Have We Been Duped By Boris?

[david small]

After all the shenanigans and bluster. Have we been misled, conned, by Boris.
Is no deal dead?

[diddlydo]

NJ What abnormality would that be then?

[THECORBYLOON]

JD, that vote was the Second Reading of the European Communities Bill, the final vote was
301-284 in favour.

[diddlydo]

Naomi - if you had read my post properly, you wouldn't have made that foolish comment.

[dannyk13]

Jim//then it's the EU's decision whether or not to grant an extension. If it does, it's out of his hands.//
Last night Donald Tusk said " there is no reason for an extension"

[naomi24]

Diddlydo, had you read your post properly you wouldn’t have deemed my comment foolish. That we fought hard to get into the Common Market is not a rational or valid reason to remain part of an organisation that bears no resemblance whatsoever to the club we joined all those years ago.

[hereIam]

As I'm sat here writing this, there is an ad. on the radio telling us 'how to get ready for Brexit on 31 October'! I hear this ad. every morning and yet, at the back of my mind for quite some time now, I have had doubts about Boris really taking us out then with 'no deal', or indeed any deal. He is a remainer after all isn't he ? Have we been duped, I wonder? I sincerely hope not.

[Cloverjo]

I agree with Jim360 earlier.

Johnson has achieved his dream of becoming PM. He wants to be the man who secured the exit from the EU.

Well, that T May’s billion pounds to DUP was well spent, wasn’t it?

[Old_Geezer]

"TTT would do well to remember/be told how hard we fought to get into the EU (or Common Market as it was then) before spouting the ridiculous rants that have become his/her watchword."

The vital bit is that it was a Common Market that we were supposed to be joining, and all that claimed there was a federalist agenda were accused of lying and fearmongering. Thus the attraction at the time. So railing against the EU reality is valid and the rational, logical response.

[CrapAtCryptics]

I believe he has said all the way that he wanted to get a deal but I`m sure there are ways to impose a no deal if the electoral suicide squad are daft enough to vote the deal down.

[Old_Geezer]

They're continuing to head towards their federal aims controlled by the Commission's elite. Have much abnormality do you want ?

[ichkeria]

I don’t believe anyone on the EU has said “ there definitely will be no extension” only that there is no need for an extension, which is not the same thing and might in any case not be true. They might be saying this to help the PM at home by focusing minds.
It’s certainly got the Brexit Party furious :-)
Of course equally the above doesn’t mean they WOULD grant an extension if asked.

[Bigbad]

For a few days I thought Mr Johnson was looking quite haggard, but then having watched all the hand pumping and back slapping in Brussels yesterday, his appearance has of course changed. I believe it’s because his main aim all along was to go down in history as a great leader who saved us all.
It’s a carp deal, and I hope it doesn’t get through.
I’m wondering how his pro Brexit, pro no deal supporters will vote. Will they stick to their guns, or roll over and play dead?

[jim360]

I suspect that the main reason this deal might pass is not on its own merits but because Brexiteers are too afraid of getting nothing at all after almost four years. That's a bad motivation. It's interesting, though, to see how divided Leavers are about the merits of the deal, both on AB and nationally.

[Old_Geezer]

I'd be more inclined to think perhaps, maybe, possibly sufficient Brexiteer MPs might have had enough, and consider the deal a pragmatic way forward. NI issues with the EU aside, most of the nation will be out of the single market and customs union: and NI can be too if it decides it would rather the border was with the RoI than with the rest of the UK. It's not a good deal but it may persuade some who have no fear of revoke occurring, because surely there can't be sufficient MPs that daft, to go for it and see how things pan out. Saturday will be interesting.

[ichkeria]

NI will never opt for a border with the ROI.
It isn’t clear in what respects NI remains governed by EU tariffs / that still has to be sorted.
If this deal goes down I predict Brexit may go down with it.
I would bet on a narrow win for Johnson tho if pressed.

[ichkeria]

Johnson claimed at the time of the votes on Benn that any Tory MP who voted down his deal would also lose the whip

[New Judge]

//NJ What abnormality would that be then?//

The abnormality of being allegedly a sovereign nation but being unable to enact legislation without compliance to the whims of an unelected foreign bureaucracy - a bureaucracy which will become increasingly federal over time and which will encroach upon more and more matters which should be the preserve of sovereign Parliaments. Membership of the EU is not a "normal" state of affairs for any nation which values its sovereignty and those believing this "deal" (which is in fact an unacceptable alternative to the Lisbon Treaty) will see the end to the Brexit fiasco need to think again.