A Godless Universe

[David90]

The truth is we live in a godless universe. But many people find this idea intolerable and so over the centuries have invented a vast supernatural fantasy in which their god gives them protection, reward, punishment, love in exchange for a life of complete devotion. God is a father figure, boss, CEO, fat controller etc.
Or possibly a shepherd. There are many ovine metaphors in the bible in particular and in christianity in general. So my question is: Are you a sheep ? Are you a lost sheep desperately seeking a shepherd ? Or are you an adult human capable of standing on your own two feet, facing reality and at least trying to work it out for yourself ?

[Mamyalynne]

I'm still thinking,continually thinking.

[Old_Geezer]

And your proof that is the truth... or is it merely your faith ?

[agchristie]

OG - cue Khandro! ;)

[atalanta]

In the old testament a sheep/lamb was hardly ever mentioned except as a sacrifice. So, no, I am not going to be a sacrifice. I prefer to be a thinker, reasoner, and maybe a bit of a philosopher.

[wildwood]

Because much of it is unreachable for us - even at the speed of light, I do not believe that we will ever completely understand the whole Universe. To create something from nothing is beyond most of us' understanding.

At least we do have the evidence on Earth to support the Evolution of life.

Sometimes I view genuinely religious people with envy about the comfort they get from conversing with their deity. The ones that do get on my goat are the holier than thou preachers who profess to be religious but still partake in unsociable behavior much in contravention of their supposedly religious beliefs.

[idiosyncrasy]

In the scriptures Jesus often describes his followers as "sheep", so I would say I am a sheep.

[modeller]

The universe started 14 billion years ago and our earth ten billion years later and they are still evolving , from the lowly amino acids to the dinosaurs and to us.
However the theists can't cope or even consider those facts they prefer to believe in an imaginary entity 8000 years ago who did it all in 6 days. E

[maggiebee]

Where's Naomi when you need her??

[maggiebee]

PS I'm a sheep and I depend on my shepherd every day.

[douglas9401]

I think we're experiencing ovine intervention.

[EDDIE51]

Are you 'Goodlife ' in disguise?

[naomi24]

There are many thousands of Christian denominations so clearly the invisible shepherd isn’t doing a very good job of rounding up his flock. Christians don’t follow an individual shepherd – they follow their preferred choice of the plethora of loudly bleating sheep that distinguish themselves as leaders by wearing bells around their necks. I hope that helps, Maggiebee.

[RATTER15]

I don't need a shepherd, I can see life quite clearly without the need to follow fake and murderous God's. Life is great without all this carp!

[Hypognosis]

@David90

//Are you a sheep ?//

I am two legs, a wooly coat and a long face short of being an *actual* sheep.
I sincerely hope that I am not a figurative sheep… but read on…

//Or are you an adult human capable of standing on your own two feet, facing reality and at least trying to work it out for yourself ? //

I don't think I particularly *tried* to work things out for myself. I had a career path in mind, for which I needed to do a degree, for which I needed qualifications to enter the course, for which I had to pass exams, for which I had to learn and regurgitate a set of facts.

None of these facts I found out for myself. Repetition of experimental procedure is not the same as first-hand discovery, it merely proves that the fact is so and is repeatable. I lack the financial resources and expertise to refute a single scientific research paper and am forced to take it for granted that other researchers have done the replication/refutation work.

Science is nothing if not disputatious! (A vs B rivalry is normal but note that all sides join forces to attack quack science).

[sandyRoe]

How can we know that the universe is Godless?

[Hypognosis]

@Sandy

If something isn't there, there is nothing that you can do, experimentally, to detect that it isn't there.

As the saying goes "you can't prove a negative".

You can however disprove the null hypothesis "God does not exist" by having him materialise and do something utterly miraculous, beyond the ability of modern science to explain.

The UFO=aliens hypothesis could do likewise by doing something indisputable, such as landing on the White House lawn.

[andy-hughes]

I have no need of a deity, but I understand those who do.

[birdie1971]

sandyRoe - "How can we know that the universe is Godless?"

Ahh. The old, 'burden of proof' switcheroo. You make an extraordinary claim and then challenge others to disprove your assertion in an attempt to place the burden of proof upon those who disagree with you. It's a well tried and tested ploy used the world over by people who haven't got a logical leg to stand on.

No dice I'm afraid.

The burden of proof is upon your shoulders. You and your ilk are the ones making the extraordinary claim: that the universe and everything in it has been created by a supernatural, all knowing, all seeing, all powerful deity. The only honest and decent response to such a claim is: prove it.