to act and I feel it's likely that this kind of person would only get madder and take it out on the child even more. And two, I don't want to tell a parent off in front of her child. I do believe the child needs to know their parent is in the wrong, but it has to be conveyed in a way that doesn't shame the parent - and how do you do that in this kind of situation? If I know anything at all about psychology, she would be easily offended...
The moment was gone and I did nothing. What would you have done?
I slowed my steps down trying to think of something to say to her that wouldn't make her even more aggressive. Next, the boy slid down the mountain of snow to - reluctantly - join her and I heard her say ”Good job, Charlie! There's a clever boy...” and I felt some relief at what I thought was a happy ending - of sorts. But the full sentence turned out to be ”There's a clever boy, touching the dog pee and everything!” His mitten had happened to touch some yellow snow as he landed at the base of the snow mountain...
She then stormed off at a pace he couldn't have kept had he wanted to. The last thing I saw, he was following behind, slowly, reluctantly. I wanted to tell him there is love in the world but I didn't. In situations like these, two things tend to stop me from acting. One, there's so little ”room” to act and I feel it's likely that this kind of person would only get madder and take it out on the child even more. And two, I don't want to tell a parent off in front of her child. I do believe the child needs to know their parent is in the wrong, but it has to be conveyed in a way that doesn't shame the parent - and how do you do that in this kind of situation? If I know anything at all about psychology, she would be easily offended...
The moment was gone and I did nothing. What would you have done?
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I think you are right Swedeheart. Perhaps it is a deep-rooted shame that has been instilled in these people but don't you think it's our modern society that's responsible for that? This last generation have been taught by various governments that they should have no values, morals or respect - either for themselves or other people. The TV and films are full of four-letter words now which were banned when I was a teenager in the 70s. Punk rock was banned for Heavens sake - yet look at this rap music which talks about guns, drugs, rape and refers to girls and women as 'b***ches'.
I have just got so sick in the last few years of seeing people wrecking things, trying to break into vending machines, damaging cars etc that I tend to fly at them now. They always seem so astonished that anyone could say something to them while they are smashing up a bus shelter! They immediately stop. It's the same with the drunks at night (never one by themselves of course) who stagger up with bottles in their hands saying things like "You f***ing w****er". I'm minding my own business so why do they do that?! I've learned how to deal with them and they do just melt away (I've often wondered what look comes across me for two or three drunks to suddenly back off). I just regarded the woman I saw screaming at her child with the 'F' word was just another of those.
Perhaps the problem should be tackled at more grass roots level. Perhaps we should start instilling social rules and respect again.
I have just got so sick in the last few years of seeing people wrecking things, trying to break into vending machines, damaging cars etc that I tend to fly at them now. They always seem so astonished that anyone could say something to them while they are smashing up a bus shelter! They immediately stop. It's the same with the drunks at night (never one by themselves of course) who stagger up with bottles in their hands saying things like "You f***ing w****er". I'm minding my own business so why do they do that?! I've learned how to deal with them and they do just melt away (I've often wondered what look comes across me for two or three drunks to suddenly back off). I just regarded the woman I saw screaming at her child with the 'F' word was just another of those.
Perhaps the problem should be tackled at more grass roots level. Perhaps we should start instilling social rules and respect again.
I think people need to take off their rose tinted glasses.
> have just got so sick in the last few years of seeing people wrecking things, trying to break into vending machines<
That never happened before then? I'll have to remind my Mother about her and her Brother robbing the fruit machines in a casino...
The same woman that never drank, smoked or swore...
That's the problem with getting older...you start getting nostalgic.
> have just got so sick in the last few years of seeing people wrecking things, trying to break into vending machines<
That never happened before then? I'll have to remind my Mother about her and her Brother robbing the fruit machines in a casino...
The same woman that never drank, smoked or swore...
That's the problem with getting older...you start getting nostalgic.
Swedeheart - me again.
I think Ummm is right. Apart from using the 'F' word your situation is a little different to Karen's and mine. It could be said that the mother was worn out and the lad was playing up. She shouldn't have used the 'F' word but perhaps she was getting towards the end of her tether.
I used to play my mother up no end. She also had what's recognised today as severe post-natal depression as she never got over having my brother. She often couldn't cope with the two of us. My father was usually away flying, we lived abroad most of the time and my mother was always lonely with no friends. Perhaps this woman is going through something similar.
I think Ummm is right. Apart from using the 'F' word your situation is a little different to Karen's and mine. It could be said that the mother was worn out and the lad was playing up. She shouldn't have used the 'F' word but perhaps she was getting towards the end of her tether.
I used to play my mother up no end. She also had what's recognised today as severe post-natal depression as she never got over having my brother. She often couldn't cope with the two of us. My father was usually away flying, we lived abroad most of the time and my mother was always lonely with no friends. Perhaps this woman is going through something similar.
Ummm,
Of course it happened before. The difference with me is that I never got involved when I was younger. I always carried on walking like most other people.
One night in Grimsby in about 1995 I saw 5 youngsters in a stolen car smash it into railings then a traffic light at 2am. They then ran off laughing with a woman witness in pursuit. I was so incensed that I told the woman to call the police and I then caught the five of them in Sainsbury's car park. I was so angry they froze and never moved until the police arrived! I'm sure you would understand more about that Ummm than many other people. The driver was 15, three boys were 14 and the girl was 13. Her mother thought she was 'sleeping over ' with a friend and would be in by 9.30pm! Instead she was riding around in stolen cars at 2am. The police thanked the two of us for our efforts and the driver was saddled with a £9000 bill from the council for the damage!
Since then I've just acted on those same instincts of outrage and injustice. I feel good afterwards that I have actually done something rather than notice and ignore.
Of course it happened before. The difference with me is that I never got involved when I was younger. I always carried on walking like most other people.
One night in Grimsby in about 1995 I saw 5 youngsters in a stolen car smash it into railings then a traffic light at 2am. They then ran off laughing with a woman witness in pursuit. I was so incensed that I told the woman to call the police and I then caught the five of them in Sainsbury's car park. I was so angry they froze and never moved until the police arrived! I'm sure you would understand more about that Ummm than many other people. The driver was 15, three boys were 14 and the girl was 13. Her mother thought she was 'sleeping over ' with a friend and would be in by 9.30pm! Instead she was riding around in stolen cars at 2am. The police thanked the two of us for our efforts and the driver was saddled with a £9000 bill from the council for the damage!
Since then I've just acted on those same instincts of outrage and injustice. I feel good afterwards that I have actually done something rather than notice and ignore.
I wouldn't have said anything to her. For all we know she got home, had a cuppa, calmed down and then played happily with son for the rest of the day. It did remind me of a time me and my bf took my nephew to London in Jan. We were waiting to cross the road at Baker St (which is always pakced full of people) and I suddenly saw a woman barging through everyone to cross the road with a crying child following behind her. She shouted at him something like 'oh just grow up'. The child was about 4! I felt really sorry for him but I would not have said anything.
I do take people up on their language when kids are around though. If I was in your position Karen I would have had a right go about using that word with kids around. I took my niece swimming one and there were some gobby teens in the changing rooms using some foul language. I just looked at them and said 'would you please not use that disgusting language when there are children around'. They shrunk about 2ft, said sorry and skulked off. It felt good.
I do take people up on their language when kids are around though. If I was in your position Karen I would have had a right go about using that word with kids around. I took my niece swimming one and there were some gobby teens in the changing rooms using some foul language. I just looked at them and said 'would you please not use that disgusting language when there are children around'. They shrunk about 2ft, said sorry and skulked off. It felt good.
I don't think one telling off from a frustrated parent is going to break a kid's spirit. Whilst all parents should be perfect in every way the problem with most is that they are human. Anyway it's hardly child abuse.
I think you were right to say nothing, and I'm rather surprised you are bottling up inner rage over it such that you feel you want to ask here about it. Let it go, it won't do you any good.
I think you were right to say nothing, and I'm rather surprised you are bottling up inner rage over it such that you feel you want to ask here about it. Let it go, it won't do you any good.
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We can't correct all the wrongs of society.
Neither can we justifiably interfere in other people's family lives.
The mum was probably treated the same by her parents.
The child will some day be the same to his children.
Sadly, there is still an underclass in society.
My friends' daughter considered her parents were treating her badly because her Blackberry was the old model, and her pals in her school house "all" had the new model.
It's all relative.
(although I have bought her the new model as a present for when she comes home at half term)
(and I did ask her parents' permission first).
Neither can we justifiably interfere in other people's family lives.
The mum was probably treated the same by her parents.
The child will some day be the same to his children.
Sadly, there is still an underclass in society.
My friends' daughter considered her parents were treating her badly because her Blackberry was the old model, and her pals in her school house "all" had the new model.
It's all relative.
(although I have bought her the new model as a present for when she comes home at half term)
(and I did ask her parents' permission first).
Karen's bus tale made me want to cry :-(
As for yours Swedey, I could sort of see the mum's point of view. If as you say she's had a bad day i can fully understand how it's easy to say things and be impatient to your children, especially when they seem to be pushing your buttons. I hope, in the cold light of day that particular mum isn't like that.
Karen's on the other hand horrified me- that seems like deliberate psychological cruelty, and I'm afraid i'd have said something, i wouldn't have been able to help myself, and probably get my face re-arranged into the bargain!
Your story on the other hand Jayne is utter nonsense, how you can equate a spoilt brats lack of Blackberry as being treated badly beggers belief.
As for yours Swedey, I could sort of see the mum's point of view. If as you say she's had a bad day i can fully understand how it's easy to say things and be impatient to your children, especially when they seem to be pushing your buttons. I hope, in the cold light of day that particular mum isn't like that.
Karen's on the other hand horrified me- that seems like deliberate psychological cruelty, and I'm afraid i'd have said something, i wouldn't have been able to help myself, and probably get my face re-arranged into the bargain!
Your story on the other hand Jayne is utter nonsense, how you can equate a spoilt brats lack of Blackberry as being treated badly beggers belief.
Hi and thanks EVERYbody for your replies. Most of us seem to agree it's a difficult situation. Ummmm et al. you are right, they are different scenarios. The sadistic streak is more blatantly present in Karen's and Andy's examples and may or may not play a part in mine. I'm not sure. But I do consider "my" Mum guilty of the crime of indifference and that's bad enough. I didn't choose the title for this question by accident, I do think that breaking her child's spirit is exactly what she was doing - whether or not like in the other examples she was enjoying doing so. There was something so despondent about his posture, impossible to convey in a post like this, but if you've ever seen it you'll know what I mean: It wasn't a one-off.
Of course you're gonna lose it sometimes, you wouldn't be human if you didn't. But sarcasm with a child just isn't on, and also there's a huuuge difference between (cont.)
Of course you're gonna lose it sometimes, you wouldn't be human if you didn't. But sarcasm with a child just isn't on, and also there's a huuuge difference between (cont.)
(cont.) saying on the one hand ”I'm so f˄ck1ng tired of you...!” and on the other hand "I'm SOOO tired of that kind of BEHAVIOUR!" Just think about it, if your boss says ”I'm so tired of you...!” - or if (s)he says "I've had it up to here with your late arrivals!" See what I'm getting at? There's a big difference even to an adult and even without the profanities - but to a child that difference is crucial. Your behaviour you can change. But when somebody is tired of YOU there is no hope. Some may think I'm splitting hairs in making that distinction but I really do believe it's key.
Old Geezer I have no inner rage. If you're referring to my use of the word idiots, I was jokingly referring back to Andy's own wording in replying to him and I should have used quotation marks and smileys to make that more clear. What I do feel is sadness and a will to be part of the makings of a better future. Cf. Jayne's "The mum was probably treated the same by her parents. The child will some day be the same to his children." - yes. Quite so. And that shouldn't be. Like Andy, I believe we have to start at the basic values level. What we mean by that may be the subject of another thread as we probably all mean different things when we say that. Personally, I swear like a pirate... :)
Old Geezer I have no inner rage. If you're referring to my use of the word idiots, I was jokingly referring back to Andy's own wording in replying to him and I should have used quotation marks and smileys to make that more clear. What I do feel is sadness and a will to be part of the makings of a better future. Cf. Jayne's "The mum was probably treated the same by her parents. The child will some day be the same to his children." - yes. Quite so. And that shouldn't be. Like Andy, I believe we have to start at the basic values level. What we mean by that may be the subject of another thread as we probably all mean different things when we say that. Personally, I swear like a pirate... :)
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