ChatterBank4 mins ago
No Link. Just An Observation.
Considering that most TV journalists have spent the last few months asking ministers (stupid) questions designed to score points, why does nobody challenge them on things such as more people appear to be dying from flu than Corona, so why have we never taken such drastic measures for flu?
Or how many people will die/have their lives irrevocably damaged because of not being treated for existing or screened for new medical conditions?
And aside from all the people who have lost/will lose their jobs, which is terrible in itself, these people may now be entitled to Council Tax benefits, meaning a lot less revenue for local councils, and free prescriptions which presumably means less for the NHS?
Or that the reason for more cases being diagnosed, could be because of more tests being done, and does this necessarily mean that more people are contracting Corona?
Or how can masks be effective when so many people poke, prod and fiddle with theirs, and stuff it in a bag or pocket to be used again later.
It would make a pleasant change if someone asked a pertinent question
Or how many people will die/have their lives irrevocably damaged because of not being treated for existing or screened for new medical conditions?
And aside from all the people who have lost/will lose their jobs, which is terrible in itself, these people may now be entitled to Council Tax benefits, meaning a lot less revenue for local councils, and free prescriptions which presumably means less for the NHS?
Or that the reason for more cases being diagnosed, could be because of more tests being done, and does this necessarily mean that more people are contracting Corona?
Or how can masks be effective when so many people poke, prod and fiddle with theirs, and stuff it in a bag or pocket to be used again later.
It would make a pleasant change if someone asked a pertinent question
Answers
Nailed it there 10C I suspect Journalists are not asking the questions many wnat answered is because it doesn't fit the narrative. Many 'journalisti
10:47 Sun 20th Sep 2020
>why does nobody challenge them on things such as more people appear to be dying from flu than Corona, so why have we never taken such drastic measures for flu?
Because it's nonsense. Loads more died from Covid in the first few months of it than die in a year from flu.
Yes, numbers here are back down from the peak of several thousand a week but are picking up again as are hospital admissions as infections rise.
>Or that the reason for more cases being diagnosed, could be because of more tests being done, and does this necessarily mean that more people are contracting Corona?
They could ask the question but they are sensible enough to know the answer already. Might be worth asking though just so people can hear the answer because some clearly don't believe the scientists- but they probably still wouldn't believe it
Because it's nonsense. Loads more died from Covid in the first few months of it than die in a year from flu.
Yes, numbers here are back down from the peak of several thousand a week but are picking up again as are hospital admissions as infections rise.
>Or that the reason for more cases being diagnosed, could be because of more tests being done, and does this necessarily mean that more people are contracting Corona?
They could ask the question but they are sensible enough to know the answer already. Might be worth asking though just so people can hear the answer because some clearly don't believe the scientists- but they probably still wouldn't believe it
The mask point made by Bigbad is a fair one.
The WHO rules are to do with "proper" use of facemasks.
I don't use mine properly I'm sure and I would be surprised if the majority do.
Whether that is a good enough reason for no one to bother, when I am sure part of the aim is to make people feel safe, I am not sure.
Arguably it leads to complacency.
I hadn't btw realised that there were near riots in the US over mask wearing back in the days of the Spanish flu epidemic. So it's not a new controversy.
The WHO rules are to do with "proper" use of facemasks.
I don't use mine properly I'm sure and I would be surprised if the majority do.
Whether that is a good enough reason for no one to bother, when I am sure part of the aim is to make people feel safe, I am not sure.
Arguably it leads to complacency.
I hadn't btw realised that there were near riots in the US over mask wearing back in the days of the Spanish flu epidemic. So it's not a new controversy.
I'm not convinced masks help but we have made the decision and every country does the same so we should just continue. Maybe we should have reminders on adverts on how best to use a mask but then some would say it's getting like a nanny state. I certainly wouldn't want to hear politicians being grilled by the press on this again as it would just be going over the same ground.
>More people appear to be dying of flu now, than they are of Corona now.
Probably true but it's not the point/
More people were dying of flu than Covid in March but we failed to nip Covid in the bud and it killed tens of thousands a month in UK alone. Many were saying we should have locked down/ placed restrictions sooner and with hindsight they were right. Shouldn't we learn from that?
Probably true but it's not the point/
More people were dying of flu than Covid in March but we failed to nip Covid in the bud and it killed tens of thousands a month in UK alone. Many were saying we should have locked down/ placed restrictions sooner and with hindsight they were right. Shouldn't we learn from that?
FF, how about the people dying, because their treatment has been stopped "in case of" covid admissions?
It's very easy to say, and make others just look callous- but we are well aware that many different people die from different causes. There does now seem to be a total inequity about this one... It worries me as well, but i still realise, it has overtaken everything else in importance. Is it really better to deliberately and knowingly, let someone die from cancer, than risk a possibility of covid?
It's very easy to say, and make others just look callous- but we are well aware that many different people die from different causes. There does now seem to be a total inequity about this one... It worries me as well, but i still realise, it has overtaken everything else in importance. Is it really better to deliberately and knowingly, let someone die from cancer, than risk a possibility of covid?
Ken, I don't think coverings are even valid, really. Even the scientists and the government are only claiming they will "give confidence". However, we do need to protect the economy too.
The only thing I don't like about it... is a false sense of reassurance. If people are taking risks, they deserve to know.
The only thing I don't like about it... is a false sense of reassurance. If people are taking risks, they deserve to know.
I would have thought that by now the evidence suggests that lockdown wasn’t introduced too late.
All these countries introduced lockdowns earlier than the UK and where are they now?
So that’s one thing I wouldn’t criticise the government for.
In the other hand, you fly into Rome for example and you get a Covid 19 test with result available in 30 mins.
Whereas here ...
All these countries introduced lockdowns earlier than the UK and where are they now?
So that’s one thing I wouldn’t criticise the government for.
In the other hand, you fly into Rome for example and you get a Covid 19 test with result available in 30 mins.
Whereas here ...
// Loads more died from Covid in the first few months of it than die in a year from flu.//
Quite possibly (depending on what year you take as typical for ‘flu). In the three months since the UK’s first recorded death (on 5th March) 38,407 people died either with or from Covid. However, what you haven’t mentioned is that in the second three months just 3,325 people died – roughly 36 a day out of a daily death toll (from all causes) of getting on for 2,000. In that period, then, just 1.8% of all deaths were attributable to Covid. I provided the figures for deaths from ‘flu and pneumonia in an earlier thread. They are running at around 150 a day. Many causes of the remainder of the 98.2% of non-Covid deaths are also being neglected and people who might otherwise have been cured with prompt attention are now becoming seriously ill and dying because of this neglect.
//Many were saying we should have locked down/ placed restrictions sooner and with hindsight they were right. Shouldn't we learn from that?//
The reason for the earlier lockdown was to prevent the NHS being overwhelmed (so we are told) and many people – me included - accepted that. The NHS was not overwhelmed and never came close to it despite infections:hospitalisations/deaths ratio being probably ten to fifteen times greater than it is now. I explained a few days ago how the relationship between new infections and hospital admissions/deaths has changed out of all recognition to the situation in March/April. That is what should be learned.
//The WHO now advises them [masks] and every country now agrees on balance they are beneficial if used properly.//
But they are not used properly. I have yet to see anybody using them properly. On the contrary I have seen some appalling examples of misuse. Almost every mask wearer is increasing their risk of self-contamination far more than they are reducing the risk of passing on the virus (if they have it, which more than 99% of them won’t).
//Whether that is a good enough reason for no one to bother [with masks], when I am sure part of the aim is to make people feel safe, I am not sure.//
Then people need to be educated that using them in the way almost all of them do is not safe by any means.
//The mass wearing of face coverings gives the illusion of safety to many who fear the Covid 19 virus.//
Yes. Whilst jeopardising the safety of almost all the wearers. As Pixie says, people should be made aware of the risks they run and I haven’t seen emphasised anywhere that fannying about with a face mask and then placing it back over your nose and mouth is dangerous.
But as you say, we’ve done the mask thing before.
Quite possibly (depending on what year you take as typical for ‘flu). In the three months since the UK’s first recorded death (on 5th March) 38,407 people died either with or from Covid. However, what you haven’t mentioned is that in the second three months just 3,325 people died – roughly 36 a day out of a daily death toll (from all causes) of getting on for 2,000. In that period, then, just 1.8% of all deaths were attributable to Covid. I provided the figures for deaths from ‘flu and pneumonia in an earlier thread. They are running at around 150 a day. Many causes of the remainder of the 98.2% of non-Covid deaths are also being neglected and people who might otherwise have been cured with prompt attention are now becoming seriously ill and dying because of this neglect.
//Many were saying we should have locked down/ placed restrictions sooner and with hindsight they were right. Shouldn't we learn from that?//
The reason for the earlier lockdown was to prevent the NHS being overwhelmed (so we are told) and many people – me included - accepted that. The NHS was not overwhelmed and never came close to it despite infections:hospitalisations/deaths ratio being probably ten to fifteen times greater than it is now. I explained a few days ago how the relationship between new infections and hospital admissions/deaths has changed out of all recognition to the situation in March/April. That is what should be learned.
//The WHO now advises them [masks] and every country now agrees on balance they are beneficial if used properly.//
But they are not used properly. I have yet to see anybody using them properly. On the contrary I have seen some appalling examples of misuse. Almost every mask wearer is increasing their risk of self-contamination far more than they are reducing the risk of passing on the virus (if they have it, which more than 99% of them won’t).
//Whether that is a good enough reason for no one to bother [with masks], when I am sure part of the aim is to make people feel safe, I am not sure.//
Then people need to be educated that using them in the way almost all of them do is not safe by any means.
//The mass wearing of face coverings gives the illusion of safety to many who fear the Covid 19 virus.//
Yes. Whilst jeopardising the safety of almost all the wearers. As Pixie says, people should be made aware of the risks they run and I haven’t seen emphasised anywhere that fannying about with a face mask and then placing it back over your nose and mouth is dangerous.
But as you say, we’ve done the mask thing before.
When the decision made is to strip the citizens of some personal rights we ought not comply at all, let alone continue. And of course a new virus is likely to hit hard, but now we know who is vulnerable, that state is in the past. Continuing with the restrictions is the very thing that we ought not be doing.
No harm in asking but the scientists and politicians should be able to answer those very easily- eg covid was really bad v flu in April, it's improved due to measures taken but all the signs are it's picking up again as things were relaxed and so we must act again like we did then otherwise it will take off again- remembering it is now approaching winter which is the busiest season for NHS even without Covid
// Or that the reason for more cases being diagnosed, could be because of more tests being done, and does this necessarily mean that more people are contracting Corona? //
People *have* put this question to politicians, scientists, etc. The answer is that there are two separate effects and it's perfectly possible to separate them from each other. Right now we are reporting around 4,000 cases/day, which is (superficially) comparable to April but could clearly be related to a far greater rate of testing since then. On the other hand, testing capacity has been fairly flat since June (climbing up a little in September, and processed tests are increasing). As a rough estimate, though, there are only around 55% more tests per day at the moment than there were in mid-August. But in that time there has been a 400% increase in the number of positive tests, which is clearly far faster than can be accounted for solely down to increased testing. Put simply, the virus is clearly spreading more quickly now than a month ago.
(All figures based on https:/
People *have* put this question to politicians, scientists, etc. The answer is that there are two separate effects and it's perfectly possible to separate them from each other. Right now we are reporting around 4,000 cases/day, which is (superficially) comparable to April but could clearly be related to a far greater rate of testing since then. On the other hand, testing capacity has been fairly flat since June (climbing up a little in September, and processed tests are increasing). As a rough estimate, though, there are only around 55% more tests per day at the moment than there were in mid-August. But in that time there has been a 400% increase in the number of positive tests, which is clearly far faster than can be accounted for solely down to increased testing. Put simply, the virus is clearly spreading more quickly now than a month ago.
(All figures based on https:/
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