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Moderate Muslims

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birdie1971 | 01:31 Sat 11th Nov 2017 | Religion & Spirituality
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Are the 'moderate' muslims in the UK aware that they will be crushed and treated as apostates if their dream of an islamic UK state were ever to become a reality?

In my opinion, islam is very much like communism. The standard bearers of both like to espouse the virtues of their particular political / religious ideology, knowing full well that many people will be slaughtered as a result. The ones doing the espousing always justify their belief by convincing themselves that they will be the ones who make up the ruling elite of such an ideology. It never seems to occur to these zealots and bigots that they will be eaten by their own.

Do the westernised, moderate muslims truly think that they will be spared the wrath of political islam?
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By their own ?
Either you are asking about moderates; or you accept they aren't the same, and thus risk nothing for they would be in favour.
Hello birdie, (I feared you had flown the coop) Yes, you are quite right, if we consider just from what are the (genuine) Syrian refugees have been fleeing, it isn't the wicked West, it's from other Muslims
I read reports in the German press of the conditions in the hostels and holding centres for immigrants and it sound appalling; with no time for the niceties by the poor beleaguered souls trying to cope, all are treated as simply "Muslims" which means Sunnis and Shias and various other sub-divisions are sharing the same facilities which has lead to extreme violence, brutality rape and torture. There are reports even of a sort of 'Muslim Mafia' where one group 'control' things like an electric wall socket, and charge others for its use.
Try to magnify this a million times into a possible future Islamic - controlled European state and it won't be only the indigenous population who loose out !!
How do you define a "moderate Muslim"?
One that's been rendered harmless.
douglas,
rendered harmless, fat chance of that....
When you keep on harming someone then you can't expect them all to be harmless.
^Just one and a bit lines - but not difficult to read between them.
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Keyplus - “How do you define a "moderate Muslim?”


I define a 'moderate muslim' as an individual who has a very limited and/or deliberately selective understanding of the Koran. An individual who doesn't understand or will not acknowledge (publicly) that the teachings of Islam, as written in the Koran, support the following: anti-democratic values, racism, anti-semitism, slavery, paedophilia, murder for the most trivial of transgressions... I could go on and on and on.

'Moderate' muslims, like you, who know the Koran, indulge in Taqiyya – essentially lying to non-believers. You lie about Islam's goals. You lie about what the Koran says. You lie about people who oppose your views. You lie. And you lie. And you lie.

The truth is anathema to you and to people who think like you. To you, the truth is malleable and transient. To those of us who have taken the time to read the Koran and the Hadiths, your lies and the lies of Mohammed are laid bare.

Your struggle is to subjugate the world to Islam. My struggle is to educate people to resist your totalitarian, racist, fascist philosophy.
In that case keep looking for moderate muslims who do not act upon Quran. Good luck.
Naomi, Western countries need to stop interfering and invading into Muslim countries, they have to stop supporting dictators when it suits them and stop dismantling democratically elected governments when it suits them. That is the only option, otherwise keep trying and keep making this world a bitter place to live. And once again, we have all talked about this and I will not waste anymore of my time on this. We all know who creates, supports and arms terrorists and then sells arms to someone else to get rid of them. We all know who's business benefits due to the conflicts in the world. Iraq was attacked on a false intelligence report about the weapons that North Korea has and is willing to use. Do you believe USA would attack NK? I doubt it.
Keyplus, as I said, not difficult to read between the lines.
//Western countries need to stop interfering and invading into Muslim countries//
Not often that I agree with keyplus, but I agree here.
what happens when those countries ask for help?
nailit, over the years I've also agreed with Keyplus on that particular point - which he makes regularly. However, nothing justifies Manchester, London Bridge, Nice, et al - does it, Keyplus?
I'm reading (just coming to the end of) 'Fields of Blood - Religion and the History of Violence', by the remarkable, Karen Armstrong;
Amazon.co.uk User Recommendation

"Riveting" the Observer "Dazzling" the Washington Post.

She has an astonishing breadth of understanding of all religions and though she doesn't make any apology for Muslim extremism in any way whatsoever, she is able to try to understand the mindset of its perpetrators from a balanced perspective, and that isn't easy.
I confess I had to re-consider some of my views when seen in the context of western intervention into the Middle East and beyond.

I can recommend it highly, particularly the final two chapters 'Holy Terror' and 'Global Jihad'.
But who will read it - naomi?
Naomi, agree with you also. Two wrongs don't make a right.
In my mind, the west should NOT in any way interfere in the politics of muslim countries, they are worlds apart. BUT if muslims feel that that them gives them the right to commit atrocities on innocent westerners (who might happen to agree with them) then that is just illogical, sick and barbaric and they arnt doing themselves any favors.
No one is saying that what happened in Manchester, London , Nice or anywhere else was right. However when people are killed in other places then that is wrong too. But unfortunately not many people speak about them.

No Muslim country asks for help. Dictators ask for help to save their own interests, corrupt people ask for help, and most of the times even they are forced too to rely on Western countries using behind the curtain forces. People like Saddams, Anawar Sadats, Qaddafis and many more are used by Western countries and then discarded like a tissue paper. But they do not learn.

On one side there are people who are being recruited from mainly western countries to go into Muslim countries and destroy those countries and before they leave they buy books like Islam for dummies and that tells me how much they know about Islam. And on the other hand there are people like Birdies who want moderate Muslims. What more moderation do you ask for than these ones being exported to other countries to create anarchy there in the name of religion they do not know ABC of.
Naomi, by the way I would like your response to my question. That why USA & Co are taking too long to attack NK? As I said they attacked Iraq without any delay and even against the wish of UNO for the sake of WMD (which were never there), where the same WMD are clearly present and Kim is also willing to use them?
keyplus, now and then you make a valid point, and this is one. There is no doubt that some unfair inroads have been made into foreign countries. However, I would rather have the US watching my back then any other country.

To get back to the Q. Are you prepared to, here on this forum, publicly denounce the Islamic practice of pedophilism, indiscriminate murder of infidels and Gays, women domination and aggravated violence against those Muslims who do not adhere to the strict Islam beliefs.

No ifs or buts...... will you huh?
//keyplus, now and then you make a valid point, and this is one. There is no doubt that some unfair inroads have been made into foreign countries//

Yes indeed. But none of this is the reason for attacks on non-Muslims by Muslims. That campaign of deceit firstly, then violence and terror began in 623 when Mohammed arrived in Medina. And became divinely mandated when Mohammed conquered Mecca after his renunciation of his treaty with them and Allah "revealed" the sacred duty of submitting the whole world to Islam.

After his death his faithful companions instigated a series of violent "interventions" in both the Eastern and Western Roman empires, the Zoroastrian Persia and a few other places you may have heard of like Buddhist Afghanistan and Hindu India.

None of these peoples had ever intervend in the Arabian desert.

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